Plan B Forum

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 5:02 am**

There are no hard and fast board rules for this board.

Any issues of contention will be put to the membership for consideration, debate, and probably a poll.

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 12:21 pm**

Gee, when I saw the subject line, I thought you were making some some slangy declarative statement...

"The Board Rules!"

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 12:33 pm**

Do the Terms of Service (quoted below) apply, or not? If not, then they should be deleted. If yes, then they should be enforced, evenhandedly. That's all the rules the board needs.

I'm not arguing either way, but asking for clarification.

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Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 1:07 pm**

Hi Guin

I'm not sure which parts of the terms of service you think aren't being adhered to evenly.

Whilst Plan B offers much more in the way of freedoms than many other boards and we always try to resolve issues democratically and usually in good humour, all this said it has never been touted as a free speech board nor has it ever been said that banning is not an option.

More than one poster on his board has had off board advice from the Admins of the board and this has normally resolved the issue.

If plan b banned everyone who committed one of the offences above there would be no posters left, but where persistent slanderous and offensive behaviour continue despite warnings both private and public then we put it into the hands of the membership of the board to decide what happens next.

This has only happened once in the history of the boards is testament to the ethos of the place, don't you think?

ETA there is a difference between terms of service and rules. Legally we have to have those terms of service. The rules are in addendum to this.

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 1:16 pm**

This

You agree not to post any abusive, obscene, vulgar, slanderous, hateful, threatening, sexually-orientated or any other material that may violate any laws be it of your country, the country where “Plan B Forum” is hosted or International Law.

reads to me as a catch all to ensure that posts remain within the bounds of what is legal. A similar statement appeared in the old CSB terms of service, in spite of it being touted as a "no rules" forum. Is it being enforced? Probably not very well, since both Quad and loCA have not hesitated to engage in slander (in particular, accusations of criminal wrongdoing and professional misconduct) which would probably be actionable. The reason for not enforcing it is probably because the victims have not chosen to make an issue of it.

The right of forum admins to edit/remove material has, to my knowledge, only been exercised thus far in cases where posters have written personally identifying information about other posters

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 1:18 pm**

If plan b banned everyone who committed one of the offences above there would be no posters left,

Wrong.

Kristina and Alice would still be here....

And so would.....

uh.......

er....

well, there's....

and, uh.....

did I mention Kristina and Alice?

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 1:42 pm**

Daisy, I never said that I thought the TOS were being enforced unevenly. I said that if they were going to be enforced, they should be done evenhandedly.

I don't see a distinction between "rules" and the TOS. We all agreed to the TOS when we signed up, the TOS themselves say that if you cannot agree to be legally bound to the TOS, then don't post in the Forum. If you're saying that the adminstrators have decided not to enforce the TOS but rather to enforce the "rules" as posted above, that's the clarification I was requesting. If that is the case, then I would make sure everyone who posts here knows that and the best way to do so would be to update the FAQs to explain.

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 2:12 pm**

I don't see anything in Daisy's post about not enforcing the TOS, but I think you are stretching the meaning of what the TOS actually does. It is a requirement imposed on forum operators by hosts of forums such as these, designed to shield the host from civil and/or criminal prosecution over anything that may be posted. The words "abusive", "hateful", etc. need to be read in the context of the rest of the sentence, i.e. "that may violate any laws..." It's a liability shield, not a code of conduct, and should only be enforced as such.

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 2:14 pm**

I believe Scooter's got it...

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 9:08 pm**

It's a damn shame we even have to be considering these, after the board has been running so long.

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 9:12 pm**

Guinevere wrote:Do the Terms of Service (quoted below) apply, or not? If not, then they should be deleted. If yes, then they should be enforced, evenhandedly. That's all the rules the board needs.

I'm not arguing either way, but asking for clarification.

Of course the TOS apply, but the TOS don't cover everything.

The action that was taken after Lo continually lied and harassed me in every opportunity with no evidence to support her malicious lies was not covered in the TOS. Do you think an immediate ban was warranted at that time?

If you agree that the TOS covers that circumstance then the Board admin could have banned Lo without reference to the Board. Is that the way you want this Board to be run?

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 9:15 pm**

Lord Jim wrote:
If plan b banned everyone who committed one of the offences above there would be no posters left,
Wrong.

Kristina and Alice would still be here....

And so would.....

uh.......

er....

well, there's....

and, uh.....

did I mention Kristina and Alice?

I think I would still be here also. I don't remember posting anything

abusive, obscene, vulgar, slanderous, hateful, threatening, sexually-orientated or any other material that may violate any laws be it of your country, the country where “Plan B Forum” is hosted or International Law.

Of course I did have a history of heavy drinking so I may just not remember (although I was not a blackout drinker)

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 9:20 pm**

While I don't vote in polls, I do agree to go along with the rules that are not "hard and fast".

some ladies may like it "hard", but I'm pretty sure they don't want it "fast"
Uh oh, I think I just put myself into that category LordJim mentioned.

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 9:31 pm**

The Hen wrote:
Guinevere wrote:Do the Terms of Service (quoted below) apply, or not? If not, then they should be deleted. If yes, then they should be enforced, evenhandedly. That's all the rules the board needs.

I'm not arguing either way, but asking for clarification.

Of course the TOS apply.

I can't see that the TOS aren't being applied evenhandedly, so I am going to ask you to clarify your statement.

Can you provide an example of unbalanced application of the TOS?

Please see my response to Daisy above - I NEVER SAID THE TOS WERE BEING APPLIED UNEVENLY.

There does, however, appear to be a conflict about what applies as a rule of conduct and what does not. I am asking for clarification, because, if it is crystal clear, there are less likely to be disputes in the future. I'm asking because clarity can HELP make this board run better. It's advice I would give my own clients.

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 9:32 pm**

My post was edited. read that one instead thanks.

Posted: **Wed May 02, 2012 9:37 pm**

There is no conflict in the way the TOS are being applied Guin?

If you know of one, let us know

Posted: **Thu May 03, 2012 2:17 am**

There does, however, appear to be a conflict about what applies as a rule of conduct and what does not. I am asking for clarification, because, if it is crystal clear, there are less likely to be disputes in the future. I'm asking because clarity can HELP make this board run better. It's advice I would give my own clients.

The admins at this bbs listen to us and attempt to resolve disputes - even when a member morphs into a troll.

That is the opposite of how Gwenharryfur dealt with issues at the CSB.

I believe the 'rule of conduct' here is - simply put - to not act like Loca.

You don't have to like, agree or respect anyone here.

Just don't spend all of your time trying to make yourself the main detraction.

I find it difficult to believe that people would actually need that explained to them.

Posted: **Thu May 03, 2012 5:36 am**

If there are no hard and fast rules, then how can we agree with them?

If 'No vile untruths'* is now a rule; then, of course that must apply to everyone, and Scooter (for example) can not claim anyone has a relationship, agenda, fetish, disease, disorder, bad hair cut, etc. that hasn't been verified by the accused poster. Otherwise, it is just a debate fallacy. E.G. a fail;

fal·la·cy/ˈfaləsē/
Noun:
2.A failure in reasoning that renders an argument invalid.

Let he who has never used a debate fallacy, cast the first stone.

*not an admission my claims were untrue.

Posted: **Thu May 03, 2012 5:42 am**

Oh yeah, everyone's equally guilty, everyone just up and decided to zero in on you, why? Because they pulled your name out of a hat?

not an admission my claims were untrue

Of course not, that would require some passing acquaintance with the truth and the semblance of a conscience.

Posted: **Thu May 03, 2012 5:45 am**

If there are no hard and fast rules, then how can we agree with them?

Everyone seems prepared to agree to these rules save one...

(Earth to LoCa: you're not helping yourself with this....faux cluelessness and arrogant defiance is not going win you supporters...)

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