On yer bike mate...

[Gob]

The trans woman cyclist Emily Bridges has been blocked from participating in the women’s British National Omnium Championship on Saturday after cycling’s governing body, the UCI, ruled she was ineligible.



Bridges – who set a national junior men’s record over 25 miles in 2018 – had been due to compete against several British Olympians, including Dame Laura Kenny, in her first race in the women’s category. However the UCI ruled the 21-year-old, who began hormone therapy last year to reduce her testosterone levels, was currently not compliant with its regulations as she is still registered as a male cyclist – and therefore cannot compete as a woman until her male UCI ID expires.

The UCI’s decision came amid a growing backlash from within the sport, with the Guardian understanding that a number of female riders were talking about boycotting the event in Derby because they felt that Bridges, who was on the Great Britain Academy programme as a male rider until being dropped in 2020, had an unfair advantage.

It is understood those riders were also supported by many in the performance team at British Cycling. In a statement confirming the news, British Cycling said Bridges was “disappointed” with UCI’s decision.

“We have been in close discussions with the UCI regarding Emily’s participation this weekend and have also engaged closely with Emily and her family regarding her transition and involvement in elite competitions,” they said. “We acknowledge the decision of the UCI with regards to Emily’s participation, however we fully recognise her disappointment with today’s decision.”

In a notable change in approach, British Cycling called for a “coalition” to address transgender and non‑binary participation in elite sports – and stressed that fairness was “essential”. In a statement it said: “Transgender and non-binary inclusion is bigger than one race and one athlete – it is a challenge for all elite sports. We believe all participants within our sport deserve more clarity and understanding around participation in elite competitions and we will continue to work with the UCI on both Emily’s case and the wider situation with regards to this issue.


https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/ ... uci-ruling

[TPFKA@W]

It’s about time.

[Burning Petard]

Yes, it is about time. If the story above is complete, with the passage of some time, she will be permitted to compete in bicycle races with others of her chosen gender.

I have no dog in this fight. I am happy to see 'trans' banned or not. Just make the definition of 'man' and 'women' clear and stop fudging the rules for specific individuals or particular competition venue.

snailgate

[MajGenl.Meade]

Non-binary includes some people who are (in fact) of a gender but believe and/or feel that they are not. Fair enough. This website seems to be helpful there:

https://transequality.org/issues/resour ... supportive

One can only be grateful that (thus far) the Usain Bolts or the Roger Federers of this world have not (yet) decided they are non-binary, making rubbish of all female track and tennis competitions.

It seems that fair competition and opportunity might involve special leagues and competitions for people who were one thing but then became another, along with people who decide their own category or non-category from time to time. Although that does seem contrary to inclusionist thought.

Either that or ban all "male" and "female" sports distinctions and let everyone play as they can and will. What a drab world

[Gob]

The president of cycling’s governing body has held emergency talks with other international sports federations about creating tougher new rules for the participation of trans women in elite women’s sport “within months”.

In a notable intervention, the UCI president, David Lappartient, said cycling’s current rules, which allow trans women to compete against cis women if they reduce their testosterone to below 5 nmol/L for a period of 12 months, were “probably not enough” to ensure fair competition.

He also suggested that other sports including athletics and swimming were in a similar boat and that coordinated action might be needed.

“It is a very sensitive topic at the moment,” he said. “The question is, is there a memory from your body from what you were before? Do you have an advantage for this? Do we have a breach of fair competition?

“When you ask this question, it is not to challenge the fact that people want to transition. We fully respect that.

“But I can also really understand from ladies [who] say: ‘OK, we don’t accept this.’ At the moment, the union of women’s riders are completely against this and challenging the UCI. So we are in between.”

[BoSoxGal]

“It is a very sensitive topic at the moment,” he said. “The question is, is there a memory from your body from what you were before? Do you have an advantage for this? Do we have a breach of fair competition?”

For real?!?! OF COURSE THE BODY REMEMBERS THAT IT WENT THROUGH PUBERTY AS A MALE AND DEVELOPED A MALE’S CIRCULATORY SYSTEM, LUNG CAPACITY, BONE DENSITY, MUSCLE MASS ETC.!!

I cannot fathom how this issue is so difficult for some sports officials to grasp. I don’t believe it is I believe they are simply terrified of the woke brigade.

We need to find ways to support trans people who want to participate in sport that don’t include destroying womens sports. The NCAA recently failed miserably in this regard; hopefully others will do better.

[Big RR]

We need to find ways to support trans people who want to participate in sport that don’t include destroying womens sports. The NCAA recently failed miserably in this regard; hopefully others will do better.

Although I do think it is going to take some time.

[Bicycle Bill]

Perhaps between the UCI, WADA, and USADA, they can declare whatever hormone or other concoction the transgender persons take to reduce their testosterone to be illegal, just like they do steroids, synthetic testosterone, and other performance-enhancing drugs or supplements.  If they can fuck up careers of male cyclists like Lance Armstrong, Floyd Landis, Jan Ullrich, Stuart O'Grady, and countless others with their inflexible rules as to what a person can and cannot put into their bodies and the positively Byzantine procedures to determine and enforce Draconian penalties for the same, they should certainly be able to slam their own version of a lid on this too.

-"BB"-

[Jarlaxle]

Either stop letting men compete as women, or simply end women's sports.

[Bicycle Bill]

As long as we're talking transgenders here ...



-"BB"-

[Scooter]

So is the concern that 1 or 2 trans athletes that emerge among top contenders in a sport at any given time are going to "destroy the sport"?

Or is the unspoken fear than men pretending to be trans women are going to flood women's sports?

If the former, it's unhinged hyperbole.

If the latter, what you are saying is that you are prepared to punish trans athletes for the dishonesty of cisgender men. If that is your idea of "fairness", then that's some major transphobic bullshit, no matter how you try to dress it up.

[ex-khobar Andy]

Most sports participants - and I mean 99% or more - are regular people who want some exercise or fun on a Sunday and compete regardless of sex. For years I had a regular squash (and later racquetball after we both moved to the US) date with a woman friend who probably beat me 75% of the time. Most sport is like that and the whole question of gender is not an issue except at the top <<1% of any sport. I still have a '1986 Champs' iron-on tag which has never been used and one day I will attach it to some sweat pants after our triumph in a 'co-ed' (as it was then called) soccer league I played a minor role in. (As an aside this was in Buffalo NY and three of our players were members of the Buffalo Jills cheerleading squad and I have no doubt that there was an element of opposition distraction about our game. I digress.)

But now we have $$$ involved at the top of all sports. Maybe there are 10 million women who play tennis regularly. But there are perhaps 100 women who make a decent living at it. So one in 100,000 women tennis players - i.e. the top 0.001% - can make enough money to live on. If Lia Thomas's swimming performances are anything to go by, the very very few trans women who, like Ms Thomas and the aforementioned Ms.Bridges who honed their skills as men before transitioning may end up with the lion's share of the available $$$$.

[Gob]

So is the concern that 1 or 2 trans athletes that emerge among top contenders in a sport at any given time are going to "destroy the sport"?

Or is the unspoken fear than men pretending to be trans women are going to flood women's sports?

Or is it a new issue, one which needs addressing so that parties involved have the information and, as in all sport, rules to adhere too?

[MajGenl.Meade]

Scooter clearly wants to avoid the implications of "non-binary", one of the groups that the Alphabet Brigade includes in their umbrella of identity. Perhaps these are the ones he refers to as dishonest cisgender men (or as we call them, men), although that rather disses the women, no?

And yes, the likes of Caster Semenya (obviously male-awaiting-reassignment-which-won't-happen-I'd-guess) should not be allowed to compete in events for women. Unfairness to one woman athlete is unfairness to all. And vice versa.

[Bicycle Bill]

And yes, the likes of Caster Semenya (obviously male-awaiting-reassignment-which-won't-happen-I'd-guess) should not be allowed to compete in events for women. Unfairness to one woman athlete is unfairness to all. And vice versa.

Boy, talk about euphemisms!  Call it like it is — getting his twig and berries cut off.

"Awaiting reassignment" sounds more like a military term used when a soldier has been removed from his original unit for, let's say, medical reasons and hasn't yet gotten orders returning him to duty or posting him to another unit.

-"BB"-

[ex-khobar Andy]

Caster Semenya is female and was so assigned at birth. She carries an unusual set of chromosomes but she is what she is and there has been no medical interference to change her sex. I don't know how common her specific chromosonal make up is, but I suspect that she is no more a biological outlier than, say, Shaquille O'Neal.

[BoSoxGal]

Good article about Semenya and the wider controversy here: https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/20/spor ... eters.html

From the article:

Dr. Eric Vilain, a medical geneticist from U.C.L.A., told my colleague Juliet Macur last year that “if we push this argument, anyone declaring a female gender can compete as a woman.”

He added, “We’re moving toward one big competition, and the very predictable result of that competition is that there will be no women winners.”

[MajGenl.Meade]

Caster Semenya is female and was so assigned at birth. She carries an unusual set of chromosomes but she is what she is and there has been no medical interference to change her sex. I don't know how common her specific chromosonal make up is, but I suspect that she is no more a biological outlier than, say, Shaquille O'Neal.

Yes we've known all that for quite a time (except your suspicion). However, in a different milieu Semenya would have "come out" as male trans a long time ago. That's why I put it as an event "in waiting". It hasn't happened (and I don't think will). Cost alone probably prohibits but there's a suspicion it was not undertaken before because it would ruin his ability to beat women in races.

Sexual assignment at birth is precisely the problem for some individuals. They are told what they are when (as it turns out) they ain't. Don't know what that has to do with Shaq.

[ex-khobar Andy]

According to this Danish study the incidence of the 46 XY karyotype (Semenya's diagnosis) is about 64 in 1,000,000 women. If the world population is 8 billion then that's 4 billion women in total and thus 4 x 64,000 = about quarter of a million with this specific karyotype.

According to this site there are about 2800 7 footers in the world. They cite no reference but several sites list the same number. So Shaq is more of a biological outlier than is Semenya. In round numbers he is about 100 times rarer.

I don't know how good these numbers are but it's the best I could come up with the assistance of Mr Google.

I'm not of course saying that this is an answer, but it's a 'be careful what you wish for' thing. The sensible thing would be for Ms Bridges and Ms Thomas to live their lives as women totally undisturbed with full human rights etc but to voluntarily recognize that they have certain advantages over most women athletes WHICH ARE NO-ONE'S FAULT and accordingly they will take part in sports the way that most of us do - for fun and necessary exercise - and not at high competitive levels. But wouldn't Shaq then have to say the same: he can glory in his God-given height but really he wouldn't play in the NBA because he would have an advantage over more usually-sized opponents.

[MajGenl.Meade]

Except he's not pretending to be short

It certainly would be out of order for him to have tried to play in the WNBA because he felt that he wasn't a man. It's all a bit of a dickotomy