Bend the rules a bit?

[Gob]

Religious leaders have been accused of a lack of flexibility after evicting a yoga class from a church hall because of its links to "alternative spiritualities".


Teacher Naomi Hayama, 39, has been helping students stretch and relax with twice-weekly classes for the last nine years. But church chiefs have now decided the sessions are too "spiritual" - despite apparently never observing a class, which students claim has no religious content. Ms Hayama has until the end of the month to find a new home for her classes after the priest and the council at the church refused to back down. She said: "They are trying to say it is a spiritual practise but my classes are not.

"I respect people who are religious but I am not. That's what attracted me to yoga - you don't have to be religious to teach it. "My students are puzzled and outraged as well. "My class is a physical exercise which is about relaxation and breathing and it's a healthy thing to do." Ms Hayama teaches around 600 students at classes all over her home city of Bristol. But she has been told she is no longer welcome at St Michael and All Angels Church in the Bishopston, where she teaches around 30 pupils.

After hearing she was to be booted out, she collected more than 500 signatures pleading with the church council to change its decision. But Reverend James Stevenson and the Parish of Bishopston and St Andrew's decided the buildings should be used for Christian acts of worship and nothing of a spiritual nature "outside of Christ". Ms Hayama added: "The students enjoyed coming to the church and now being told they are not really welcome. "Many of them have written in to the church to try and change their minds but they are being really stubborn about it. "The decision was made without seeing my class, which is what I have a real problem with. "Seeing it and deciding it's not appropriate is one thing but to do no investigation and just talk about yoga's background is another."

Rev Stevenson, who claims half the UK's churches would prohibit yoga, said: "We understand yoga is practised as a physical exercise and discipline but it's definitely a spiritual act whose roots are not Christ centred. "We are confident we have acted legally and fairly in handling this matter but we understand why the students are upset. "One student of the class said everyone he had spoken to had viewed it as a ridiculous decision but every church leader I've spoken to completely understands this decision. "It is a beautiful building with under-floor heating - it's the perfect place for a yoga class and we understand that people are upset."

He added that Ms Hayama is a member of the British Wheel of Yoga - an organisation the priest says calls on followers to be taught the spiritual philosophy of yoga. He said that message was not "discredited" on Ms Hayama's website and added: "We think there will be lots of people who think we are not making a very nice decision but we are trying to make the decision in the nicest way possible." But locals are still upset, and took to the petition to voice their upset. Susan Blair, from Bristol wrote: "It is ridiculous! Yoga is yoga, it has nothing to do with religion! Let them continue to have their yoga lessons in your church. Why would you drive people away from God's home??" Ursula Dunne, from Glastonbury, added: "This is such a tragedy. Isn't it time for understanding and tolerance? "In terms of alternative spirituality it seems to me there are many paths to God not one only and most people attending a yoga class will go for the physical exercise and well-being. Saddest of all that an offer to observe a class was declined."

[Econoline]

Why would you drive people away from God's home??

This.

[oldr_n_wsr]

It's the churches building. They can allow, or not allow as they see fit.

[Guinevere]

Why would you drive people away from God's home??

This.

Exactly.

But the again, I imagine the philosophies and spirituality of yoga probably intimidated those small-minded so-called Christians.

[MajGenl.Meade]

I wonder if the unpaid rent caused any concern?

Parish of Bishopston & St Andrews
Yesterday at 4:41am ·

You may have read in the Bristol Evening Post about a decision by this parish’s council to cease bookings for a yoga class at St Michael’s.

All of our buildings are open to and used by a wide range of groups from the local community. The primary purpose of these buildings is the worship of God as revealed in the person of Jesus Christ. Yoga means the union of ‘mind, body and spirit’. By definition, therefore, Yoga is a spiritual activity whose roots are not Christ centred.

We are confident we have acted legally and have waived the last 9 months of Naomi’s fees, amounting to nearly £1000. We are surprised at the actions currently being taken. Whilst we understand that Naomi would not agree with our decision, in December 2014 she informed us that we had reached an agreeable compromise with regard to her notice period.

[rubato]

Religious leaders have been accused of a lack of flexibility after evicting a yoga class from a church hall because of its links to "alternative spiritualities".


Rev Stevenson, who claims half the UK's churches would prohibit yoga..."

Only half?

"... everyone he had spoken to had viewed it as a ridiculous decision but every church leader I've spoken to completely understands this decision. ..."

You see? Not half, all of them.


yrs,
rubato

[Big RR]

"meade"--are "fees" the same as rent? If so, why would they have let her run up 9 moths arrears in her rent? It doesn't make much sense.

As for the OP, the church should be free to do what it wants with its buildings as long as it is consistent with the lease entered into, but this:

church chiefs have now decided the sessions are too "spiritual" - despite apparently never observing a class

really does seem strange. If they never saw a class, exactly what are they basing their conclusion on?

Again, they can do what they want, and everyone has the right to be unreasonable and stupid, but that doesn't mean they should.

[Big RR]

rubato--

You see? Not half, all of them.

I would bet the ones he talked to would be from that fabled half of which he spoke and is not a representative sample of Christian churches or beliefs. if he didn't even go to the class to see what was going on, I doubt he would seek out the opinions of those who might disagree with him, lest he be confused by facts.

[MajGenl.Meade]

"meade"--are "fees" the same as rent? If so, why would they have let her run up 9 moths arrears in her rent? It doesn't make much sense.......

......If they never saw a class, exactly what are they basing their conclusion on?

Golly gee, Big RR. Why would anyone let anyone owe back-rent - how does that happen? I guess you think they should have tossed her out earlier, is that it?

What are they basing their conclusion on? D'ya think there's a clue in their statement maybe?

Yoga means the union of ‘mind, body and spirit’. By definition, therefore, Yoga is a spiritual activity whose roots are not Christ centred

As for the galvanized one, apparently there's difficulty understanding the difference between "endorse" and "understand". Dictionaries all round!

[Gob]

My first thought was ; "I wonder if the yoga classes were getting better attendance than the church services?"

[Gob]

I wonder if the unpaid rent caused any concern?

Parish of Bishopston & St Andrews
We are confident we have acted legally and have waived the last 9 months of Naomi’s fees, amounting to nearly £1000. We are surprised at the actions currently being taken. Whilst we understand that Naomi would not agree with our decision, in December 2014 she informed us that we had reached an agreeable compromise with regard to her notice period.

Hmm... he doesn't say that they were a debt, does he? He says "we've waived them."

But, if it was about the debt, why does he say;

We would never say to anyone 'you must not do yoga' but it has an alternative spirituality. I'm sure it has lots of health benefits but we have to have integrity about how we use our worship spaces.

There will be Christians who disagree with us but this is a view that's widely held by many Christians and the Diocese of Bristol have said they full support our decision and that yoga sits uncomfortably in a consecrated space.

– REVEREND WAYNE MASSEY

[BoSoxGal]

Church fees for use of space aren't generally considered the same way that rent is - they are often waived, for instance, in case-specific circumstances.

They probably burn incense, play Indian music and chant 'Om' - some blue haired ladies probably happened by the class and were spooked.

[Big RR]

Meade--golly gee, Big RR. Why would anyone let anyone owe back-rent - how does that happen? I guess you think they should have tossed her out earlier, is that it?[/quote]

Absolutely, if they were concerned about the back rent I do not think they would not have let the charges mount up for 9 months (I know in my church it is a policy to get people out after they are behind one or two payments; any more requires trustee approval and exceptional circumstances. And if not, then they really didn't care about it did they?

Church fees for use of space aren't generally considered the same way that rent is - they are often waived, for instance, in case-specific circumstances

True, but most churches (I know mine does. e.g.) have a policy where they either charge rental fees or offer the space free. And most time the space is offered free when it is being used for a public benefit, while commercial and personal uses (and I think a yoga class is a commercial one)> Indeed, I have never heard of the church assessing a rental fee and then waiving it later, except in cases where the renter has some significant financial problems.

[oldr_n_wsr]

They are probably waiving the fee as a goodwill gesture (aka compensation) for the disruption of the yoga class having to move.

I'm guessing AA would not be welcomed in this church either.

[Big RR]

Maybe, maybe not. We have a number of AA meetings in our church and one thing I respect them for is that they will not accept waiving of any rental fees, they insist on paying their own way. It's nice to see a group dedicated to its principles.

[oldr_n_wsr]

In addition to the 12 Steps, we have the 12 Traditions.
Tradition 7: Every A.A. group ought to be fully self-supporting, declining outside contributions.
Waiving the rent is considered an outside contribution by many AA groups (ours included).

[wesw]

well, I heard that there was a rash of purloined pic-a-nic baskets....

ah boo boo, the verger will never know.....