Marriage, Procreation, & Related Topics

[SisterMaryFellatio]

Good thing, that's a fairy tale only bigots against religion believe in.

Never mind, you're not her da, anywayZ.

WTF.....Explain that last sentence thats just plain fuckin rude and uncalled for!

[loCAtek]

E-hem, the birth-father/parents decide on involuntary baptism, which is held by the Catholic Church (which shielded pedophiles) as was Gob's protest (regardless that's an over-generalized myth).

Gob is/was neither Catholic nor parent to the Hatch which is not rude, but fact


...thX for asking..

[Sean]

Comments like that are the reason I have this twat on ignore... I'm guessing the excuse is that it was either a 'joke' or something to do with short term memory loss...

And no, I don't believe in being nice to complete fucktards just because it's Christmas. I'm no hypocrite...

[Lord Jim]

I'm very reluctant to wade into this, (and I do mean very) but I have to say that I also found the remark uncalled for, gratuitous, and given the context not even relevant.

Here's what Strop said:

'm so glad that any kid the Hatch has

In other words, he wasn't talking about Hatch being baptized....

He was talking about future children that she might have....

And frankly, the decision to baptize them wont be Strop's or Hen's or anybody else's besides Hatch and her child's father...

Now, Strop obviously seems quite confident that Hatch will remain an atheist, but he has no way to control or guarantee that; ultimately that is a choice she will make for herself....

Also, the problem of child molestation within the Priesthood is not a "myth"....Nor is the problem of it being covered up...Numerous court settlements attest to this....It's a great shame for the Church to bear, and even if it's been exaggerated, (which it certainly has; especially when you see remarks that seem to imply that all priests are potential child molesters) and even if it may have been just as prevalent in other professions that just haven't received as much publicity, that certainly doesn't make the fact that it went on at all any less of a disgrace.

[@meric@nwom@n]

Good thing, that's a fairy tale only bigots against religion believe in.

Never mind, you're not her da, anywayZ.

WTF.....Explain that last sentence thats just plain fuckin rude and uncalled for!

Your husband is right, that ignore button is a great thing.

[loCAtek]

Wow, I'm being ignored? You couldn't tell that by the comments, but I'm glad it feeds that need for power, for'ya. For those you listening, or pretending not to...


'Kay, I missed that Gob was talking about his grandkids...

However, the myth is not that there are pedophiles in the clergy but that you'll find them only in the clergy.
That's a twist of religious bigotry. If someone felt so strongly that they should keep their kids (or grandkids) away from occupations that held pedophiles, then they wouldn't send their child to doctors, teachers, nannies, entertainers, boy/girl scouts etc. and just lock them in the family basement...
No wait, child abuse is also committed by the very parents of the children! Drop your kids down a well to protect them, and brick up the mouth.

[Gob]

However, the myth is not that there are pedophiles in the clergy but that you'll find them only in the clergy.

And who has been spreading that myth?

That would be ...errmmmm.... no one. It's just a strawman you created to try and hide your guilt.

[rubato]

You aren't being as humorous as you think you are. There are places where unwanted children are dropped off. One of those places is a nursing home, there are many, that specialized in taking care of children.

We give thousands to Planned Parenthood to avoid this sort of problem before it happens. About $1,500/yr for the past decade. And, the in the practice of her profession, my wife also frequently provides assistance to those plainly unable to be parents to avoid that outcome. How many 15 -18 year old girls, in the company of their mother's often, has she put on some form of birth control? I'll ask.

My good humor is conditioned by a clear conscience brought about by appropriate action in service of the right things.




yrs,
rubato

[loCAtek]

However, the myth is not that there are pedophiles in the clergy but that you'll find them only in the clergy.

...and the whole quote went;

However, the myth is not that there are pedophiles in the clergy but that you'll find them only in the clergy.
That's a twist of religious bigotry. If someone felt so strongly that they should keep their kids (or grandkids) away from occupations that held pedophiles, then they wouldn't send their child to doctors, teachers, nannies, entertainers, boy/girl scouts etc. and just lock them in the family basement...
No wait, child abuse is also committed by the very parents of the children! Drop your kids down a well to protect them, and brick up the mouth.

Then why spare your kids/grand kids the church if you fear the pedophile clergy, if you're not consistent in fearing pedophilia everywhere it's found?

[alice]

Um uh, I don't think the God parents need to prove they are Catholic.

My guess it that it depends in the priest; I recall one priest telling me that one of the godparents had to be a confirmed catholic, but I (a non catholic) was never asked about my religion by the priests in the three baptisms I was a godparent at (and i did go to an orientation once).

Well I work for an Anglican Vicar so we're a bit less rigid - any child can be baptised, Godparents are required to have been baptised themselves however if they haven't been we will still allow them to stand as sponsors for the child what they cannot do is make the promises to God on behalf of the child during the baptism ceremony. Whether the parents are married or not doesn't even factor into it.

Maybe it is the individual priest, or the area. I am a Godparent and the subject didn't come up when I was asked. My God children are adults now.
However, about 12 months ago a young couple here, all of 17 and 16 (son and girlfriend of someone I know) had a baby. They moved in together - in 'sin' - after she found out she was pregnant. They had no intentions of marrying (and in fact have recently split up -so there never will be a wedding) The girlfriend was a non-practicing Catholic and wanted the baby baptised in a big ceremony, and nominated godparents etc. The church had no problems with the baptising, but would not allow the nominated Godparents because when they were asked they stated they weren't Catholic. The young couple then nominated an alternative set of godparents, who said they were catholic, but non-practicing. This was acceptable.

The theoretical purpose of being a "God parent" is, in case the parents come to be out of the picture (killed or die early or whatever), the Godparents are expected to ensure that the child will [continue to be] raised as a Catholic/Christian. Indeed, I think it was customary in past times for the God parents to be named in the parents' wills as the ones who would raise the kid in the event of their untimely demise.
Thus it is entirely appropriate for the Church to confirm their bona fides prior to the baptism.
Obviously, the role of Godparents has evolved into a symbolic one, indicating nothing more than that the parents like and respect the selectees.

As for godparents, I think some cultures recognize it as a choice of guardian should both parents die. My wife's family is Puerto Rican, and I have heard of cases (at least through the late 60s/early 70s) where godparents will get custody over blood relatives based on this presumption.

When I was first asked to be Godparent by my close friends many years ago, I proudly accepted 'cos it always seemed really cool to 'be' a Godparent. She asked if I knew what the responsibility was - I answered that if anything happened to them I would take on my Godchild's upbringing. She said no - the godparent is responsible for the religious upbringing of the child. I found this odd, and out of character for my friend - she hadn't ever previously indicated, in words, behaviour or otherwise that she followed any religion at all, and I therefore concluded that it was just one of those trendy 'things' you thought you had to do as one of the' ceremonies' of having a baby, without really expecting anything out of it. So i didn't give it any more thought. Thankfully I was right in that particular case, and any additional contribution or responsibility I've had has been zero. I'm a 'godparent' as a proud name 'thing you do', but that's all!

My kids aren't baptised or any other religious 'ceremony', and they have no godparents. My personal view was that it was not for me to force them into any particular religious path, and therefore baptising or otherwise 'branding' them into any particular religion was a decision for them to make if they ever felt so strongly about it. My personal view was/is that my role as a parent, as such, was to help them understand something about the different religious viewpoints they would be introduced to in their young growing up years; open their understanding to the fact that there were also other viewpoints; and then allow them, if they wanted, to explore those viewpoints for themselves.

However, my role as a parent is, of course, to provide the best upbringing and best foundation I can for my child. Therefore if I had been very strongly religious, and believed that my religion was a foundation and comfort to my life and my safe and secure passage at the end of my life, then I'm sure I would have tried to ensure that my children were given that protection from evil, that foundation and comfort, right from birth. So in that case I would have baptised them (or whatever ceremony befitted my religion).
Each to their own

[loCAtek]

Yes, to each their own. I believe the tradition of baptizing babies, came from the times when it was never certain your children would reach adulthood to decide such things. At the same time, the Catholic Church believed you couldn't enter Heaven unless you were baptized. So, as a precaution, parents would have their children baptized.

Also, I heard something interesting from a Military Chaplin; and that's in a dire circumstance anyone can baptize another person. If your child is very ill, or hurt and you can't get to help in time to save them; say devotedly and sincerely the Trinitarian formula, "in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" while making the sign of the cross on the child's forehead.

[Gob]

I'm a god parent to two handsome young men Tom and Jack, sons of my lovely friends Alan and Jo, I'm godfather to two nieces and a nephew, and a great niece.

However, the myth is not that there are pedophiles in the clergy but that you'll find them only in the clergy.

...and the whole quote went;

An yet no one, NO ONE, has stated that pedophiles exist only in the church..

Whoosssshh..

Lo's shot her mouth off without thinking yet again, and yet again is blabbering like an idiot to try and hide her culpability...

[Sean]

I'm godfather to two nieces and a nephew, and a great niece.

So what's wrong with the other two nieces?

[Gob]

Not so great...

[Sean]

Shame...

[loCAtek]

An yet no one, NO ONE, has stated that pedophiles exist only in the church..
...

No, no one has. Yet, you use that as an excuse to bash religion.

[Crackpot]

No he uses it to wind up the easily wound up.

[loCAtek]

Well yea, but so sayin' it's a power trip; not a theological point.

[dgs49]

I can only assume that selecting someone to be "godparent" in Australia means something quite a bit different than in non-penal colonies. A misanthropic atheist. Curious, indeed.

As for the response that "NO ONE, has stated that pedophiles exist only in the church..." I might only point out that EVERY FUCKING TIME on this (and other) boards that the words "child" and "church" have come in the same post, that responder has followed it up immediately with a sarcastic remark about child abuse by clergy. The same automatic, neurotic remark does not follow mention of kids and schools, sports, doctors, or in any other context.

One can only assume that the responder has what we Americans call a "bug up his ass" about the Catholic church; that is to say he has some sort of an unresolved conflict with no palatable way of resolving it, so he salves his own anxiety - whatever it is based on - by attempting to insult those who care not a whit about his opinion. Rather sad, really.

[Gob]

An yet no one, NO ONE, has stated that pedophiles exist only in the church..
...

No, no one has. Yet, you use that as an excuse to bash religion.

Are you being dumb for teh sake of it?

Ok, explain to me please, how I use the fact that no one has stated that pedophiles exist only in the church, in order to bash religion.

Or in fact, can you make any sense out what you have just said? Because I'm fucked if I can.