You Sad Pathetic Man...

[Gob]

I and I ina Babylon, Rasta far I!

One love, one heart
Let's get together and feel all right
Hear the children crying (One love)
Hear the children crying (One heart)
Sayin', "Give thanks and praise to the Lord and I will feel all right."
Sayin', "Let's get together and feel all right."
Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa

Let them all pass all their dirty remarks (One love)
There is one question I'd really love to ask (One heart)
Is there a place for the hopeless sinner
Who has hurt all mankind just to save his own?
Believe me

One love, one heart
Let's get together and feel all right
As it was in the beginning (One love)
So shall it be in the end (One heart)
Alright, "Give thanks and praise to the Lord and I will feel all right."
"Let's get together and feel all right."
One more thing

Let's get together to fight this Holy Armageddon (One love)
So when the Man comes there will be no, no doom (One song)
Have pity on those whose chances grow thinner
There ain't no hiding place from the Father of Creation

Sayin', "One love, one heart
Let's get together and feel all right."
I'm pleading to mankind (One love)
Oh, Lord (One heart) Whoa.

"Give thanks and praise to the Lord and I will feel all right."
Let's get together and feel all right.

"Give thanks and praise to the Lord and I will feel all right."
Let's get together and feel all right.

[rubato]

Great song. And it grew by the hearing of it.

Originally the message was meant as "one love between Africans around the world" but when people heard it they knew it was really a more powerful and more universal message than that.

Remarkable man. Marley was anything but articulate in interviews. Often very stoned and confused. But his songwriting captured the cry of the human heart as few ever have. Everywhere in the world people hear him and 'get' it immediately. And he was one of the most powerful performers I've ever seen. (twice)

yrs,
rubato

[oldr_n_wsr]

If I were ever to become convinced that was really the way of things, I would become so despondent, that I wouldn't be able to get out of bed in the morning...

Welcome to the world of this alcoholic.

If there ever was a depressing thought, it is the notion that nothing that anyone has achieved throughout their life - not their work, not their friendships, not even their children - are seen as being of any value without the existence of an afterlife. If that is what someone really believes, then why not shoot themselves in the head and bypass this utterly pointless part of their existence and get right to the main event?

I don't believe LordJim said anything of the sort. I am sure he is quite proud and loving and giving and "doing the next right thing" for most he knows and all he loves. That does not diminish his view that he hopes (has faith in) that there is "more" after he dies. but I'm sure he will expand on this and correct me if I am wrong in my assumption.

I wish I had faith.
Might help me in my struggles.

[Sue U]

If there is nothing beyond what we have on this mortal coil, then we might as well all do the Jim Jones number and suck down the Kool Aid..

I, for one, would never want to live in a world where there was nothing beyond simple "80 years and out" mundane existence...

I absolutely refuse to embrace the depressing and despair ridden view that after you die, you " take a dirt nap for all eternity" and "all you get is non-existence"....

If I were ever to become convinced that was really the way of things, I would become so despondent, that I wouldn't be able to get out of bed in the morning...

If I were ever persuaded of that view, I would become completely dysfunctional....I would curl up naked in a fetal position, and moan mournfully...

I have never been able to understand why the prospect of death is so intolerable, or why one would need the promise of jam tomorrow in order to be functional today. Personally, I find a great deal of comfort in knowing there is ultimately an end to life, my own included. The only afterlife I wish for is the legacy I leave in this world, and I agree completely with Scooter:

How about seeing value in the difference we are able to make on this earth while we are here? How about seeing ourselves live on through the lives of our children whom we have helped shaped, through the kind words and deeds that have made a difference in someone's life, through whatever we have accomplished that has left this world better than when we came into it?

Perhaps rather than trying to find meaning for our existence in an afterlife, we create meaning in our lives in the here and now.

Also an excellent point:

And if whether I believe in an afterlife or not would make a difference in the way I am living my life in the here and now, then there is something wrong with me.

[Crackpot]

While I wouldn't go as far as Jim I understand the sentiment. If out god/and eternal reward the argument for acting outside of your own self interest is severely diminished. Without god The Randian way of life makes a lot more sense because how else do we define "good" than what serves our own goals/interests why sacrifice for something you wil not see the rewards for? What purpose will it serve?

[Sue U]

I don't believe in God or an afterlife and yet every day I manage to be a more or less productive member of society; I find enormous personal satisfaction in righting wrongs, improving my community, and making the world a bit more just for everyone. When I am gone, I hope that people will still sometimes remember me for my service, or even if they never knew or remembered me, that people will continue to benefit from my small contributions to the development of the law. I may not live long enough to see my grandchildren, but I am content in seeing my own children raised to be good citizens contributing to the betterment of the world, and hope that my descendants each leave this plane a better place than they found it -- just as my ancestors had hoped for me. To me, that's all there is, and all I'd want.

[Crackpot]

I don't doubt you do. But I wonder where we'd be without a concept of a god or afterlife. The ability to work for the greater good outside ones own interests seems to directly spring from those concepts. Perhaps it's merely the quest for an ideal but knowing the disinterested self interest we are capable of makes me think of the truth of the saying "Even if God didn't exist it would be necessary to invent one"

[Sue U]

I have to disagree. On the whole, I find people are plenty interested in working for the common good even if it doesn't maximize their own individual self-interest. Humans are social animals that are programmed by evolution to live in cooperative groups; it's just what we do. It's not the fear of a punishing god or a reward in heaven that motivates the vast majority of people to do the right thing; it's the simple desire for approval from those around you. Of course there are misanthropes and sociopaths, but they are a pretty small minority.

[Gob]

Of course there are misanthropes and sociopaths, but they are a pretty small minority.

We call ours Dave.

[Crackpot]

DPM

[Crackpot]

Hey don't leave rube out

[RayThom]

I, too, am an avowed Atheist. God does not, and will not ever exist for me. So I do not need, nor want, to have a belief in the existence of a god as a motivator for doing right or wrong, or for my eternal salvation.

What I do in "the here and now" is all that is necessary. That's the essence of humanity... and that is my legacy. Best of all, I know my death will not be in vain. I will live on forever in the hearts and minds of those who most remember me.

"God is a concept by which we measure our pain." John Lennon

DIXI

[Crackpot]

. I will live on forever in the hearts and minds of those who most remember me.

Unclear on the concept?

[Econoline]

Of course there are misanthropes and sociopaths, but they are a pretty small minority.

We call ours Dave.

Hey don't leave rube out

Or Jarl (check out his signature).

[rubato]

I don't doubt you do. But I wonder where we'd be without a concept of a god or afterlife. The ability to work for the greater good outside ones own interests seems to directly spring from those concepts.... "

It probably springs from genetics. A lone human in the savannah had little chance against lions and leopards but groups of people could defend themselves. Also women during pregnancy and childbirth require the support of a community for food and protection so that the ability and drive to work for the community existed long before humans started inventing gods.

yrs,
rubato

[rubato]

I have to disagree. On the whole, I find people are plenty interested in working for the common good even if it doesn't maximize their own individual self-interest. Humans are social animals that are programmed by evolution to live in cooperative groups; it's just what we do. It's not the fear of a punishing god or a reward in heaven that motivates the vast majority of people to do the right thing; it's the simple desire for approval from those around you. Of course there are misanthropes and sociopaths, but they are a pretty small minority.

Well said.

In fact the number who completely lack the inclination or ability to empathize is very small.


yrs,
rubato

[oldr_n_wsr]

It probably springs from genetics. A lone human in the savannah had little chance against lions and leopards but groups of people could defend themselves. Also women during pregnancy and childbirth require the support of a community for food and protection so that the ability and drive to work for the community existed long before humans started inventing gods.

And when did man start inventing Gods? Before or after they came together to protect thte pregnant? Got a timeline?

[Lord Jim]

And when did man start inventing Gods? Before or after they came together to protect thte pregnant? Got a timeline?

I really hope rube answers that...

The funniest stuff I ever read on this board are rube's thigh slappingly hilarious forays into the topic of history, and I could use a good belly laugh...

[Andrew D]

The funniest stuff I ever read on this board are rube's thigh slappingly hilarious forays into the topic of history ....

That's only because you can't see the humour in your knee-bending Reaganolatry.

By the way, rubato's conjectures self-evidently concern prehistoric matters. Your derision of those conjectures as "forays into the topic of history" is yet another

Ah, forget it. Better people than I have said it before. You didn't listen then ....

[Lord Jim]

You should identify with that guy....

He's naked....