Two Christmas's

[wesw]

yes, and just as interpretations have gradually and/or radically changed from what was to what is, the same process can happen in reverse.

do you support the current perversion of the commerce clause , sue?


and just as popular support enlarged the role of the federal govt over time, popular support exists now for devolution of that power and large role back to the states. I offer the undeniable trend in the senate , house, govermorships and statehouses as evidence of this truth.

so the same living constitution that brought us to where we are now, will bring us to where we will be tomorrow , and that place is likely to be far different from the place we are today. the pendulum tends to swing back and forth, if allowed to swing honestly, and it is swinging away from your side at the moment.

your side has given us trump. Obama has given us trump. your side has increased the demand for guns, thru regulation and thru weakness. Obama has increased the amount of guns in this country thru dishonest demagoguery and thru his his failure to secure our borders and his failure to face our enemies.

you are defeating yourself

I have often heard of your respect and admiration for Jefferson, or long tom, as you call him. I don t see it.

so speak of repealing the 2nd amendment and speak of Jefferson in the same breathe if you must, but don t expect to be taken seriously in one or the other of these positions. at least not by me.

but I m uneducated and stupid so my opinions are invalid and worthless and I should just stay silent while my betters debate these things, I know .

I know.....

happy holidays

rabblebato

[Big RR]

your side has given us trump. Obama has given us trump.

certainly the dissatisfaction of some with the political establishment in general, and the perceived (or actual or a bit of both) inability to get anything done, has given us Trump. It's not the dems or left or Obama alone, its the establishment republicans and right as well. It's not the first time we had a ridiculous loudmouth pandering for public support (and sometimes they win, remember Jesse Ventura?), and it won't be the last, but as always we will get the government we deserve.

[wesw]

true RR, but The Body is in a league of his own....

[Big RR]

Different from the toupee/comb over?

[Scooter]

I think now New Years day is the Feast of the Solemnity of Mary in the RC church--not sure about the orthodox churches. And I don't know of any protestant churches that celebrate new years day as a day of religious significance.

In the RCC it is the Solemnity of Mary, Mother of God. Christmas and January 1 are the only remaining non-Sunday holy days of obligation in the RCC - days where it is required to attend Mass. Given the devotion to Mary in Orthodox Churches, they may have a similar feast in their calendar, which of course would not be January 1, but whatever is 8 days after Christmas in the Julian Calendar.

Many other Christian denominations celebrate January 1 as the Naming of Jesus, which is of course one of the other rituals of the 8th day.

[Big RR]

Scooter--have the feasts of the immaculate conception (which was this week as I heard on the radio) and assumption of Mary been removed from the RC holy days list?

eta: Ditto for All Saints Day (day after Halloween) and whatever they call 40 days after easter?

[oldr_n_wsr]

Big RR
Not that I know of, as I have not observed Catholic Holy days in many years. But my dad has and still does and does attend church on those Holy days you mentioned. Don't know if it out of obligation or just old habit. I will have to ask next time I talk to him.

[Scooter]

Hmmm, I hadn't thought before about whether it might vary by country. Canon Law sets out several holy days of obligation but also allows a country's conference of bishops either to dispense with some or transfer them to a Sunday. So what I said only applies in Canada, where as I think of it some of the remaining ones have been transferred to a Sunday, and dispensations granted for others.

[MajGenl.Meade]

Here's a thing from some Roman chat room:

I don't know precisely why this particular one was changed. If it is to be celebrated at all, of course it should be celebrated 8 days after Christmas, since that would be when it occurred. After all, we don't change Pentecost to 70, 80 or 100 days after Easter, do we? Changing it to another day would be ludicrous.

And it often was celebrated as a feast in honour of Our Lady as well - read the end of this Catholic Encyclopedia article.

I did grow up with it being celebrated as the Feast of the Circumcision, at least when I was very young, but there was never, to my recollection, a big fuss made about it. Can't even recall whether it was a Holy Day of Obligation or not. Being New Years Day, I suspect not

[Big RR]

Interesting Scooter; I did not know that the days varied from country to country (and apparently even among individual dioceses according to your link. Not being catholic, most of my knowledge comes from helping friends memorize their catechism many years ago.

Meade--not sure what change the quote is referring to--is the Jan 1 holiday changed to a Sunday observance in that country?

[Sue U]

yes, and just as interpretations have gradually and/or radically changed from what was to what is, the same process can happen in reverse.

No, it can't. There's 226 years of Constitutional jurisprudence that is the law of the land and the doctrine of stare decisis makes any bit of it incredibly difficult to overturn.

do you support the current perversion of the commerce clause , sue?

What do you mean by "perversion"?

and just as popular support enlarged the role of the federal govt over time, popular support exists now for devolution of that power and large role back to the states. I offer the undeniable trend in the senate , house, govermorships and statehouses as evidence of this truth.

You're going to have to be more specific than that. What "popular support"? Devolution of what power to the states? What "trend in the senate , house, govermorships and statehouses" are you talking about, and what is it supposed to be "evidence" of?

so the same living constitution that brought us to where we are now, will bring us to where we will be tomorrow , and that place is likely to be far different from the place we are today. the pendulum tends to swing back and forth, if allowed to swing honestly, and it is swinging away from your side at the moment.

What in the world are you babbling about, and what do you think my "side" is?

your side has given us trump. Obama has given us trump. your side has increased the demand for guns, thru regulation and thru weakness. Obama has increased the amount of guns in this country thru dishonest demagoguery and thru his his failure to secure our borders and his failure to face our enemies.

you are defeating yourself

I have often heard of your respect and admiration for Jefferson, or long tom, as you call him. I don t see it.

Look closer.

so speak of repealing the 2nd amendment and speak of Jefferson in the same breathe if you must, but don t expect to be taken seriously in one or the other of these positions. at least not by me.

First, one has nothing to do with the other. Second, I really don't give a rat's ass what you think ...

but I m uneducated and stupid so my opinions are invalid and worthless and I should just stay silent while my betters debate these things, I know .

... although that's not even close to the reason why.

I know.....

happy holidays

rabblebato

[wesw]

darn, i m just put right back in my proper little place aren t i?

thanks for playing.

[Sue U]

Sack up, princess.

[wesw]

your rebuttal was so weak that I saw no need to reply.

I ll dumb it down a bit for you next time so that you can follow along better

[Sue U]

Good luck with that.

[wesw]

ok, that was funny....

seriously sue, merry Christmas, happy Hanukah , lovely pagan ritual, and all that to you

I m tired of bad blood. what say we bury the hatchet?

...no..., you (italics) dig the hole and I ll (italics) hold the hatchet....

[Guinevere]

Sack up, princess.

Hey, hey, heeeyyyyyyyy. I'm the princess around here and I've got the tiara to prove it. Plus a lovely new coach bag (what you may call a sack)

[MajGenl.Meade]

...or a militia if you've a mind to.

[wesw]

yeah, I already told scooter that I don t wear tiaras

I don t take off my tin foil hat for anything.....

[wesw]

meade, if you peruse the Eat Lead Thread, you will see definition number 3 from the 1968 world book dictionaries that supports my use of militia.