Faith killers

[Gob]

A Pennsylvania couple said to reject medicine in favour of faith healing have been sentenced to up to seven years in prison in the second death of one of their children from illness.


Herbert and Catherine Schaible were convicted of withholding medical care from seven-month-old Brandon, who died of pneumonia and dehydration in April.

Another son, Kent, died under similar circumstances in 2009 at age two.

The couple had been ordered to seek medical care for their sick children.

The Schaibles were sentenced to three to seven years in prison in a Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, court on Wednesday.

"You've killed two of your children," Philadelphia Common Pleas Judge Benjamin Lerner told the couple, the Associated Press reported. "Not God, not your church, not religious devotion... you."

The Schaibles, third-generation members of a small Pentecostal community, had pleaded no contest to charges against them in Brandon's death.

Both apologised for violating a previous court order to seek medical care for their children following son Kent's death.

They were convicted of involuntary manslaughter and child endangerment in his death.

Like Brandon, Kent died from bacterial pneumonia. His parents had prayed for him but did not call a doctor.

The couple told police after Brandon's death they did not seek medical help because they believed in God's power to heal.

The Schaibles' six surviving minor children have been placed in foster care.

[Sue U]

The Schaibles were sentenced to three to seven years in prison

Should also be sterilized and forbidden to have any further contact with children. They are a repeatedly demonstrated hazard to the life, health and safety of minors in their care.

[Sean]

Personally I'm not a huge fan of religion but in this case I would like to help these two fucktards with their belief by arranging for them to meet with their God ASAP.

Seven years for the lives of two children... The mind boggles!

[rubato]

if it really were 'religion versus science' then they would have a symmetrically reasonable belief and we would be equally obliged to respect their choices as those of reasonable people

It is not, is it.

yrs,
rubato

[Big RR]

And we are generally so-obliged when it comes to an adult deciding for him or herself; but the courts have usually drawn the line when it comes to children presumed too young to make a responsible decision.

[MajGenl.Meade]

if it really were 'religion versus science' then they would have a symmetrically reasonable belief and we would be equally obliged to respect their choices as those of reasonable people

It is not, is it.

yrs,
rubato

I rather agree with you about that. But you cannot actually provide any scientific reason to prove that we are "right", can you? I certainly cannot. I can only provide a metaphysical one. You can't do that either. All you are left with is just a plain statement that you don't like what they believe and so therefore they are er... wrong.

No?

[Rick]

So I have believe both a static and an expanding universe?

[MajGenl.Meade]

Dunno. Neither one has anything to do with religion/morality/ethics/rubato's non-point.

[rubato]

They have done two experiments relying on 'faith healing' and in both cases the child died.


I cannot prove by science that allowing children to die is bad, I simply assume that most people agree on that point, but I can prove that science provides the methods save many children from unnecessary death. And Faith Healing has no positive effect at all.


Superstition leads to unnecessary suffering and death.


yrs,
rubato

[Rick]

Dunno. Neither one has anything to do with religion/morality/ethics/rubato's non-point.

So do 2 non-points make a point?

[Lord Jim]

science provides the methods save many children from unnecessary death...

Superstition leads to unnecessary suffering and death.

[Joe Guy]

I, like rubato, am excited about how young men & women have become interested in science, and in particular, chemistry.

For example, East Palo Alto, CA was the murder capital of the world but now science has changed that. Young people are putting together their own chemistry sets and creating small laboratories all over town. They're making money too!!

Here's are some examples:

[Lord Jim]

That's an excellent point Joe...

It warms my heart to see the way in which science can provide the tools for enterprising young entrepreneurs to start their own businesses and lift themselves and their employees out of poverty, as in the examples you provided above...

Truly, only good things ever come from science...

Thank God those youths aren't hanging around some suffering and death producing church...

[Big RR]

Better living through chemistry.

[Rick]

Reminds me of a little ryhme from grade school:

Marijuana, Marijuana

LSD, LSD

Science teachers make it

other teachers take it

Why can't we

Oil well I lived a depraived childhood

[Big RR]

[MajGenl.Meade]

Dunno. Neither one has anything to do with religion/morality/ethics/rubato's non-point.

So do 2 non-points make a point?

Dunno. If you can believe two contradictory things at the same time in the same way, then more power to you. The scientific approach is probably to say "maybe one of 'em's right and maybe neither are". But that's science, innit?

And for rubato, I don't believe in faith healing either (as it's usually presented by Christians) but I sure don't think you know f-all about it since you think God constructs buildings. That's just wacky!




ed. to correct spelling errrrrrer. ed. again to correct the incorrect correction of the spelling errrrrr.

[Rick]

Actually I don't believe either but science promulgates both (depending on who you read)

That aside I missread what Rubato had posted (as you kindly point out) so the point is moot anyway

It's not easy being not smart

[Scooter]

More idiots:

Three days after Kentucky pastor Jamie Coots died from a rattlesnake bite during a service, mourners leaving the funeral went to the church to handle snakes.

Rev. Coots, who appeared on the National Geographic Channel’s Snake Salvation, led the Full Gospel Tabernacle in Jesus Name church founded by his grandfather in Middlesboro, Ky.

The third-generation snake handler was bitten Feb. 15 and died soon after at his home after refusing medical help. Now his son, Cody Coots, is taking over the family church where snakes are frequently part of services.

“People think they will stop handling snakes because someone got bit, but it’s just the opposite,” said Ralph Hood, a professor of psychology at the University of Tennessee, Chattanooga, who has been studying snake handlers for decades. “It reaffirms their faith.”

[Gob]

The parents of a five-month-old boy who died from acute rickets have been jailed for manslaughter.

Nkosiyapha Kunene, 36, and Virginia Kunene, 32, of Erith, south-east London, were sentenced to three and two years in prison respectively.

Their son Ndingeko Kunene died in 2012 from the bone condition which is caused by a deficiency of vitamin D.

The Old Bailey heard the boy's medical care was neglected because of his parents' religious beliefs.

Richard Whittam QC for the prosecution told the court the couple's beliefs arose out of the Seventh Day Adventist Church, which does approve of medical care.

Rickets
A condition that affects bone development, making them soft and weak
It is caused by a deficiency of vitamin D and calcium
It is brought on by a poor diet or if another condition affects how vitamins and minerals are absorbed in the body
It was common in the past. However, it disappeared in the Western world because of vitamin D being in foods such as cereal and margarine
Any child can develop rickets, but children with dark skin (as more sunlight is needed to get enough vitamin D) or children born prematurely are more susceptible

However, an overarching belief held principally by Nkosiyapha was that there was a god in heaven who would guide the family when it came to any matter that affected life.

Mr Whittam said: "There is no suggestion of any ill treatment in the conventional way of neglect or cruelty, it is a neglect to seek proper medical care and then to call medical care at the end.

"There was, throughout the better part of pregnancy and into early life, a rejection of either medical advice or advice from relatives to seek medical advice."