Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

All things philosophical, related to belief and / or religions of any and all sorts.
Personal philosophy welcomed.
Post Reply
Burning Petard
Posts: 4090
Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2016 5:35 pm
Location: Near Bear, Delaware

Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by Burning Petard »

The conclave is over. The headline in the WaPO is:

"At Vatican summit, Pope Francis calls for ‘all-out battle’ against sexual abuse but is short on specifics"

As far as I have heard, there were lots of nice words said at this meeting. However, as the recent thread here with the retelling of the story of Jonah put it, God said actions do make a difference.

I did not see or hear of any attendees turned over to secular criminal enforcement for conspiracy to cover up felonies after the end of this meeting. The once highly lauded leader of the Washington DC Roman Catholic church has been 'defrocked'--but not arrested for anything. McCarrick never took a vow of poverty, but he is provided room and board by the Church today.

snailgate.

User avatar
RayThom
Posts: 8604
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:38 pm
Location: Longwood Gardens PA 19348

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by RayThom »

Burning Petard wrote:The conclave is over. The headline in the WaPO is:
"At Vatican summit, Pope Francis calls for ‘all-out battle’ against sexual abuse but is short on specifics"...
snailgate.
In other words... be discrete, and don't get caught in the act.
Image
“In a world whose absurdity appears to be so impenetrable, we simply must reach a greater degree of understanding among us, a greater sincerity.” 

User avatar
MajGenl.Meade
Posts: 20757
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:51 am
Location: Groot Brakrivier
Contact:

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

Interesting that the Pope characterizes priests as 'tools of Satan' when it comes to sexual abuse of children. I knew someone was to blame and now it's all quite clear, no?
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

Big RR
Posts: 14093
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 9:47 pm

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by Big RR »

he once highly lauded leader of the Washington DC Roman Catholic church has been 'defrocked'--but not arrested for anything.
Much as I'd like to, I'm not able to blame that on the church; the prosecutors can choose to prosecute or not-they don't need the church's permission. Why they chose not to prosecute is beyond me (unless it is because they believed they did not have a winnable case).

Burning Petard
Posts: 4090
Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2016 5:35 pm
Location: Near Bear, Delaware

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by Burning Petard »

The prosecutor needs evidence--which the church has concealed or destroyed.

snailgate

User avatar
MajGenl.Meade
Posts: 20757
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:51 am
Location: Groot Brakrivier
Contact:

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

Aussie Rules? Not sure about "new blow" - copy-ed lapse.
MELBOURNE, Australia (AP) — The most senior Catholic cleric ever charged with child sex abuse has been convicted of molesting two choirboys moments after celebrating Mass, dealing a new blow to the Catholic hierarchy's credibility after a year of global revelations of abuse and cover-up.

Cardinal George Pell, Pope Francis' top financial adviser and the Vatican's economy minister, bowed his head but then regained his composure as the 12-member jury delivered unanimous verdicts in the Victoria state County Court on Dec. 11 after more than two days of deliberation.

The court had until Tuesday forbidden publication of any details about the trial.

Pell faces a potential maximum 50-year prison term after a sentencing hearing that begins on Wednesday. He has foreshadowed an appeal.
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

User avatar
Scooter
Posts: 16564
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:04 pm
Location: Toronto, ON

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by Scooter »

Where is Dave when you need him to insist that none of this ever happened, and even if it did, the boys wanted it.
"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're on the menu."

-- Author unknown

User avatar
RayThom
Posts: 8604
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:38 pm
Location: Longwood Gardens PA 19348

Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by RayThom »

Image
Image
“In a world whose absurdity appears to be so impenetrable, we simply must reach a greater degree of understanding among us, a greater sincerity.” 

User avatar
Scooter
Posts: 16564
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:04 pm
Location: Toronto, ON

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by Scooter »

I do not have any words:
Cardinal Pell had ‘plain vanilla' sex with victim and that should mitigate prison sentence, lawyer says

MELBOURNE, Australia — The most senior Catholic cleric ever convicted of child sex abuse was sent to prison on Wednesday and will wait two weeks to learn his sentence for attacking two choirboys in a Melbourne cathedral two decades ago.

Victorian state County Court Chief Judge Peter Kidd revoked Cardinal George Pell’s bail at the end of a sentencing hearing in a packed, standing room-only courtroom. Kidd said he would deliver his sentence on March 13.

The 77-year-old Pell, who could face 50 years in prison, showed no expression as he walked from the dock with a cane escorted by three court security officers and a prison guard. Pell paused at the door, turned to the judge and bowed.

He was taken by prison van from the court to the Melbourne Assessment Prison, a maximum security facility where inmates new to the state penal system are assessed. All prisoners are strip-searched on arrival and Pell, like all pedophiles, will be kept in protective custody, where he will remain alone for up to 23 hours a day.

A jury unanimously convicted Pell in December of abusing the two 13-year-olds in a rear room of St. Patrick’s Cathedral in 1996 weeks after becoming archbishop of Melbourne, Australia’s second-largest city. But Pell wasn’t taken into custody immediately because he had surgery scheduled to have both knees replaced.

Pell’s lawyer Robert Richter had told the jury during the trial that “only a mad man” would take the risk of sexually abusing two boys in a cathedral room with the door open and people likely to wander in.

On Wednesday, Richter described the abuse as a “temporary loss of judgment” in response to an “irresistible impulse.”

According to The Guardian, he tried to argue there were “no aggravating circumstances” to one of the offences. It was “no more than a plain vanilla sexual penetration case where the child is not actively participating,” he told the court.

“It must be clear to you by now that I am struggling with that submission,” the judge responded. “Looking at your points here — so, what?”

Richter also tried to suggest that an incident in which Pell grabbed one of the boys by the genitals in an attack that lasted seconds was “fleeting” and not worthy of a jail sentence.

Kidd disagreed. “That wasn’t just a trifling sexual assault,” he said.

“Nothing is to be gained here by comparing different forms of sexual abuse of children. Of course I need to make a judgement of the overall gravity of this. But there is a limit to these kinds of comparisons.”

The victim who testified at Pell’s trial said in a statement that since the conviction was revealed, he has experienced “shame, loneliness, depression and struggle.” The man said it had taken him years to understand the impact the assault had on his life.

The other victim died of a heroin overdose that his father attributed to the aftermath of the abuse. Neither victim can be named under state law.

Earlier, Pell faced an abusive crowd Wednesday as he entered court half an hour before his sentencing hearing began.

“I hope you burn in hell!” one man shouted while pushing against a cluster of police officers trying to shield the cardinal as he walked into the courthouse. “You’re a pedophile! You’re a criminal! You’re a monster!”

Richter was also heckled by members of the public during the lunch break, prompting Kidd to warn people in the gallery that they could be charged with contempt of court for such behaviour.

Kidd said such acts directed at Pell and Richter showed that Pell was being blamed for the sexual abuse and coverups within the Catholic Church recently exposed by a government-commissioned investigation into Australian institutions’ handling of abuse allegations.

“The Catholic Church is not on trial … I’m imposing sentence on Cardinal Pell for what he did,” Kidd said.

The court had until Tuesday forbidden publication of any details about the trial because Pell had faced a second trial in April on charges that he indecently assaulted two boys aged 9 or 10 and 11 or 12 as a young priest in the late 1970s in a public pool in his hometown of Ballarat. Those charges have now been dropped.

Pope Francis removed Pell as a member of his informal Cabinet in October. He had remained prefect of the Vatican’s economy ministry, but his five-year term expired this month, acting Vatican spokesman Alessandro Gisotti said.

Gisotti tweeted that Pell “is no longer” the Holy See’s economy chief.

Pell will be sentenced for five convictions of sexual penetration and indecent acts involving the boys. Each conviction carries a maximum 10-year prison term.

The judge said Pell was guilty of a breach of trust with an element of brutality and had had a sense of impunity. “I see this as callus, brazen offending — blatant,” Kidd said.

“At the time, he thought he was going to get away with it. Otherwise he wouldn’t have done it,” Kidd added.

Pell had maintained his innocence throughout, describing the accusations as “vile and disgusting conduct.” His lawyers have appealed the convictions and were scheduled to appear in the Court of Appeal on Wednesday afternoon to apply for bail. But the bail application was later withdrawn, and no date has been set for an appeal hearing.

The former Australian prime minister John Howard was among those who provided character references for Pell as the cardinal’s legal team tried to argue for a lower-end sentence in Melbourne’s county court on Wednesday morning.

Pell lawyer Paul Galbally said the cardinal had decided against applying for bail.

“He believes it is appropriate for him to await his sentencing” in prison, Galbally said in a statement.
"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're on the menu."

-- Author unknown

User avatar
Lord Jim
Posts: 29716
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 2010 12:44 pm
Location: TCTUTKHBDTMDITSAF

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by Lord Jim »

I'm just glad that those insane comments are coming from the defense lawyer rather than the judge.... :?
ImageImageImage

User avatar
Scooter
Posts: 16564
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:04 pm
Location: Toronto, ON

Re: Is the R C church in the last stages of Alzheimer's?

Post by Scooter »

The judge is appearing to have none of it, which is encouraging. Methinks the good cardinal will be buried in a prison cemetary.
"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're on the menu."

-- Author unknown

Post Reply