oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

[Big RR]

Interesting BSG--I've never seen those sheets, but defense counsel told me once that the diary method was acceptable the judges they were before as, usually, no one would sign a sheet; the judge never said a word about it.

It's sad Montana won't name enough judges--do they call judges back on senior status?

[BoSoxGal]

Yeah, they are spending about $165k/yr. farming out cases to retired judges, but it's a pitiful number and nothing like what is truly needed. I know judicial vacancies and/or insufficient number of judges is a huge issue everywhere, but Montana has no excuse having maintained a positive budget balance sheet throughout the entire recession and recovery - it's just not a priority. The public defender is also disgustingly underfunded.

[Big RR]

The public defender is also disgustingly underfunded.

Sadly, that's the case pretty much everywhere I have seen.

[Guinevere]

In Massachusetts not only do we woefully underpay our state public defenders (most make less than courthouse janitors), the Commonwealth ran out of money to pay the private attorneys who are assigned those cases (because God knows we don't have enough actually employed, even at their pathetic salaries). Those private attorneys are paid anywhere from $50 to $100 per hour depending on the case, and they are getting stiffed for work already done and billed earlier in the year. . An emergency funding bill was eventually passed and signed, but it took some time. Some of those lawyers are still waiting to get paid.

What a shoddy way to treat people who are working to uphold Constitutional requirements.

[oldr_n_wsr]

although she did question the kid extensively on what he saw and learned

That's probably how they (the court/judge) determine if they actually attended. Any kind of sign-off sheet means nothing and the judge most likely knows this. The sign off sheet is probably a "scare" tactic. Have you ever seen it used on a defendent who went through the system a second time?

The guy who signed it was probably the meeting chair person. Any meeting I have gone to always as a chair person. Not so with door greeters.
Along with my other commitments, I chair the Big Book meeting on fridays. From Jan to June I chaired the Beginners meeting, which takes place at the same time as the Big Book meeting. I was a little bummed when I took the beginners chair commitment (no one else could) as I prefer big book meetings to beginners meetings. But there was a bright side to that commitment. I had to get a different speaker for each meeting, so I got to know a whole bunch of new people and experienced a whole bunch of new meetings/groups. I sought out people who spoke of the solution (aka the big book and the 12 steps) and didn't ramble on and on about their years and escapades while drunk (we call it the "drunk-a-logue").

Never heard of 100 meetings in 100 days. Around here it is 90 in 90. They say it takes 90 days for attending meetings (or anything) to become a habit.

The real story of 90 in 90 comes from the Salvation Army. The SA would give a bed (shelter) to the drunks nightly as long as they attended an AA meeting that day. The limit for ones stay was 90 days. Thus, if they attended 90 meetings (one each day) they could stay for 90 days.

None of which (100 in 100 or 90 in 90) will keep me sober, although I have had more than a few 90 in 90 stretches. Early in the rooms, I made it a point to go to at least a meeting a day. But there were times I went to the meetings drunk. There were times I drank at meetings. Only salvation I found was doing the work layed out in the big book.
RayThom took a different path.
Whatever works is what's important.

[RayThom]

... RayThom took a different path... Whatever works is what's important.

Back in '81 there were two options for me -- stop drinking and drugging, or the alternative. True, AA was a scary deal for me and I couldn't comfortably adapt to its system of doctrine, meetings, and higher power. We had nothing in common except for the knowledge that alcohol addiction would be the death of me. With some fear and trembling I went searching for my own salvation -- eventually finding my "higher power" -- education, ergo my return to college.

Eventually I learned of self-actualization and it being a lifelong, living, process and it was imperative I stay on track. Fortunately, with all my nascent medical issues yet to manifest I surely would have died had I not sensed there was more to life than the destructive path I was once on. After a few years into my sobriety I knew I made the correct choice and I've been building on that success ever since.

I've always fared better conducting myself as an outsider and taking my lumps as they arose yet I know I'm better for it. Others may need continual guidance and camaraderie to get them through their dark times and if that's what it takes -- sobeit. Judge not, that ye be not judged.

Life is good.

[BoSoxGal]

oldr that's right, it was 90 in 90 in Montana, too. I thought the other wasn't ringing the right bell in my memory banks . . . which aren't that great these days anyway!

'90 meetings, 90 days . . . then back for a status hearing. If you get violated on your other conditions before then, it's straight back to jail' - I heard that over and over and over in revocation of bond/probation hearings . . .

[Big RR]

'll admit I've never had a client told to do it so I've never looked into it in detail, but have heard more than I judge use "100 meetings in 100 days"; but 90 or 100, it's still a big commitment. these were in custody cases so rarely was anyone facing jail time, but they could lose custody of their kids (and even visitation) by not complying.

Ray, whatever works; looks like you found what works for you.

[oldr_n_wsr]

these were in custody cases so rarely was anyone facing jail time, but they could lose custody of their kids (and even visitation) by not complying.

There are many people (mostly women) who are in the rooms in order to get their kids back. Be it judicial order or their lawyer telling them it would be in their best interest to go.

Sadly, the real alcoholics and/or addicts don't usually stay in the rooms and don't usually stay clean.

But there are some success stories and we try and get those people to speak as much as possible especially to the new-comers.

There's a womens sober house near where our group meets. House rules used to be that they had to attend meetings regularly. When that rule was dropped*** the ladies slowly stopped coming and from what I hear, the house is not very "sober". Those ladies who truly want to remain sober get out as fast as they can.


*** The manager of the house stopped the required attendance when an AA member started getting a little to "chummy" with the ladies residing there. he started out being a "good person" offering rides for shopping and what-not. It ended up in harrassment charges, which were eventually dropped, but the damage was done. He was not a member of our group but was a regular attendee of our meetings. "Was" is key here. i have not seen him around at all lately.
Gotta watch out for those who practice only one Step, the 13th.

[Big RR]

13th step? is that the on e out the door?

[oldr_n_wsr]

13th step? is that the on e out the door?

The 13th Step is the attempt by a member with some dry*** time to get cozy with a newcomer.



*** I say "dry" time as what they are doing does not have a sober (aka soundness of mind) component to it.

From the urban dictionary (sorry no link, computer block)

the thirteenth step is used to describe the efforts of an old timer who tries to screw a newcomer or someone with less than a year of sobriety.

Loonie Larry (as I called him) was notorious for trying to complete his 13th step (multiple times). As I said, he has since gone off the radar.

I am guessing that 13th stepping was the cause for the general recommendation that it's guys with guys and girls with girls in terms of sponsorship. Although that doesn't always hold as there is a big need for more females willing to sponsor new female members. Especially with the heroin epidemic. It seems almost a 50-50 split in the younger generation (millenials mostly) of men vs women. some are strictly addicts but most are cross addicted (alcahol and drugs). From what they tell me, they come to aa as it's a stronger program. That many na meetings have devolved into meet/greet/get high and have sex.
[disclaimer]I have no first hand knowledge of na in general or specifics, just what some of the "young'uns" tell me. [/disclaimer]

I used to give some of the ladies in that sober house rides to/from the meetings. Not for any 13th step purpose, but because the route I take to the meeting takes me right past the house. The only rule I have for someone who needs a ride is they have to call me between 5 and 5:30. Before 5 I am on my way home and I am not picking up my phone (I am usually home at 5) and after 5:30 I usually have who I am picking up and the route I need to take and what time to leave for the meeting that night OR am doing stuff around the house OR taking a nap. In other words DO NOT DISTURB!

Amazing how some cannot abide by that request. Of course some cannot call between 5 and 5:30 so I tell them call earlier and leave a message. It got so bad people calling after 5:30 even after answering and reminding them to call earlier, that I just shut the phone off. And then they accuse me of not practicing the principle of helping another AA person.

[Big RR]

See oldr--they're trying to get their 13th step and screw you.

[oldr_n_wsr]

See oldr--they're trying to get their 13th step and screw you.

[oldr_n_wsr]

The speaker at last nights meeting was phenomenal.
Here was a lady (aloholic/addict), raped repeatedly by her father, raped by her parents "friends" in exchange for their drugs (which started before she was 13yo) telling us not to feel sorry for her. Not to say to her "sorry for your past". She said she now owns her life and that all that happened to her was preparation for her present higher purpose which is to help other victims get past their abuse and to help other addicts and alcoholics get sober.

Her experience was heartbreaking, but her emergence from that and her present state of mind and her message was one of inspiration.

I had tears listening to her all through her speaking last night.
That is one of the reasons I try and go to a meeting every night. The chance that I will hear someone with that kind of strength and hope and humility.
It puts my petty complaints into focus and how trivial they truly are.

Thank you name withheld


ETA
I only wish that more people would have been there to hear her message. there were only about 8 of us there. There are some women that frequent that meeting that are cronic beginners. I think they would have gotten a lot out of hearing this lady speak. Maybe even gotten her to sponsor them.

[Big RR]

I have a 14 year old client who was living what this woman lived and is working hard to pull her life together. It's inspiring to see how some people really work hard to overcome adversity, and it definitely puts my own petty problems in perspective.

[oldr_n_wsr]

I have a 14 year old client who was living what this woman lived and is working hard to pull her life together. It's inspiring to see how some people really work hard to overcome adversity, and it definitely puts my own petty problems in perspective.

Keep me posted about her BigRR (by PM if you prefer). If the situation warrents, we might be able to get them to speak to each other. I know the speakers home group and she seems like someone who truly and honestly wants to help other women. And she is uniquely qualified.

[oldr_n_wsr]

Over a month since my last update. Time flies when you're having fun.

Not much to report on sobriety other than it has become just another part of life.

We went on vacation to Las Vegas with my wife and my dad. Her dad was supposed to come also, but he wasn't feeling well and dropped out. Good thing he got trip insurance. We stayed at the Mandalay Bay, which was at the far end of the strip near hte airport. Nice place but they charged for everything. They had a "lazy river" pool. I thought they would just throw a bunch of inner tubes in the river and people could get on/off as they chose and leave the tube behind. It was that way at blizzard beach in disney world many moons ago and I think at Splish Splash here on long island. But no, they wanted $20 for a $3 inner tube float. at least you got to keep the float We decided to just jump in and be swept along by the current, which turned out fine. Had I bought floats, I would have tried selling them at half price to people waiting on the check in line.

Lost about $125.00 playing craps. Was up, down, up again then down again, then I stopped. The waitress looked at me funny when she came around for the drinks order and I asked for a plain coke. Had my wife sip it before I drank it to make sure the waitress didn't get it mixed up with someone elses alcoholic drink. (no need to wake up the bear by accident).

Visited our son (he lives in vegas) and he drove us to hoover dam one day and the western part of the grand canyon another day. Took a helicopter ride over and into the grand canyon. Incredible.

Back home and working around the house and at the daughters house. Finishing up the counter that now connects the kitchen and living room. She did some nice freelance painting on it and I will put the mouldings around the surface. Then we are putting some type of crystal glaze on it that makes it look like it has 100 coats of poly-urethane on it. they use it an bar counters a lot.
Never worked with this stuff before. Hope I don't screw anything up. After that it's the trim mouldings and then the counter (and hole in the wall) are done. Should be done with all that this weekend. But you never know, something I forgot will pop up and it will be another 2 weeks before that's done.

Stil going to meetings every night. Interesting story:
We were on the check in line at the hotel in vegas. I was commenting that I never had to wait in line to check in at a hotel before, maybe because I usually stay at a small motel which does not have 5000 rooms. Anyway my wife asks me if I am going to try getting to a meeting and I look up there is this young lady and tatooed on the back of her neck is the Unity/Recovery/Service circle/triangle symbol of AA (with a roman numeral 1 in the middle). I point her out to my wife and when the line snakes back and forth she is on the other side of the rope and i ask, "are you a freind of Bill W's?" She was and we get to talking and one evening her and I went to a meeting. My wife is great about these things (me and another woman out in the evening in vegas.... )and I am grateful she is. My only mistress was alcohol and I left her so she really has nothing to worry about. I will spend the end ofmy days trying to make her happy, but she knows in order forme to be able to dot hat I need to stay sober.
We only went to the one meeting as our schedules were booked up. The meeting was a little different, but a lot the same. They get a lot of vacationers passing through this meeting which is to be expected as it was only about 1/2 mile off the strip.
Well that's about it. Thanks for listening.

[Bicycle Bill]

Sounds like you had an enjoyable time.  Ain't it great to wake up, clear-headed, in the morning and not need to ask someone if you had a good time the night before?

-"BB"-

[oldr_n_wsr]

Sounds like you had an enjoyable time.  Ain't it great to wake up, clear-headed, in the morning and not need to ask someone if you had a good time the night before?

-"BB"-

yes it is, although I was not a black-out person. Only a matter of time had I continued.

[RayThom]

... although I was not a black-out person. Only a matter of time had I continued.

What... no blackouts? What kind of alcoholic are you, anyway? There's nothing scarier than pretending that you were in full control the night before, or someone paying you back money you can't remember lending during an episode.

I'm just glad that my cirrhosis is "almost" undetectable.