oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Members own writings, photography, music, art, poetry, prose.
Show off your own stuff, share the pleasure, suffer the critics.
Post Reply
oldr_n_wsr
Posts: 10838
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 1:59 am

oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by oldr_n_wsr »

Ever since I made a concerted effort to get, and stay sober, my past drinking "adventures" have always come up as a topic. Heck, everyones past drinking comes up. At AA meetings the guest speaker bares his past, how he/she relapsed multiple times, how they finally decided they had had enough.

Just yesterday in outpatient therapy the counselor asked at what age we stopped growing emotionally. Now I thought it would be when I turned from "heavy drinker" into a full blown alcoholic, (around 50yo in 2008) but what she was really asking was when did I take my first "real" drink. I had to think "when was my first drink?"

Might be easy for some, but for me it took considerable thinking. As a kid, I remember having pizza every Friday for dinner. Being the good Catholics we were, there was no meat allowed on Friday's (even if the Vatican on,e two or three said we could), so we ardered pizza.

And you can tell me what you want about pizza's made all over America (pizza made in Italy is NOT pizza), the greatest pizza made is made here in NY and THE single greatest pizza made here in NY was made by a pizza parlor named Vita's Pizza located on the corner of Jericho Tpke and Mineola Blvd in the village of Mineola (the town I grew up in). The second greatest pizza made was from a pizzaria named Umburtos I (one) on Jericho Tpke just off the corner of Congress Blvd (again in Mineola).

One may be wondering what pizza has to do with oldr_n_wsr's alcoholism but please bare with me. You see, when dad had pizza, he had a beer with his pizza, and in the 1960's and 1970's Schaefer (sp?) was a big time beer (Bud was barely a blip on the screen). So, when dad came home with the pizza (there was no delivery service then, you had to go to the pizzaria and get it yourself) he would say to us kids, "someone get me a Schaefer".

It was the only time dad ever had alcohol with dinner unless we went to party or resturant. My moms side of the family is where the alcoholic gene/hormone/synapsys resides (more about her and her demons to follow)

Anyway, there were (are) three of us, I am the oldest, two years younger is my brother and two years younger than him (so four years younger than me) is my sister. Now I am guessing here but we are around 6 yo's (me being 8 and sister being 4) when we (me) ask dad for a sip of his beer. Dad says "it's called a shlook and you can have a shlook" and he hands me his glass of beer. To this day dad wants his beer in a glass, not from the can, not from the bottle, and prefers a glass made from glass, not a plastic cup. So I take what I think is a "shlook" and hand the glass back to him. Now to an 8yo beer is not very pleasing, it's bitter, it bubbles that bitterness and it makes you burp. But to this 8-something yo, it tastes great.

User avatar
Crackpot
Posts: 11264
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:59 am
Location: Michigan

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Crackpot »

Is that how it was or how you remember it? I had my first beer in a similar fashion (though it was my dad who was the alcoholic) But I remember that I hated it. The strange thing is I try to conjure the what I hated about it and I can now only remember the taste I now enjoy.
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

User avatar
The Hen
Posts: 5941
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 8:56 am

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by The Hen »

I hated the hoppiness about it.

With wine, I hated the stripping of my tongue.
Bah!

Image

User avatar
Rick
Posts: 3875
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:12 am
Location: Arkansas

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Rick »

1st drink and 1st drunk, to me, are 2 different things.

I've had sips (shlooks) probably starting about the same age as you.

My 1st drunk was when I was 13, 1st time I smoked hooter too...
Sometimes it seems as though one has to cross the line just to figger out where it is

User avatar
dales
Posts: 10922
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2010 5:13 am
Location: SF Bay Area - NORTH California - USA

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by dales »

Mum gave me a small glass of beer when I was 5.

Big deal...I didn't like the taste.

Fast forward 10 years....

I didn't get plastered until I was 15 on New Years Eve. Mixed my drinks and vomited and vomited.

When I reached the legal drinking age of 21, I was a "social" drinker.

I would periodically get "blitzed" about once a month.

My drinking and drug usage caught up with me after my divorce and by then my kids were grown and I had free reign to indluge my usage.

Long story short, I checked into AA when I was 56, found a very good sponsor, and with all but one or two relapses, have been clean and sober for near 3 years.

Sobriety is a day at a time undertaking.

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
rubato

oldr_n_wsr
Posts: 10838
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 1:59 am

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by oldr_n_wsr »

Is that how it was or how you remember it?
I'm pretty sure that's the way it was (but one can never be 100% certain) as I can't remember a time I didn't like the taste of beer.
My 1st drunk was when I was 13,
My first drunk was at either my, or my borthers first Communion party, so would have been either 7 or 9 years old. I am leaning toward my brothers communion. Story to be told at a later date. ;)
Long story short, I checked into AA when I was 56, found a very good sponsor, and with all but one or two relapses, have been clean and sober for near 3 years.
Good for you dales keep up the good work. I hate that word "relapse", I prefer "restart". :mrgreen:

I am not keeping track of how long. Last time I did that, when I reached 1 month I congratulated myself by getting drunk. After talking to an old friend of mine who has 4 or 5 years sober (he tries not to count either) he told me to get stupid and only remember how to count to 1. And that has served me well since my "restart".

User avatar
dales
Posts: 10922
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2010 5:13 am
Location: SF Bay Area - NORTH California - USA

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by dales »

:ok

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
rubato

User avatar
loCAtek
Posts: 8421
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 9:49 pm
Location: My San Ho'metown

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by loCAtek »

True dat, Older, yer a hero and an inspiration! I tell myself, like the trainer who runs more and more; that I will drink less and less. I'm down to a third or so, less than before I admitted to myself and the world, that I was an alcoholic.

Yer a braver man than I, for tackling this head on.

oldr_n_wsr
Posts: 10838
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 1:59 am

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by oldr_n_wsr »

My "home group" had their 40th anniversary party last friday and I realized that it was the first party I can remember attending that did not have alcohol present.

Growing up, every party I can remember, there was alcohol present. And the parties I can't remember were preserved through home movies. There in the dining room my 4th birthday, surrounded by my friend on the block, my cousins and all their parents. And each parent has a drink in their hand. Identifiable were beers (duh, cans are easy to make out and schaefer or ballentine were the beers of the era) and the scotch glasses, highball glasses and the timeless martini glass. Back then, having the correct glass was as important as having the right mix in the drink.

Now-a-days I found four glasses cover everything, the beer glass, the on-the-rocks glass, the wine glass and the "never changing" martini glass.

As I have said, my father always drank beer from a beer glass, and that beer glass was never to have had milk or anything other than beer (or hot water for washing) in it. I do have a few special glasses and mugs that have only had beer or hot water in them. I am guessing that the only thing in them from here on in will be dust. ;)

Anyway, parties at our house were always attended by alcohol. He/she was ever-present and any party I went to I can remember alcohol being present. My first drunk was at either my brother or sisters first holy communion, although after talking to my uncle, he seems to think it was my own first holy communion. I remember him saying to me htat "if we were in Germany, you would have had a beer by now" and proceded to give me a beer (a can of schaefer) and then a shot of whiskey (mayber scotch, maybe bourbon, definately not a clear liquor). I did hte shot and wnet away with the prized posession, my own can of beer.

There was a problem though. Back then there were no things like "pull-tabs" or "pop-tops". One needed a "church key" to open a can of beer. Being the "smart" kid I was I knew we kept one in the "everything" drawer in the kitchen and with the party being down the basement, mom and dad would not know about the beer Uncle Hans gave me.

So I go upstairs with my beer concealed and find the churchkey, open it, put the churchkey back in the drawer and go out the side door. I procede to the backyard and sip (shlook) my beer feeling like a "big shot" when my cousin comes out with his own beer. Seems Uncle Hans thinks all us 8-10 years olds should have beer on this occasion.

oldr_n_wsr
Posts: 10838
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 1:59 am

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by oldr_n_wsr »

And on a different note:
We're going over my brothers house for Easter dinner (filet mignon, yum yum) and it will be my first "event" with the family since I have stopped drinking alcohol. They asked if I would like them not to have alcohol at the dinner but I told them it's up to them and that they can have what they always have, which is about about a case of champagne (actually Henkell sparkling wine from Germany) and plenty of beer and other types of wine. I don't know what they decided, but it will be a big test for me. I am fine not drinking here at home as I have adapted and changed my routines to suit not drinking (even though there is still alcohol in the house). I believe in leaving the temptation there as it is ever present in the outside world and it's up to me to stay sober regardless of when and where temptations present themselves.

I told my counselor to test me on monday as she advised me to take my family up on their offer to not have alcohol present at this celebration. I said as I have always said, I have alcohol in my house and do not wish to drink again. If I ever do decide to drink again, it will not be because of the presense (or lack of presense) of alcohol, it will be because I wanted to drink.

Happy Easter everyone and Happy Passover to those who celebrated that holiday this past week.

User avatar
Timster
Posts: 967
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 3:43 am

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Timster »

I believe in leaving the temptation there as it is ever present in the outside world and it's up to me to stay sober regardless of when and where temptations present themselves.
I would advise caution here oldr.

While you are correct in that "temptation" is everywhere; it is one thing to drive down to the corner liquor store and not look the clerk in the eye at the onset of a 'Restart"; and another thing if all you have to do is wait until the family is out of the house and justify just one quick sip. See what I mean?

If you are serious, and I believe you are, you will remove All temptation from your immediate proximity asap. Especially when you are new to sobriety. These closer temptations have a lot to do with psychological 'triggers' that can trip you up in a heart beat.

For example. You are also trying to quit smoking. So when do you smoke? Waking up? After a meal? After sex?

And we do these activities every day. And for how many years? And we see that pack of smokes on the table or nightstand and simply out of HABIT... we reach for it.

See what I mean?

Get rid of the booze out of the house. All of it.

At least until you are stronger of will. Why place unnecessary obstacles in your path?

Only the best of wishes and Peace out. :ok

Tim
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Arthur Schopenhauer-

User avatar
Crackpot
Posts: 11264
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:59 am
Location: Michigan

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Crackpot »

Actually I successfully quit smoking the same way Oldr is proposing. It is one thing to quit something when it's out of your experience and something else entirely when confronted with it. It comes down to a question of resolve. If your resolve is strong now confront temptation now and learn how to deal with temptation now because too frequently time gives a false sense of security and renders you susceptible to the lies your addiction will tell you. Not the least of which is "I can have just one" which successfully done leads to: "I can have just one again" etc. etc...

The hardest thing about Addiction is admitting an inanimate object has power over you. It sounds asinine. How can an inanimate object that has no will of its own hold any power over you? It is all power that you give it to be sure The hard thing is to realize that it is power you give regardless of recognizing it. Only if you don't recognize it you can't stop giving it.
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

User avatar
Timster
Posts: 967
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 3:43 am

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Timster »

It comes down to a question of resolve. If your resolve is strong now confront temptation now and learn how to deal with temptation now
Ok, CP. I have heard this argument over and over. All one needs is to exercise a bit of "will power".

Fine. The next time you have a case of diarrhea; just exercise some of that 'will power' and just don't shit.

No problem!

The problem with that is that it sets people up for failure. And that it is somehow their own weakness of "will" that made them fail. Which they inevitably will fail to some degree or another. Which inevitably leads to a downward spiral of defeat, despair and self loathing. Which only exacerbates the very condition they were trying to correct.

Sorry, but I have to disagree with that entire modality. I see it as counter-productive at best.

I much prefer the behavior modification approach.

Just saying.
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Arthur Schopenhauer-

User avatar
Crackpot
Posts: 11264
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:59 am
Location: Michigan

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Crackpot »

I'm speaking from experience. Do you know how many times I quit and then started again because I didn't learn how to deal with real world pressures?

I realized when I first quit I was more aware of the pressures affecting me as time passed I became confident in my abilities Confidence that didn't mean shit because it was never tested against real world pressure. What I'm saying it's helpful to learn how to deal with temptation quit when you're most aware of your weak spots.

And I don't know about you but when I get Diarrhea I just don't shit my pants I clench and hightail it to the nearest bathroom. (sometimes I actually do think will is the only thing keeping it in)
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

User avatar
alice
Posts: 315
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2010 4:50 pm

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by alice »

I think it's a very individual thing, and maybe what works for one isn't right for another. Also what works for one type of addiction may not work for another.
My personal philosophy for quitting smoking fitted with what Crackpot said, but of course it doesn't mean it's the only way, or the best way, for everyone.
I didn't want to avoid people who were smoking, or social events, routines, etc that had previously been 'triggers'. I figured that I had to learn to work around the situations, rather than trying to rearrange my life and my friends to fit around my attempts to stop. For me it would have made a bigger 'deal' and 'focus' on it if too much had to change.
I also didn't 'count the days' from my last cigarette - I felt that by focussing on how long it had been since I'd had a cigarette, it would keep reminding me that I was quitting. And although I wanted to quit for all the 'right' reasons (mainly health and medical), I actually enjoyed the habit, and couldn't actually handle the thought of never smoking again. The thought of never having another cigarette had actually been the reason I hadn't been able to stop before. So I made sure I never had a 'last cigarette' - I just never got around to having the 'next one', if that makes sense. Not keeping count of how long since I'd had one somehow made it easier to not have another one. In that sense I never felt that I 'quit' and that's how I got myself over the hurdle. After quite some time I realised it had been months since I'd had a cigarette and I felt a sense of quiet pride - but I couldn't tell you that date I 'quit' 'cos I don't know it.
The other thing I never was comfortable with was making a big deal to other people and having lots of other encouragement etc. Again it was an extremely personal thing, and more to do with me not wanting to 'quit forever', although I was quitting - I found it easier if the topic of me not smoking never came up at all, or only as a brief mention, not a major topic. I realised I was over my own personal hurdle when i realised that I no longer minded talking about it.

Regarding other addictions - I've never been a big drinker, although my father was, both ex-partners were/are, and both my sisters are. And so is at least one of my dearest friends (quite a few drink heavily, one has a very major problem). So I've 'grown up with' and been surrounded by alcoholics my entire life.
One of my sisters recently had liver problems and has been given dire warnings and continues to drink. She's an intelligent and sociable person and otherwise rational, but she likes her wine and tried to give up, and couldn't. She had anxiety and withdrawals and stress, and ended up drinking again and trying to remain in denial about the health problem. And it's not that she doesn't have strong willpower in general - she had a weight problem and I couldn't believe the willpower, the commitment and strength she had regarding changing her food habits and maintaining a diet and exercise program. She was a champion, and I was in awe of her commitment, and regarding every other part of her diet she remains committed and focussed. But she eventually reached a sort of plateau with her weight and won't lose any more now, because the alcohol - the part she can't exercise willpower on - is the part that's now the major contributor of her weight issues. It's scary to try to understand that she has such serious medical concerns that she is in genuine fear about, and yet she can't kick herself into stopping the alcohol.

I also have lost friends, in earlier years, to drug addictions, and have had friends overcome serious drug problems. All with various techniques that worked for them - or didn't work for them, in some tragic cases. I don't think there's a single program that's 'right' for everyone.

What works is a mindset - and the mindset isn't just how strong the person's general willpower is (otherwise my sister would have no problems at all, because she can exercise extremely strong willpower). The mindset is the whatever the individual reasoning is that made something deep within you really want to kick the addiction (whatever the addiction is), and that mindset is the backbone of the individual willpower and commitment to the hard work and pain to achieve that aim.
And if you have the right mindset you can have a temporary setback here and there, but not use the setback as the set up for 'failure'; instead just 'restart' or whatever terminology works for you. You can just accept it as a 'bump' in your long term commitment and keep working toward the end goal.

Anyway, I'm being long-winded - but wanted to say good on you, oldr-n-wsr for your individual commitment. And for being resolved enough to work through the options to find out what is 'working' for you. And for not letting temporary setbacks be excuses to end your commitment. And for being strong enough to talk about it while you're working through it.

I 'm so proud of you for taking this step, for having the strength and the mindset to do this. It's a huge achievement, and I'm applauding from the sidelines every step of the way.
:worship:
:hug: :hug: :hug: :hug:
:ty:
Life is like photography. You use the negative to develop.

User avatar
Crackpot
Posts: 11264
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:59 am
Location: Michigan

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Crackpot »

I didn't count the days either I wanted my quit date to be inconsequential since past failings stemmed back to it's been "x" I can have just "one". I cant even tell you the year. (I could "do the math" to find the exact date but I never have)

In the end you have to go with what works for you. I got through it mostly by finding a way to make my stubbornness work for me rather than against me. (If I could only do the same thing about losing weight)
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

oldr_n_wsr
Posts: 10838
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 1:59 am

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by oldr_n_wsr »

and another thing if all you have to do is wait until the family is out of the house and justify just one quick sip. See what I mean?
Been confronting the family out of the house everyday since I quit. With me being unemployed and the wife and son working most of the day, I haven't had the temptation. And as far a "quick sip", no alcoholic can have just a "quick sip". First sip is the beginning that we will drink til we can't get any more or we pass out.

I understand and appreciate your concern Timster as many others have expressed similar concerns. So far I have handled it, maybe because I really don't want to drink anymore and when I did drink it was usually out of boredom. Keeping busy is my key. I can't believe the amount of things I am getting done around here. This time last year I would have great intentions of going to trim the hedges and in between getting the hedge trimmer, I would have a drink, then go get the extension cord and have another drink, then trim a little and have another drink, then get the pail and lawn bags and have another drink, then get the rake and have another then it was time for a nap. Get done with the nap, go to teh ;store for another bottle, have a drink or two before cleaning up the clippings from the hedges (which were barely trimmed) then in between have another drink and before you know it the hedges were partially trimmed and partially cleaned up and it was time for another drink or five as I had worked hard and deserved a rest.

This year I had the hedges fully trimmed and shaped and cleaned up all before lunch one day. All the gardens are weeded with compost turned in and seeds planted. The dead branches from last years blooms in the lilac bushes have been trimmed out and the rasberry patch which was totally neglected last year, has been ressurected and new shoots are appearing daily. MAde some picture frames for the daughters paintings, overhawled the cutting deck on my garden tractor and repaired the weed wacker. And those are just things I easily recall doing, there are many other things I have done.
My biggest fear is running out of things to do, but hopefully I will get a job soon (went on a second interview on friday and the vp of engineering there said he would let me know by tuesday) which will eat up some hours each day, then I'll be complaining there isn't enough time to do all I want to do.

So far things are working out for me so I think I'll go with it and if changes need to be made, then I will confront that when it comes.

Quiting cigarettes was a little easier as I am taking Chantix. I did have a cigarette the other day and it had no effect, no buzz, no heart jump no nothing, so that's working. I am in my third month and I think just to stay on the safe side I am going to ask the doctor to prescribe another months worth of the Chantix. Too bad they don't have a pill to take away alcoholism.

Thanks everyone for your concern, suggestions, support and tales of your own battles with addiction. All of it gives me strength.

User avatar
Gob
Posts: 33642
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 8:40 am

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Gob »

I never envisioned PlanB as a therapy room, but I have to say, the range of advice, and level of support here is brilliant.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

User avatar
loCAtek
Posts: 8421
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 9:49 pm
Location: My San Ho'metown

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by loCAtek »

um, yea.

User avatar
Sean
Posts: 5826
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 10:17 am
Location: Gold Coast

Re: oldr_n_wsr's alcoholic adventure

Post by Sean »

Second that Strop. I would offer advice but I'm presently between 'quitting smoking' attempts...

So probably not the best advice-giver here...
Why is it that when Miley Cyrus gets naked and licks a hammer it's 'art' and 'edgy' but when I do it I'm 'drunk' and 'banned from the hardware store'?

Post Reply