A Sensible Solution to the Sequester Problem

[Lord Jim]

True, having a large standing army of trained soldiers made Iraq (and Afghanistan for that mattter)

Actually, it was our lack of a "large" standing army that made both of those operations the clusterfucks they became....

In both cases we went in with far fewer than the numbers needed to accomplish the mission. As result, those engagements wound up lasting longer, costing more in lives and treasure, and accomplishing less than if we had gone in with sufficient force to not only bring down the regimes, but provide the security environment needed to stand up effective new governments.

The "Rumsfeld Doctrine" of attempting to conduct these operations on the cheap completely backfired.

[Big RR]

Econoline--interesting statisitics, I'll look at the source when I get a chance. But I would bet a gooid number of the "volunteers" were inspired to do so because they were facing conscription otherwise; volunteering usually gave of service branch and timing for entry, the draft did not. Same with the jobs. I would bet many "better" jobs like MP or support services were staffed by volunteers than combat infantry units.

Jim--you may be right, but it would not even have been "attempted" absent the trained standing army we had. Add to that the lack of clear objectives (and any credible/truthful effort to justify the policy to the American people), and we can see why it crashed and burned. We got some payback for Sep 11, but it was worthless payback. We did much the same thing (with similarly understaffed forces)after the Pearl Harbor attacks with Doolittle's raid on Tokyo, but since the objectives were modest, people saw it as a success although little was actuially accomplished.

[Rick]

Jobs in the military (on a general basis re sans politics) are assigned by test scores 1st, then billiting (sp)...

[Rick]

Another method other than the draft that used to be applied although I don't think it's allowed any more was the ol' Alices Restaurant thang.

Join the military or go to jail, now gangs actually encourage their members to get military experience.

Scary that...

[rubato]

I think you're looking for an analogy which is the opposite of Alice's Restaurant.

In AR Arlo Guthrie gets OUT of the draft because he was arrested.

yrs,
rubato

[Rick]

Why yes he did, my bad...

[Big RR]

keld. I had a number of friends who enlisted in the 68-72 period, many because they faced the draft if they did not. They chose their branch and job, and the recruiter gave them the aptitude to see if they qualfied for it; ultimately they got a contract guaranteeing their choice of job training (I guess they could still flunk out) and induction date (which could be delayed for up to a year). Another option that was offered was indiction with one's buddies, getting basic training at the same time (although I don't know if they were all assigned to the same training platoons/flights. My friends got good jobs, one was a fireman in DaNang, e.g.

As for the stats you supplied, assuming they are correct (I always thought that the draft accounted for around 50% of those inducted), I do note that 25% of those in Vietnam had a 20% higher chance of being killed (30% of all deaths), which, all things being equal (and I see no reason to think they are not) woul indicate that 20% more of them were sent into dangerous combat positions.

[oldr_n_wsr]

woul indicate that 20% more of them were sent into dangerous combat positions.

Or that they didn't take it as serious as those who enlisted, aka those who wanted to be warriors, vs those who were only going through the motions.

My sponsor is a VietNam vet who was drafted. I am so glad I was born in 1958.

[Lord Jim]

Why yes he did, my bad...

Geez Louise Keld, what the hell's the matter with you boy, admitting to a mistake like that?

Why didn't you return to the thread arrogantly and indignantly insisting that you were right, and that everybody else was simply too stupid to understand what anyone of even "the meanest intelligence" should be able to grasp?

[Econoline]

Some of us never give up on the idea of trying to teach by example... (even when it seems hopeless)

[Crackpot]

So that's what they're doing?

[Lord Jim]

Some of us never give up on the idea of trying to teach by example... (even when it seems hopeless)

A noble approach...

I try to "teach" by giving folks the opportunity to see themselves as others see them...(particularly in this American Journal of Psychiatry award winning case... )

But then, as I said before...

I'm also the guy who thinks we have a good shot at developing real time faster than light propulsion, so my optimism is pretty much boundless....

[Rick]

I'm also the guy who thinks we have a good shot at developing real time faster than light propulsion, so my optimism is pretty much boundless....

I thought all they needed was someone to translate the owners manual for that aliem spacecraft they got stashed at area 51...

[Lord Jim]

I guess you missed this photograph...



Proof!

[Rick]

It's my understanding that we are actually going to skip FTL and go straight to folding space, which after all would render FTL obsolete...

[oldr_n_wsr]

go straight to folding space,

Origami?

[Rick]

Most call it Science Fiction. However I, like LJ find it also has a niche in humor...