The NPR solution

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Sue U
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Sue U »

“I mean, look, Bill, I’m not a bigot. . . . ” he said. “But when I get on a plane, I got to tell you, if I see people who are in Muslim garb and I think, you know, they’re identifying themselves first and foremost as Muslims, I get worried. I get nervous.”
“I mean, look, Bill, I’m not a bigot. . . . " he said. “But when I get on a plane, I got to tell you, if I see people who are in clerical collars or nun's habits and I think, you know, they’re identifying themselves first and foremost as Catholics, I get worried. I get nervous.”

“I mean, look, Bill, I’m not a bigot. . . . " he said. “But when I get on a plane, I got to tell you, if I see people who are in beards with side-curls and wearing those funny hats and I think, you know, they’re identifying themselves first and foremost as Jews, I get worried. I get nervous.”

“I mean, look, Bill, I’m not a bigot. . . . " he said. “But when I get on a plane, I got to tell you, if I see people who are in dashikis and I think, you know, they’re identifying themselves first and foremost as black, I get worried. I get nervous.”


So basically, anyone who exhibits any kind of ethnic or religious affiliation other than what he deems "normal 'Murkin" (like that nice Timmy McVeigh!) is somehow NOT a True AmericanTM and therefore makes him (reasonably!) afraid! Those people shouldn't be allowed! They're probably up to something, maybe! And it's totally not bigoted!

Nobody is throwing Juan Williams in jail for expressing his personal sentiments and he is free to talk about his bigotry all he wants (now on Fox, which obviously has no problem making bigotry a cornerstone of its broadcasting policy). But his former employer, which depends on a public perception of impartiality and equanimity, should not be required to retain him as its face and voice when he demonstrates the opposite.
GAH!

Big RR
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Big RR »

Except NPR tries to hold itself out as something above politics, something that embraces a multitude of viewpoints, something apprioaching "impartiality and equanimity". IMHO, firing him for saying something unpopular and stupid does not correllate well with this supposed perception. Now, if he said that while he was a reporter on the air, I would be more sympathetic, but IMHO an employer should rarely, if ever, be justified in firing an employee for whatever legal activities (s)he engages in on his/her own time.

Again, I do agree that NPR can do what it wants legally, but I am not going to defend them for firing someone for exercising his right to free speech. I think it flies clearly in the face of the image that NPR seeks to promote (but then it reveals their true colors, or their lack of integrity IMHO).

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Sue U
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Sue U »

So CNN was also wrong for firing Rick Sanchez?
GAH!

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Crackpot
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Crackpot »

Sanchez was commenting on CNN (as well as others)
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

Big RR
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Big RR »

Sue--I don't know, I guess it depends on what image CNN wants to present to the public. And it is different, as Crackpot pointed out, because Sanchez was openly criticizing the policies of his employer and maligning it, not merely stating a political opinion like Williams did. Yes, it is on his own time, but publicly attacking one's employer, even on one's own time, may be one of the rare exceptions I mentioned previously.

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loCAtek
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by loCAtek »

NPR has a 'Code of Ethics' that Williams was repeatedly counseled on.

A workplace can hold employees to codes, from dress to speech, so long as it isn't discriminatory or unconstitutional. Therefore, all employees must follow them if they wish to remain employed.

I hope Williams isn't playing the counter-race card of 'I can't be bigoted because I'm black!'

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Lord Jim
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Lord Jim »

But his former employer, which depends on a public perception of impartiality and equanimity,
LMAO :lol: :lol: :lol:

That's what I love about you Sue...

You're such a card! :lol: :lol:

In what universe is it that you believe NPR enjoys a "public perception of impartiality and equanimity"?...

In this time line, it has never enjoyed that perception; and all this intolerant behavior of theirs in firing Williams has accomplished is to confirm the well established real public perception of NPR...

That they're nothing but a bunch of PC liberal hacks.....

If they had any concern about being perceived as "impartial" they would never have fired Williams; what they would do now is apologize profusely to him and to the public, offer him his job back, and fire the bonehead who came up with the decision to fire Williams.

If you think that this has somehow enhanced NPR's "public perception" you need to spend less time hittin' the pipe....
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Big RR
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Big RR »

Lo--true, and i have said that NPR is (so far as i can see) legally entitled to do what it did; I just don't think that it's right that a comapny that tries to project the image NPR does fires someone for expressing and unpopular opinion, however stupid that opinion is (and this one is pretty stupid IMHO).

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Crackpot
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Crackpot »

Jim

they did appologise but they stand by the firing.

THat being said NPR seems to be the only news outlet that holds to journalistic standards.
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

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Lord Jim
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Lord Jim »

they did appologise but they stand by the firing.
Well CP, in that case their position has gone from wrong and stupid to incoherent....

If they apologized, presumably they believe the firing was wrong, (otherwise, why apologize?)...

If' they're admitting the firing was wrong, why aren't they offering him back his job?

Or was this one of those weasely non- apology apologies?
THat being said NPR seems to be the only news outlet that holds to journalistic standards.
There are a number of programs I enjoy on NPR, but I would never, ever, in a million years, mistake them for a non-biased news source....

This is one of the things that cracks me up about a lot of liberals; they frequently seem to believe that news that slants left is "unbiased"...

Most Conservatives I know aren't like that. We can recognize the right slant of Fox News; but for some reason this is a real blind spot for many liberals, when it comes to left slanted news....
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Crackpot
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Crackpot »

I just saw the apologly on the news line on the tv in the breakroom I don't know it's contents

Actually I find NPR to be the most open and honest about thier bias and the most diligent about airing opposing viewpoints.

There is no way to remove editorial bias from the news the best you can do is alow for dissenting viewpoints and rebuttals.
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

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Crackpot
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Crackpot »

I should add that I'm just talking about thier "news" shows. some of thier other programming er... not so much.
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

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Lord Jim
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Lord Jim »

Jim--would you feel the same way if he said the jews should get out of Palestine?
I don't think that saying "the Jews should get out of Palestine" would ever get anyone fired at NPR....

Being anti-Israel, (or, "anti-zionist") is on the approved list of liberal positions.
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Andrew D
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Andrew D »

Lord Jim wrote:Most Conservatives I know aren't like that. We can recognize the right slant of Fox News; but for some reason this is a real blind spot for many liberals, when it comes to left slanted news....
It's probably a question of degree. After all, Fox is slanted to the right at least ten times as much as NPR is slanted to the left ....
Reason is valuable only when it performs against the wordless physical background of the universe.

Big RR
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Big RR »

Lord Jim wrote:
Jim--would you feel the same way if he said the jews should get out of Palestine?
I don't think that saying "the Jews should get out of Palestine" would ever get anyone fired at NPR....

Being anti-Israel, (or, "anti-zionist") is on the approved list of liberal positions.
Maybe, maybe not; I'm not privy to the list (if there even is one). However, earlier in the year you lambasted a reporter for saying just that and wished her good riddance.

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Lord Jim
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Lord Jim »

Maybe, maybe not; I'm not privy to the list (if there even is one). However, earlier in the year you lambasted a reporter for saying just that and wished her good riddance.
You're talking about Helen Thomas....

First of all, she's a reporter not a person hired to give opinions, and second she should have been canned a long time ago, (she was dropped by UPI years ago) for being an embarrassing, senile crank....
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Big RR
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Big RR »

Jim--all reporters give reporting and news analysis, be it Thomas or Williams or theguy on the weekly throwaway. I realize you don't like her, but do you think she deserved to be terminated because of her remarks; isn't she entitled to her opinions as Willaims is?

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Gob
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Gob »

Does NPR have a charter, like the BBC?
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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loCAtek
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by loCAtek »

Yes, and now Williams is trying to say they're 'outdated';
NPR News Code of Ethics and Practices- Applies to all NPR journalists

V. Outside work, freelancing, speaking engagements

10. In appearing on TV or other media including electronic Web-based forums, NPR journalists should not express views they would not air in their role as an NPR journalist. They should not participate in shows electronic forums, or blogs that encourage punditry and speculation rather than fact-based analysis.
Seems pretty straight-forward to me.

Andrew D
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Re: The NPR solution

Post by Andrew D »

It seems pretty straightforward to me, too. If Williams signed onto that policy, then he should have known that he could be fired for participating as a commentator on Fox or anywhere else.

But that does bring up a question: Why hasn't NPR fired Nina Totenberg? She's been on Inside Washington for ages, and that show sure seems like "punditry" to me. Is it because Inside Washington is a PBS show? Is there some sort of PBS exception to NPR's stated policy?
Reason is valuable only when it performs against the wordless physical background of the universe.

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