General Foolishness

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loCAtek
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by loCAtek »

Sue U wrote: It is a phony "qualification." It is well to periodically remind the military that they serve exclusively, and at the pleasure of, civilian bosses.

I wasn't aware anyone stated it was a qualification, just that it made a more well-rounded President particularly in regards to his duties as Commander in Chief.

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Lord Jim
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Lord Jim »

I think I know who McChrystal's biggest fan is right now...

Tony Hayward....
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Big RR
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Big RR »

keld feldspar wrote:Sue however true your post.

Only 12 presidents have had no military experience.

Since Truman 2 Clinton and Obama...
I guess it depends how you define military "experience"; Regan served in uniform but stayed stateside and made movies (a service to be sure, but "military experience"?); W had uniforms in his closet and occasionally joyrided in jets which would never be used for combat. How that expereince would make them a better CIC is beyond me.

@meric@nwom@n

Re: General Foolishness

Post by @meric@nwom@n »

I am not sure it is ever a good idea to make COO of something you have no experience doing.

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Guinevere
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Guinevere »

Jarlaxle wrote:I suspect McChrystal just wanted out...he was probably frustrated and figured this was the easiest way to get out.
Awfully chickenshit for something with his standing, responsibility, and experience. I think he just thinks he's too important to be let go of. If McArthur can be fired, so can McChrystal.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

Big RR
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Big RR »

@W, IMHO it depnds on what experience is needed; most CEOs/COOs have staffs with specialists who have the necessary experience and can advise the boss accordingly. A good CEO/COO is a generalist, someone who is used to listening to the viewpoints of others and integrating them into a general policy, not a micromanager.

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Guinevere
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Guinevere »

McChrystal to be relieved of command this afternoon. Patraeus likley to take command himself. Details to follow, but check out the NYTimes --I just got a news alert from them.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

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kristina
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by kristina »

I just heard on "Talk of the Nation" That Patraeus is taking over.

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Gob
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Gob »

Is Petraeus a good person to take over?

Clue me in here...
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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Crackpot
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Crackpot »

He's the one that got Iraq moving in the right direction so there's reason to be hopeful.
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

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Gob
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Gob »

Thanks mate.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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Lord Jim
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Lord Jim »

I saw on TV yesterday when Obama came out to the Rose Garden to make the announcement. He was flanked by General Petarus, Sec. Gates, Adm. Mullen, and of course, Vice President Biteme. (Okay, I included that last sentence just so I'd have an excuse to say, "Vice President Biteme"...I admit it.)

Overall, I think Obama handled this just about as well as it could be handled. As I've said from the outset, I don't think he had any choice but to fire McChrystal after what came out publicly...I think any President would have had to do so, regardless of whether the comments were justified, (they very well may have been) or how effective a field commander McChrystal may be. (By all accounts McChrystal is superb)

And in persuading Petraus to take the assignment, the most widely respected General in active service, (which technically is a step down for him...He's been serving as the head of The Central Command...I think it speaks volumes about what a great patriot Petraus is to be willing to make that sacrifice and take this assignment) Obama has launched an effective pre-emptive strike politically to avoid any divisive debate about McChrystal's successor, so he should have this episode behind him pretty quickly. (And sense Petraus is also just the right guy for the job from a policy stand point, this is one of those rare instances where the demands of the politics and the demands of the policy actually coincide).

The only ones likely to be unhappy about this are some on the left in his own party, who would dearly have loved to have been able to use this unfortunate incident as an excuse to re-open the whole debate over our Afghan strategy. (Gee, that's a damn shame... 8-) Not happenin'. (If anything, under Petraus, our strategy is likely to be even more vigorous and robust.)

Now, with this personnel episode behind him, Obama only has to worry about the Gulf Oil Spill, 9.7% unemployment, the Iranians, the North Koreans, two wars, and potential new terrorist attacks....

Life is goooood.... :D
Last edited by Lord Jim on Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Guinevere
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Guinevere »

Ah yes, the last two paragraphs above = further proof that the republicans hate America. Step right up folks. See it live and in person!

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:



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(don't go squealing LJ, you deserved it for those comments)
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“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

Big RR
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Big RR »

Jim--why do you think it' a good thing not to openly debate a policy which is reulting in a drain on resources and many, many deaths, yet producing very few tangible results? Isn't open debate the essence of a democracy? I won't dispute that Obama ran on a platform which included focusing on the war effort in Afghanistan, but he's now miring us in something that will take years adn years to get out of, and wupporting idiots in the Afghan government who will provide no real leadership after we leave. At the very least, Obama should be forced to defend/sell the policy to the american people. IMHO it's a big mistake to follow the example of LBJ and pretty much ignore it except for a few well-placed catch phrases. Without popular support, any plan (even a good one0 is doomed to failure.

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Lord Jim
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Lord Jim »

You misinterpreted my "life is good" comment Gwen...

I wasn't referring to "life being good" for me or the Republican Party...

I was sarcastically referring to "life being good" for Obama...

Basically making the point that he's got so much on his plate he never gets a respite....

Big RR:

It was well known when this policy was put in place, that as we took the fight more aggressively to the enemy, things would get worse before they got better...(Just as they did in Iraq)

We had this debate, Obama took a long time deciding on a course. The strategy now needs to be given a chance to work. The proper time to revisit this would be late next spring, as we approach the July "deadline" for beginning a draw down. At that point, it would be reasonable to review the progress, and have a debate about whether the draw down should be rapid, slow, or delayed.
Last edited by Lord Jim on Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Big RR
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Big RR »

Point taken Jim, but I do think it's a mistake not to try and keep the public involved and make sure there is support for the plan. With the government now in place inAfghainistan, IMHO even if the military plan succeeds (and that'a a big "if"), it will be for nought. Why we keep touting the idiot Karzai (sp?) is beyond me.

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Guinevere
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Guinevere »

GUIN, most definitely NOT Gwen.

And that was quite the dodge, LJ. Despite your disclaimers, you dance quite well.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

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Crackpot
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Crackpot »

Nah Jim has always been fairly consistent with that attitude for Obama.

Congress on the other hand......
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

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Lord Jim
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by Lord Jim »

GUIN, most definitely NOT Gwen.
Oh merciful heavens, a thousand pardons m'lady....

(Now, while thankfully this board affords me the ability to correct this grievous inadvertent insult...You may not have noticed, but I've been talking about Gwen a fair bit lately... I will decline to do so, so that your response will continue to have proper context.)
And that was quite the dodge
Well I'm sorry you don't believe me, but my explanation happens to be the truth...
you dance quite well.
You wouldn't say that if you actually ever saw me try to "cut a rug"....(On the other hand, you have heard me sing....)
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liberty
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Re: General Foolishness

Post by liberty »

You all do realize that being fired in the military is not the same as being fired in the civilian world. Unless McCrystal retires he is still in the army; he just moves to another position. Most likely he will have a position with a lot less stress and frustration.
I expected to be placed in an air force combat position such as security police, forward air control, pararescue or E.O.D. I would have liked dog handler. I had heard about the dog Nemo and was highly impressed. “SFB” is sad I didn’t end up in E.O.D.

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