any0ne v0ting trump in 2020?

MajGenl.Meade · Post by **MajGenl.Meade** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:35 am

Guinevere wrote:
MajGenl.Meade wrote:Thus far, no. If Biden is not available for me, then I'll vote for Nunofthea Bove.
Thus far?

If you’re only voting old white men you are beyond hope. What a shame. I thought you had actually learned something.

Welcome back, in a masochistic kind of way.

I think it's a possible sign of learning that a Republican refused to support the 2016 Republican cannedidiot but what do I know?

It's always theoretically possible that if the only alternative is that Bernie Sanders takes charge (a very old white guy last time I looked) then I might have to go with the other demon. I think that's a possibility so remote that it deserves only a cursory nod. I do not care for the Democrat candidates at all, other than Biden for whom I don't give a pinch of owl dung either - but he's tolerable enough to get my vote.

Should it not be him (and barring the preposterous selection of Sanders), I will not vote rather than vote for Trump or any other Democrat. Or perhaps vote for whatever lunatic the Greens put up. Or perhaps the Flying Spaghetti Monster deserves a crack at it.

RayThom · Post by **RayThom** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:33 am

MajGenl.Meade wrote:... Should it not be (Biden)... I will not vote rather than vote for Trump or any other Democrat...

That's how I handled it 2016. I did not vote for a president -- from any party. Every Dem on the downballot, but no president.

If impeachment -- and removal -- doesn't stop our Grifter-in-Chief then on November 3rd I will have a personal mandate to vote for whomever the Democratic nominee may be. Whoever makes the cut -- that's my choice -- no matter how distasteful.

If it's a progressive Dem, I trust that Congress will contain any super-social programs that nominee may have run on. Realistically, it's rare that any candidate's campaign promises and over-the-top pandering are ever fully implemented. They're almost always just a means to an end.

Our serial abuser POTUS must be held to one term, or less. I'm convinced this is the only way a thinking electorate will be able to save Jeffersonian democracy as we know it.

Warren / Bloomberg... 2020.

datsunaholic · Post by **datsunaholic** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 7:17 am

People that couldn't hold their noses and vote for HC in 2016 is kind of how we got in this mess in the first place. Though as many folks I know have pointed out, if you lived in a strongly Democrat-leaned State it didn't matter much. OTOH if the folks in swing states had actually voted for HC rather than being pissed off that Bernie didn't get the nod...

Econoline · Post by **Econoline** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 7:34 am

RayThom wrote:If impeachment -- and removal -- doesn't stop our Grifter-in-Chief then on November 3rd I will have a personal mandate to vote for whomever the Democratic nominee may be. Whoever makes the cut -- that's my choice -- no matter how distasteful.

If it's a progressive Dem, I trust that Congress will contain any super-social programs that nominee may have run on. Realistically, it's rare that any candidate's campaign promises and over-the-top pandering are ever fully implemented. They're almost always just a means to an end.

Our serial abuser POTUS must be held to one term, or less. I'm convinced this is the only way a thinking electorate will be able to save Jeffersonian democracy as we know it.

I think at this point I'd even vote for Marianne Williamson if she somehow got the nomination.

Guinevere wrote:Dead children in camps. Although we know you, like your hero, don’t consider them human. Dead Kurds. Same analysis. Dead journalists. But you probably approve of bonesaw dismemberment of journalists and truth-seekers. Dead children in our schools.

Enough, or should I go on and on and on.

Also too...

Guinevere · Post by **Guinevere** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:34 am

datsunaholic wrote:People that couldn't hold their noses and vote for HC in 2016 is kind of how we got in this mess in the first place. Though as many folks I know have pointed out, if you lived in a strongly Democrat-leaned State it didn't matter much. OTOH if the folks in swing states had actually voted for HC rather than being pissed off that Bernie didn't get the nod...

This, this, this.

Not voting for the Dem is the same as voting for Trump. Hold your nose and do it. Believe me, there are plenty of Dems I would not be happy voting for, but I have no problem getting over my own ego and doing what’s right for the country. It’s what responsible adults do.

ex-khobar Andy · Post by **ex-khobar Andy** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 11:26 am

Econoline wrote: Also too...

Yes the science on this is pretty clear. I've done a lot of these tests: it costs a farmer around $35 to have the irrigation water tested for E. coli. We used to do a lot for melon farmers when I worked in Indiana years ago: I don't recall if it was Indiana regulations or whether the farmers in that area were just being socially responsible. It happens.

Of course that's the beauty of regulations. The socially responsible farmer (or hairdresser or banker or engineer) who goes the extra mile to ensure that his/her products and activities are safe, loses business to those who do not, who do not bear those additional costs and who can undersell them. The 'regulations hurt my small business' mindset people never understand this. I blame Reagan and his 'government is the problem' philosophy. Sure there are instances of government overreach we can all quote, but on balance regulations, properly arrived at, are a force for good.

Crackpot · Post by **Crackpot** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:17 pm

I still would vote Trump over Williamson I think the country is better suited to combating the current disaster in the White House than an entirely different kind of erratic and incompetent. If Williamson got the nod I’d vote Trump for no other reason than to try and preserve the lie that there is at least one party in the government that cares about facts and will legislate accordingly.

The only subject I’ve seen her provide a rational reasoned argument for is reparations everything else is a dodgy word salad reminiscent of our current resident of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.

MajGenl.Meade · Post by **MajGenl.Meade** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:47 pm

I'll revisit after July 16.

BoSoxGal · Post by **BoSoxGal** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 1:49 pm

Crackpot wrote:I still would vote Trump over Williamson I think the country is better suited to combating the current disaster in the White House than an entirely different kind of erratic and incompetent. If Williamson got the nod I’d vote Trump for no other reason than to try and preserve the lie that there is at least one party in the government that cares about facts and will legislate accordingly.

The only subject I’ve seen her provide a rational reasoned argument for is reparations everything else is a dodgy word salad reminiscent of our current resident of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.

I could understand sitting it out if Williamson was the D nominee, but I can’t understand voting Trump over any person on the D slate - or voting for him at all in light of his record.

Burning Petard · Post by **Burning Petard** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 2:00 pm

The field of individuals officially seeking the nomination of the Dems for president next year is NOT crowded. As Gail Collins reminded me last week, there are probably at least 47 million Americans who self-identify as democrats and believe they would do a better job as president than the Bib Orange currently claiming the title. So the field is actually rather restrained.

And Guin, I hope you are out there riding your bike more than I am.

snailgate

Crackpot · Post by **Crackpot** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 2:20 pm

BoSoxGal wrote:
Crackpot wrote:I still would vote Trump over Williamson I think the country is better suited to combating the current disaster in the White House than an entirely different kind of erratic and incompetent. If Williamson got the nod I’d vote Trump for no other reason than to try and preserve the lie that there is at least one party in the government that cares about facts and will legislate accordingly.

The only subject I’ve seen her provide a rational reasoned argument for is reparations everything else is a dodgy word salad reminiscent of our current resident of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
I could understand sitting it out if Williamson was the D nominee, but I can’t understand voting Trump over any person on the D slate - or voting for him at all in light of his record.

If the Dems were truly stupid enough to nominate Williamson I’d be voting Trump merely to preserve the facade that there is still a rational party because the extreme lack of judgement in perusing that nomination would show there isn’t. I’d also be looking to move someplace where I could both earn a living and be reasonably shielded from the fallout from the impending collapse of the Government. It will be proof that the inmadtes have completely taken over the asylum. I can not vote for change just for the sake of change there has to be some hope that there will be a change for the better.

Guinevere · Post by **Guinevere** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 3:04 pm

Oh please, you’d vote Trump and leave the country? That’s so adult of you.

Even if the crazy Williamson was the nominee (and she won’t be) she would do far less harm to our country than Trump. I’ll vote for her. It matters that much that he is gone.

SG - not much riding lately. Too much work. Bum knee. Hopefully in the New Year, I get the knee fixed and get back to normal activity levels.

Crackpot · Post by **Crackpot** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 3:41 pm

I’d vote for him because is would possibly give the country another election cycle to sort things out. I’d vote for him because in my view he’d be the best choice. I’d leave the country because even though he’d be the better choice it would still be a horrific result for the country, I know far to many people like her to have any hope for the future because she is exactly like Trump only from a different perspective. Unfortunately the illusion of being different would stall any repair this republic desperately needs. For fucks same her Impeachment would be opposed just because the impeachment of Trump failed. (I already have little faith that will actually succeed). So yes I can with a clear conscience vote for what I would think is best for my country while still acting for what I believe would be best for my family.

I would hope Williamson couldn’t be the nominee but then again people were saying Trump couldn’t be the nominee (or president)

BTW Williamson dog whistles her crazy base just as much as Donnie does his.

Guinevere · Post by **Guinevere** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:18 pm

Crackpot wrote:I’d vote for him because is would possibly give the country another election cycle to sort things out. I’d vote for him because in my view he’d be the best choice. I’d leave the country because even though he’d be the better choice it would still be a horrific result for the country, I know far to many people like her to have any hope for the future because she is exactly like Trump only from a different perspective. Unfortunately the illusion of being different would stall any repair this republic desperately needs. For fucks same her Impeachment would be opposed just because the impeachment of Trump failed. (I already have little faith that will actually succeed). So yes I can with a clear conscience vote for what I would think is best for my country while still acting for what I believe would be best for my family.

I would hope Williamson couldn’t be the nominee but then again people were saying Trump couldn’t be the nominee (or president)

BTW Williamson dog whistles her crazy base just as much as Donnie does his.

Williamson does not have close to the support that Trumpelstiltskin had at this point (or at any point in her candidacy). As for dog whistles, way way way fewer responding to her whistle, and no one of any stature or substance or elected office.

edited, because I checked the data (thank you wiki)

Crackpot · Post by **Crackpot** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:55 pm

You underestimate the anti-vax community and other conspiracy mined people. The very fact that they have a significant overlap with trumps “base” is enough to give me pause. All it takes is for a leading candidate or two to go scorched earth and damage enough of the rest of the field and suddenly Williamson becomes viable. The moment she drops out I will take a sigh of relief.

Guinevere · Post by **Guinevere** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:19 pm

I honestly think you're barking up the wrong tree/looking for a straw. Just go support the democratic nominee of your choice. That's the best way to put MW to rest.

Crackpot · Post by **Crackpot** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 6:04 pm

I don’t think it likely just possible.

Lord Jim · Post by **Lord Jim** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 6:24 pm

The polling consistently indicates that most Democrats (as they should) place defeating Trump as their number one concern, and that would rule out supporting a moon bat like Williamson...

Or a stooge for foreign dictators like Tulsi Gabbard...(We've already got one of those occupying the office...anyone who finds that sort of thing appealing is likely to vote for him...)

As I said before, if the Democrats nominated Richard Ramirez, (the Night Stalker serial killer) I still wouldn't vote for Trump...(I take the "Never" part of "Never Trumper" very seriously and literally)

Of course I wouldn't vote for Ramirez either...

As I mentioned in my thread about Elizabeth Warren, Trump's words and deeds have gotten so much worse (as difficult as that is to believe, given how godawful he was before) over the past few months that the universe of potential Democratic nominees that would absolutely cause me either not to vote or to vote third party for President has gotten smaller and smaller...

(Now it's pretty much down to Gabbard and Williamson; two extreme long shots)

RayThom · Post by **RayThom** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 6:53 pm

Well, you must admit Marianne Williamson's 'new age' political slogan "A Reiki healing stone in every pocket, a Himalayan salt lamp in every bedroom" is quite a grabber.

Imagine what a wonderful world it would be if everyone's qigong was centered, and one with the universe?

Trees of green, red roses, seeing them bloom... sigh!

wesw · Post by **wesw** » Mon Dec 09, 2019 7:55 pm

jiminy crickets!

why the hell is any0ne wasting time worrying abut Maryanne sunshine?

damn.

she has less chance than d0es Hillary.

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