Obama v. Romney

[BoSoxGal]

What utter crap, on so many levels.

Can I steal this, Scooter?

I'd like to post it after every dgs post.

[Scooter]

Knock yourself out. Some statements are just so obviously bullshit to anyone but the writer, that they aren't worth the effort to deconstruct and critique.

[dales]

My new sig line?

Das ist völliger Quatsch, auf so vielen Ebenen.

[Scooter]

[MajGenl.Meade]

Surely, dgs should adopt Das ist völliger Quatsch, auf so vielen Ebenen as his sig and cut out the middle man?



edit to remove an extra "as"

[Lord Jim]

He had to assume that one way or another this decision point would become public. Had he decided to do NOTHING, he knew his timidity could never be lived down.

Well the thing is, the reason this became a big decision point is because the decision was made to launch the raid....

Had that not happened, there really would have been no big story....it would been just have been another of many cases where there was intel pointing in both directions about whether or not UBL was in a given location; and the decision was made that it wasn't firm enough to act on. (And in this case, most of Obama's senior advisers didn't feel it was strong enough to act on.)

The only way a "no" decision would have become a big deal if it was a situation where Obama was convinced that UBL was there, but decided not to launch the raid anyway....

But that was not the case; remember, the only reason we know for a fact that UBL was there, is because the raid was launched. If there had been no raid, no one could accuse Obama of having failed to go after Bin Ladin when we "knew" where he was, because we didn't "know"....

A "no" decision would have been much easier, and less politically risky.

What I do find amusing however, is the way Obama's surrogates and spinmeisters are solemnly intoning about how this episode provides some sort of insight into Obama's decision making process. That it is somehow emblematic of how he conducts the Presidency. That's just ridiculous; the record indicates that nothing could be further from the truth....

The record indicates, that the way he handled this is absolutely nothing like the way he generally reaches decisions or conducts process. It sticks out like a sore thumb...

Choosing the politically courageous course, and relying on his own judgement over that of his advisers, have not exactly been the hallmarks of his time in Office. On the contrary, trying to sort out the least politically risky route, and deferring to his advisers, have been the defining characteristics of nearly every major decision he has made as President.

Except for this one.

[dgs49]

Jimmy, you are aware, I assume, that WJC has been excoriated muchly because of several supposed opportunities he had to capture OBL or take him out. And yet, in many of these cases, the "intelligence" on which they are based is questionable.

Had Barry elected to pass on this, or to delay doing something, surely someone in the CIA/military chain would have come forward by now to go public with the story of how they had OBL dead to rights and elected not to do anything. Given the high profile of the efforts to find OBL and slay him, this later revelation would have been devastating if it came out at the wrong time.

Certainly there were downsides to be considered, but that's always the case when considering any significant military option.

Again, look at the politics of it. If he decided to go forward, the upside was collossal and the downsides were manageable. If he decided to pass, there was no upside and a huge potential downside. The classic "no brainer."

Frankly, I can't imagine anyone outside the far Left Wing of the Peoples' Party considering this a significant accomplishment for Our Beloved President. More of a military accomplishment than one by the CIC.

[MajGenl.Meade]

If he decided to go forward, the upside was collossal and the downsides were manageable.

Tell that to Jimmy Carter.

[dgs49]

Yes, that is the obvious historical parallel, but I don't think many people blamed Carter for the fiasco in the desert. In fact, we were keen to do something - even something foolhardy - to get those hostages out.

There were so many other reasons to make Carter a one-term President...

[Long Run]

Obama has had more positive results in foreign policy issues than negative results. Clearly, he should get credit for the bin Laden raid; he supported the intelligence gathering, pushing our relationship with Pakistan to the edge, and the actual call to take the chance. ( I see Dave's point, though: it is a bit like the one we heard in the year after 9/11 when GWB's popularity grew because of the actions he took -- the argument being that anyone sitting in office would have done the same. Foreign policy and leadership are things a president can actually impact in a major way, unlike the economy, so I don't really buy the argument). So I don't have any problem with Obama touting the raid as a big achievement, but it will be old news by November.

Oregon almost certainly will go Obama's way regardless of how clear the choice appears.

The key issue in the election will be whether Romney can convince the population that he will be competent especially with respect to the economy. While Obama has had a fairly successful presidency on foreign policy, he has not had much success on domestic issues with several of his major initiatives being considered failures (mostly a correct perception, imo). The economy continues to not perform well, and things will not be substantially better by November. My bet is the independent voters who decide the election will be more concerned with whether Romney can make a difference and care less whether he would be a good guy to have a beer with (alcohol free or otherwise) or other "character" issues. He has been less than inspiring thus far, and clearly those on this board who have experienced him as governor don't hold him in high regard. However, I think he will figure out a message and deliver it adequately, and the heavy weight of the lousy economy will drag Obama down enough that we will have our first Mormon president.

[dgs49]

Here is how Our Intrepid Leader authorized the operation (WH memo to the CO of the operation):

"The timing, operational decision making and control are in Admiral McRaven's hands. The approval is provided on the risk profile presented to the President. Any additional risks are to be brought back to the President for his consideration. The direction is to go in and get bin Laden and if he is not there, to get out."

Which is to say, if the mission went wrong, the fault would be Adm. McRaven's, not the president's. If there was any flaw in the "risk profile," as viewed in hindsight, then Barry could wash his hands of the whole thing.

Now THIS is Leadership! "The Buck Stops OVER THERE!"

[dgs49]

Getting back to the politics of the election, it is difficult to predict (or understand) the thought process of the American people. Roosevelt was re-elected three times despite historically horrible results in trying to improve the economy, and no doubt he could have been elected again had he lived long enough.

Barry's basic approach to the economy was to prime the pump with borrowed money. It failed utterly, and left us with not only more debt than ever before, but more continuing financial obligations that will inevitably bankrupt us if not brought under control. Neither he nor any other Democrat leader has proposed any hint of a measure to control entitlement spending, although there is general consensus that this must be done.

Even if Romney were a mannequin, no rational person could vote to re-elect this charlatan. Hope and change indeed.

But that's the trouble. The American public is not generally rational, and Barry's campaign is already showing that he intends to capitalize on the irrationality and stupidity of the electorate.

[Scooter]

Which is to say, if the mission went wrong, the fault would be Adm. McRaven's, not the president's. If there was any flaw in the "risk profile," as viewed in hindsight, then Barry could wash his hands of the whole thing.

Now THIS is Leadership! "The Buck Stops OVER THERE!"

That is not what it says at all. Reading comprehension is a helpful tool. I recommend the Sylvan Method.

[Scooter]

Roosevelt was re-elected three times despite historically horrible results in trying to improve the economy.

THE strongest recovery of any country in the world of any significance, except for Germany. Perhaps you would have preferred the methods they employed...

[Gob]

Good news for Obama.

The Dow Jones index in New York has closed at its highest level for more than four years after data showed US manufacturing was stronger than expected in April.

The Institute for Supply Management (ISM) said its index of manufacturing activity rose to 54.8 last month from 53.4 in March.

A figure above 50 indicates expansion.

The Dow rose 66 points to finish the session at 13,279, its highest since 28 December 2007.

The index has been rising steadily since sinking below the 7,000 mark at the beginning of 2009, and broke back above 13,000 in February this year.

The Nasdaq and the Standard & Poor's 500 also closed higher on Tuesday.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17913029

[Gob]

More good news for Obama.

A openly gay spokesman for presidential candidate Mitt Romney has resigned on his first official day of work, amid criticism by anti-gay conservatives.

Richard Grenell, recently hired to speak on foreign affairs for the presumptive Republican nominee, announced his departure on Tuesday.

In a statement, Mr Grenell thanked Mr Romney for "his belief in me".

The spokesman had previously deleted about 800 tweets and took down his personal website.

According to the Washington Post Mr Grenell had come under fire for statements about Callista Gingrich and Michelle Obama.

The Romney campaign said it was "disappointed" that Mr Grenell had resigned.

"We wanted him to stay because he had superior qualifications for the position he was hired to fill," Romney campaign manager Matt Rhoades said in a statement.

Mr Grenell was criticised quickly after he was hired.

Bryan Fischer, director of issues analysis for the American Family Association, a group opposed to homosexuality, wrote a blog post on 20 April attacking Mr Romney's choice, saying it sent a "message to the pro-family community: drop dead".

Another writer in the conservative publication National Review argued that Mr Grenell's apparent obsession with gay marriage could damage the Romney campaign.

Contributor Matthew Franck suggested that the spokesman would switch to the Obama campaign if the president included support for same-sex marriage in his convention speech.

In a statement, Mr Grenell cited "personal reasons" for his decision to leave.

LGBT groups and surrogates for Mr Obama's campaign have argued he was forced out because of his sexual orientation.

"This is the kind of bigoted, anti-gay extremists a Romney administration would find itself held hostage to," pro-Obama super PAC founder Bill Burton told the Post.

The director of the gay Republican group Log Cabin Republicans said the spokesman had been "essentially hounded by the far-right and far-left".

"It is unfortunate that while the Romney campaign made it clear that Grenell being an openly gay man was a non-issue for the governor and his team," R Clarke Cooper said, "the hyper-partisan discussion of issues unrelated to Ric's national security qualifications threatened to compromise his effectiveness on the campaign trail."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-17917746

[BoSoxGal]

Way to go Repuglicans!

Please, keep allowing the Taliban wing of your party to run the agenda.

Next, Mitt needs to hire as spokespeople some womb-support-systems who openly use birth control, have advanced degrees and work outside the home for wages.

Let's talk about what really matters.

[dgs49]

So this "openly-gay" person agreed to come into the Romney campaign, but only if he received no criticism.

He had the full support of the candidate himself, who asked him not to resign. Yet he chose to resign.

And this is seen (by the nitwits here, apparently) as a failure of the Republican party.

Too bad we can't be as tolerant of differing opinions and lifestyles as the Dems.

Really.

[Scooter]

He resigned because anti-gay elements within the Republican Party were making such an issue of his sexual orientation that it risked becoming a distraction for the campaign, in spite of the putative nominee's alleged "support", which did not extend to telling the jackals to shut up and let the guy do his job.

And yes, it speaks volumes about the Republican Party that a person, regardless of his/her qualification, would be judged unfit to serve by a substantial segment of the party solely by reason of his sexual orientation.

[RayThom]

The big difference will depend on Mitt's running mate. Senator Marco Rubio... tepid. Senator Pat Toomey... GAME CHANGER!

Regardless, as far as my fair state of Pennsylvania in the good ol' United States of America, this will be a bellwether with Obama taking it by 4-5%.

In this fine mess of a global economy the voters will be going with the devil they know, or the devil they don't know. I'll have no problems "pulling the lever" for Obama. I predicted his eventual Presidential candidacy the day after his keynote address at the Democratic National Convention... back in 2004.

Sara Palin/Barbara Bachman... 2016.