And Kennedy decides to fuck us all

[Lord Jim]

I wouldn't be surprised if option 3 occurs, combined with allegations of character assassination of this "great American"

I wouldn't be surprised either, and from a political standpoint a strong case can be made that at this point it's the best of the lousy options available...(Kavanaugh could withdraw maintaining his innocence but saying something like he was doing so to "spare" his family and the country the "divisive distraction")

To have that nationally televised grilling of Ford (I don't know how she would come across, but the fact that she's a college professor suggests that she's no stranger to public speaking or fielding challenging questions) by the GOP male membership of the Senate Judiciary Committee (they have no female members on the panel) this close to the election would be a PR disaster...

I suspect that withdrawing the nomination would be something that McConnell at this point would be happy to embrace, the sooner the better...(Hell, if he could get it done soon enough, he might even try to take a shot at pushing through a new nominee before the election...)

The one who would no doubt have the toughest time accepting that course is Trump, who is always extremely reluctant to ever seem to be "giving in" on anything related to male mistreatment of women...(For obvious reasons)

Trump's "standard" in these sorts of situations is, "Always believe the man so long as he denies it, no matter how serious the accusation, how numerous the accusers, or how strong the evidence"...

Of course he has to adopt that standard, because it's the only one that gets him off the hook...

[Big RR]

Hell, if he could get it done soon enough, he might even try to take a shot at pushing through a new nominee before the election...)

I would hope the democrats could prevent that; if nothing else they could put Trump on the defensive for a while before he provides a new nominee, and then insist sufficient time for review and vetting be provided to prevent this embarrassment from happening again. In any event, I'd bet they could stretch it out without seeming too petulant or self interested.

[rubato]

Kavenaugh is loathsome and a dishonest party hack and I hope he does not get approved but I am not certain this is adequate reason.

1. He was a teenager and we are not adults at that age. It was a time of life when we are learning how to be adults and one way we learn is by making mistakes. This act may not bear on his adult identity and personality. Teenagers do stupid things they would not consider after 24yrs old.

2. We have a statute of limitations for a reason.

3. Whether she came forward in good faith or not she had missed her opportunity to seek 'justice'. I understand that there are psychological barriers to reporting sexual abuse.

4. If this had been a completed rape the crime and the injury would be worse.

5. I don't think she is lying but I am not as certain of the truth as I was with Anita Hill. And Anita Hill was abused by a mature adult lawyer.

I'm just raising questions but I think they are questions we need to address in the #Metoo movement as well.

yrs,
rubato

[rubato]

Hell, if he could get it done soon enough, he might even try to take a shot at pushing through a new nominee before the election...)

That may have been a tactical consideration in releasing this information so last; let the clock run out as far as possible.

yrs,
rubato

[Lord Jim]

That may have been a tactical consideration in releasing this information so last; let the clock run out as far as possible.

Gee, ya think?

(But as I pointed out the Dems handling the timing to maximize political advantage doesn't change the underlying facts; it's not like Mitch McConnell would have done it any differently if the positions had been reversed...)

I am not as certain of the truth as I was with Anita Hill. And Anita Hill was abused by a mature adult lawyer.

Hill's accusation was that Thomas had told a couple of juvenile one-liner dirty jokes in front of her (behavior that she apparently found so offensive at the time that after it allegedly happened, when Thomas was transferred to another department she asked to go with him and continue to work for him.)

Ford's accusations are sexual assault and attempted rape...

Personally, I don't have any difficulty figuring out which is worse...

I've read and heard a fair bit of commentary the past couple of days attempting to compare the Hill case to this one...

In my opinion, those comparisons are very unfair to Prof. Ford...

[Sue U]

Kavenaugh is loathsome and a dishonest party hack and I hope he does not get approved but I am not certain this is adequate reason.

1. He was a teenager and we are not adults at that age. It was a time of life when we are learning how to be adults and one way we learn is by making mistakes. This act may not bear on his adult identity and personality. Teenagers do stupid things they would not consider after 24yrs old.

Yeah, no. Sexual assault is sexual assault, whether 17 or 27 or 57 or 72. It is not part of normal development of interpersonal relations. But even if the incident could be attributed to some kind of rapey "youthful exuberance," Kavanaugh's decision now to double down on denial rather than apologize for his loutish drunken teenage behavior says he is still the arrogant douchenozzle jerk-bro he was in high school. There is a reason that the assaultive frat-pack jock was already a well-worn teen movie trope by the 1980s (think "Biff" in Back to the Future). Even teenagers know that shit is wrong.

2. We have a statute of limitations for a reason.

This is not about bringing criminal assault charges , so "statute of limitations" has NOTHING to do with it. This is about illuminating the character of a Supreme Court nominee, and whether he is the type of person this nation wants to have making rules for the rest of us.

3. Whether she came forward in good faith or not she had missed her opportunity to seek 'justice'. I understand that there are psychological barriers to reporting sexual abuse.

I have no idea what you mean by this. Coming forward means only that she has now chosen to subject herself and her family to the absolute worst kind of harassment, humiliation, character assassination and personal destruction imaginable.

4. If this had been a completed rape the crime and the injury would be worse.

So what? What does that have to do with whether Kavanaugh is an appropriate choice for Supreme Court Justice?

5. I don't think she is lying but I am not as certain of the truth as I was with Anita Hill. And Anita Hill was abused by a mature adult lawyer.

If she's not lying, what "truth" is it that you are "not as certain of"?

I'm just raising questions but I think they are questions we need to address in the #Metoo movement as well.

yrs,
rubato

What the actual fuck? Sexual assault is a criminal act. Full stop. It is not justified or excused by anyone's age or inebriation. The fact that such a crime may have occurred one, 10 or 20 years ago, or that it was not a "completed" rape, is irrelevant to the issues raised by the #MeToo movement.

The ONLY issue here is Brett Kavanaugh and his character, and where GOP Senators are willing to draw the line when it comes to securing power for "conservatives."

[Lord Jim]

Excellent post Sue...

Don't see a single thing to disagree with there...

[Crackpot]

It’s a shame it had to be said really.

[Big RR]

Great post Sue.

[Lord Jim]

These Republican Senators Want To Delay The Brett Kavanaugh Vote

Natalie Gontcharova
September 17, 2018, 8:50 AM

After Christine Blasey Ford went public with her account of Brett Kavanaugh attempting to rape her when they were teenagers, at least three Republican senators have sided with Democrats to say they want to put off voting on his Supreme Court nomination.

"I’ve made it clear that I’m not comfortable moving ahead with the vote on Thursday if we have not heard her side of the story or explored this further," Arizona Sen. Jeff Flake, who sits on the Senate Judiciary Committee, told the Washington Post. "For me, we can’t vote until we hear more." A committee vote was planned for Thursday.

Tennessee Sen. Bob Corker, asked by New York magazine whether the committee vote should be delayed until Ford gets her say, said, "I think that would be best for all involved, including the nominee. If she does want to be heard, she should do so promptly."

Sen. Lisa Murkowski of Alaska told CNN that the committee should consider delaying the vote. "This is not something that came up during the hearings. The hearings are now over, and if there is real substance to this, it demands a response. That may be something the committee needs to look into."

Because Republicans hold a 51-to-49 majority in the Senate, they can only afford to lose two votes against Kavanaugh's nomination. Sens. Murkowski and Susan Collins of Maine are said to be the two key GOP swing votes. Sen. Collins told CNN that she discussed the allegations over the phone on Friday with Kavanaugh, before Ford went public, but would not say whether she supports delaying the vote on his nomination.

https://www.refinery29.com/en-us/2018/0 ... naugh-vote

And one more so far this afternoon:

Roy Blunt: Kavanaugh Accuser’s Claims Must Be Addressed Before Vote

Sen. Roy Blunt (R-MO) joined the choir of his Republican colleagues calling for further review of the allegations recently raised against Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh, and said the confirmation vote should be delayed until then.

“There are serious allegations that need to be looked at closely by the committee before any action is taken,” he told the Kansas City Star.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/ ... -kavanaugh

[ex-khobar Andy]

From CNN: "Trump defended Kavanaugh as "one of the finest people I have ever known.""

That may even be true.

[rubato]

LJ;

You have forgotten the facts of the Anita Hill case, if you ever knew them. You probably just absorbed the Republilying.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Hill

The facts are just now emerging about the Kavanaugh case so a reasonable person would have to say that the truth in the Anita Hill case is better known.

Clarence Thomas was a 30+ year old adult when the abuse happened. He was unqualified, he had only been on the bench for 1.5 years. There were several others who confirmed Hills testimony. It was many instances over several years. Hill did not make a public accusation she was questioned by the FBI and her testimony was suppressed until Nina Totenberg revealed it to the press. And finally the fact that she followed him is not evidence it didn't happen it is evidence that the move was in accord with her career ambitions (actresses and Harvey Weinstein?) and that abused women often deceive themselves into thinking the abuse has stopped. And the time interval between the abuse and the hearings was about 10 years.

I do not accept the idea that a teenagers behavior is reflective of their character or judgement as an adult. I believe the social sciences support this very clearly. This is part of the reason we have age limits to be a Representative, Senator, Vice President and President. I don't accept that we can randomly use the acts of a child to punish an adult for the rest of their life.

yrs,
rubato

[Crackpot]

I wish I was surprised.

[BoSoxGal]

Having worked on juvenile justice system cases for almost two decades, I feel I have some authority on the subject. I agree with rubato that all of the brain science and social science tells us that young people are not as culpable as most adults (those who mature normally, without developmental delay) and therefore there is an emphasis on rehabilitation for youth offenders and for lesser offenses the ability to seal juvenile records to allow a youth offender a clean slate in adulthood.

That said, there are certain serious criminal offenses that almost all jurisdictions have provisions for charging juveniles as adults; violent sexual assault is very often one of those. Thus a 16-18 year old male accused of sexual assault - which this is, even absent successful penetration of the victim - would very likely face long term consequences beyond juvenile court. Of course, as a privileged white boy it would have been far more likely that the case would’ve been buried or softballed, especially since mommy was a judge. That said, in theory very serious consequences were available to address very serious behavior, including an expectation of allocution to the facts on the record, expression of contrition, and mandatory participation in offender therapy.

This isn’t typical teenage foolishness that falls under the umbrella of youthful hijinks. Anybody who doesn’t understand that sexual assault, especially violent assault, leaves lifelong scars for which there is no expungement process available to the victim is just missing a core component of what makes a fully realized, decent human being.

[Lord Jim]

Brett Kavanaugh, Christine Blasey Ford to testify on assault allegations in public Monday

Washington (CNN)The Republican leader of the Senate Judiciary Committee said on Monday he would convene remarkable new public hearings in a week's time after sexual assault allegations emerged against Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh.

Both Kavanaugh and the woman who has accused him of physical and sexual assault, Christine Blasey Ford, will testify before the panel, setting up a blockbuster event that could decide Kavanaugh's fate.

The announcement, made under pressure from lawmakers to fully examine the new claims, will delay what had been a glide path toward confirmation for President Donald Trump's nominee. The political stakes for the White House and members of Congress are enormous as the #MeToo movement galvanizes women ahead of key congressional elections in November.

Kavanaugh spent more than nine hours at the White House Monday, huddling behind closed doors with his confirmation team.

An official working closely with his team described Kavanaugh as "shaken, but focused," with the conversation revolving around "defending his integrity."

Whether Kavanaugh becomes the newest Supreme Court justice will depend largely on his and Ford's performances in front of the Judiciary panel and a national television audience. Before the hearings were announced, both indicated they were willing to testify about the allegations.

"Judge Kavanaugh looks forward to a hearing where he can clear his name of this false allegation. He stands ready to testify tomorrow if the Senate is ready to hear him," White House spokesman Raj Shah said in a statement Monday.

The dueling testimony could threaten Trump's attempt to install a conservative in the place of frequent swing vote Justice Anthony Kennedy, potentially altering the balance of the court for a generation.

At the White House, Trump said he's open to a delay in order to keep the process going and eventually confirm Kavanaugh.

"Judge Kavanaugh is one of the finest people that I've ever known. He is an outstanding intellect and outstanding judge respected by everybody. Never had even a little blemish on his record," Trump said. "If it takes a little delay, it'll take a little delay."

https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/17/politics ... index.html

Should pull big ratings...

(Though a lot can happen in a week; if another shoe drops this wont be taking place...)

[BoSoxGal]

This is going to be a bigger shit show than the Hill headings in ‘91, especially since the atmosphere in Congress is SO much more toxic today. Another generation of young women are about to be scarred by the realization that their country is run largely by misogynist scumbags.

That’s my prediction, anyway. I would love nothing more than to be wrong.

[Joe Guy]

The fact that her experience was discussed in a couple's therapy session in 2012 ought to be enough to convince anyone that the experience has had a lifelong affect on Christine Ford. My years of education and my experience in letting people know just how much I know makes me somewhat of an authority on this and many other subjects.

The scary truth is that it is very possible that Kavanaugh, a person who may be put in a lifelong position on the supreme court, may have already placed someone else in a lifelong position of irreparable mental anguish. That's why the truth needs to be revealed.

[Big RR]

The problem with scheduling it so close is that there is essentially no time to investigate the charges and view any evidence that exists. From the account, it appears one of his friends was also present int he room, and this should be investigated. Likewise, people who cold place him at the party should be interviewed, as well and anyone who might have seen Ford leave and could comment on whether she appeared upset. there is a lot to look at, and the republicans want to cram the hearing through in a few days. This is a guy up for a lifetime appointment on one of the most prestigious judicial bodies in the world--it merits a full investigation. We should be better than this, but I predict we will not be.

[Bicycle Bill]

Another generation of young women are about to be scarred by the realization that their country is run largely by misogynist scumbags.

"It is better to light a candle than to curse the darkness."

Is this your idea of lighting a candle?  Automatically accepting the word of anyone who does not possess a Y-chromosome and heaping abuse, condemnation, and draconian punishments on anyone — past, present, or future — who you have somehow, omnisciently pre-determined to be a 'misogynist scumbag' ?  If so, it will remain just one candle that does nothing to dispel the greater darkness.

We'd love to hear your long-term solution.

Or is it your idea to swing the pendulum and replace the 'misogynist scumbags' with a similar crop of misandristic douche-bags with lesbian tendencies?  Yeah, I'm sure that'll work out just fine and dandy too.

-"BB"-

[wesw]

well, from what I have seen reported...

the Washington post reporter says....

her husband remembers her mentioning kavanaugh by name, and that she was concerned about him being elevated to the supreme ct.

and that the med notes Don T mention his name and says that there were 4 people there....

she says the notes were written incorrecting

and that she was adamant that she wanted anonymity, but retained a high profile lawyer, and took a polygraph in august....

hmmmm.....

I have also seen 65 women stick with him, including his girlfriends from college and high school.

also the way Feinstein played this is certainly fishy and dishonest

I would like to see her therapist testify and HER high school mates..., and her hubby.

this stinks to high heaven as did the anita hill fiasco.

it looks like a political hitjob, at this point, to me.

if she does not show up Monday, she will have zero credibility.

as of now I believe that she was not really so adamant about anonymity, she told loads of people recently about what she was doing.

so her honesty is already in doubt for me.