Meltdown! in Japan

[liberty]

Wind power will never be useful for baseload and will never be economically viable without massive government subsidies.

I agree DGS, for the exception of the great plains and a few other areas around the country wind power will never be economically feasible. In this case the answer is not capitalism or free enterprise but socialism: The government could set up a program and draft young people eighteen to twenty years old to provide the vast amount of the needed labor and flood the country with wind generates. I know what you going the say, the government can’t do any thing right, but I disagree; if the Nazis could do it we can and we don’t have to use their brutal methods.

[Crackpot]

THere are many areas where wind is feasible and makes shitloads of money (baseloead not withstanding) still it suffers form NIMBY. Giant fans probuce noise and can be seen for great distances who knew!

Not to mention if you're going to complain about subsidies you shouldn't be contrasting it to Neuclear.

[oldr_n_wsr]

Those that live on the south shore (and those that just visit Jones Beach state park) have been puting up obstacles for a proposed off shore windmill farm. I find it hard to believe that even the masive size of the windmills being propsed that they would be much more than specs on the horizon at 5 miles out in the Atlantic.
I do know that even if built the cost of the electricity will be almost twice that generated by conventional methods (diesel/natural gas fired plants).

[Crackpot]

At five miles you will definiyly be able to see them. I just have yet to see one I'd classify as an eysore

[liberty]

Those that live on the south shore (and those that just visit Jones Beach state park) have been puting up obstacles for a proposed off shore windmill farm. I find it hard to believe that even the masive size of the windmills being propsed that they would be much more than specs on the horizon at 5 miles out in the Atlantic.
I do know that even if built the cost of the electricity will be almost twice that generated by conventional methods (diesel/natural gas fired plants).

Why would the electivity cost twice as much? Once the wind generators are built and installed the only expense left would the loan payment and routine maintenance. Have I missed something?

[Crackpot]

Maintenance and volume conventional methods produce far more power per unit Then again wind turbines still havn't hit their "economy of scale" that i s to say if they were producing more their cost would drop.

[rubato]

Wind power will never be useful for baseload and will never be economically viable without massive government subsidies.

I agree DGS, for the exception of the great plains and a few other areas around the country wind power will never be economically feasible. In this case the answer is not capitalism or free enterprise but socialism: The government could set up a program and draft young people eighteen to twenty years old to provide the vast amount of the needed labor and flood the country with wind generates. I know what you going the say, the government can’t do any thing right, but I disagree; if the Nazis could do it we can and we don’t have to use their brutal methods.

Wind requires a far smaller government subsidy than nuclear and far lower risk.

It is already a large part of the mix in the US and Europe and rapidly growing.


yrs,
rubato

[oldr_n_wsr]

Why would the electivity cost twice as much? Once the wind generators are built and installed the only expense left would the loan payment and routine maintenance. Have I missed something?

Amortizing their cost over their lifetime and such, and yes loans, Also maintenance which will be markedly higher as they are out in the ocean thus more often and harder to get to and work on.

[rubato]

Only a fraction of wind is envisioned to be on the water and currently there is almost none afaik.

Dismantling old wind machines is cheap and safe compared to old reactors which cost billions.



yrs,
rubato