Trump's Playing With His Military Toys!

BoSoxGal · Post by **BoSoxGal** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:42 am

Just dropped 60 Tomahawk missiles on an airfield in Syria. No response yet from Russia, who warned us not to.

What are we in for now?!

What was the legal justification in national or international law?!

No need to talk to Congress?!

I guess we won't be talking about Trump's ties to Russia for the next few days . . .

Joe Guy · Post by **Joe Guy** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:53 am

Trump is wagging the dog. He has been a dog wagger all his life so this is consistent. Let's hope he doesn't have an itchy nuke finger....

Lord Jim · Post by **Lord Jim** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:54 am

Just dropped 60 Tomahawk missiles on an airfield in Syria.

I hope not on an empty airfield...

No need to talk to Congress?!

No, none at all...

The War Powers Act does not require prior notification...

My concern here is that we may have acted in an insufficient manner...

ETA:

We should take out Assad's air force...

We should have done it four years ago before the Russians even got directly involved, and before Obama made that joke of a deal brokered by Vladimir Putin assuring us that Assad was giving up his chemical weapons...

(Good Lord, how naive does one have to be to believe that was really going to happen?

He's barrel bombed chemical weapons on his people almost non-stop since he bought into that "agreement"; this is just the first time he's gone so far as to use something like sarin...)

ETA II:

We need to tell the Russians...

Get your personnel out of there; we're taking this sonuvabitch down...

Guinevere · Post by **Guinevere** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:01 am

The War Powers Act has limited scope, and applies to national emergencies or where the United States has been attacked. It is not a blank check to override the constitutional separation of powers concerning war.

That being said, I'm willing to make a deal with the Trumpanzee --- get every single refugee and civilian out of Syria that wants to get out, get them somewhere safe (i.e. not some horrible camp in northern Iraq), and make it possible for them to come to the United States if they wish, and then bomb the hell out of Assaad and his military assets.

BoSoxGal · Post by **BoSoxGal** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:19 am

The hypocrisy of his speech lamenting the deaths of children and babies in that chemical attack in light of his refusal to allow Syrian refugees to come here is SICKENING.

Lord Jim · Post by **Lord Jim** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:46 am

The War Powers Act has limited scope, and applies to national emergencies or where the United States has been attacked.

Please...

The War Powers Act has never been tested in court, and for good reason...

Neither the Congress nor the Executive has wanted to test its Constitutionality...

(BTW, I have no idea where you've come up with this "national emergency" thing...that's a new one..

)

The courts have made clear, for many years, in numerous decisions, that if the Congress wishes to thwart a military action taken by the Executive, its power rests in, "the power of the purse"...

ie, if the Congress wants to end a military action taken by the President, then all they have to do is refuse to fund it...

Of course this rarely happens, (and this fact drives the "THE PRESIDENT CAN'T USE MILITARY FORCE WITHOUT A DECLARATION OF WAR! THAT'S UNCONSTITUTIONAL!" idiots nuts...

)

Guinevere · Post by **Guinevere** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:58 am

Lord Jim wrote:
The War Powers Act has limited scope, and applies to national emergencies or where the United States has been attacked.
Please...

The War Powers Act has never been tested in court, and for good reason...

Neither the Congress nor the Executive has wanted to test its Constitutionality...

(BTW, I have no idea where you've come up with this "national emergency" thing...that's a new one.. )

I got it from the War Powers Act dearie -- what you cited in support of your "view" of executive power. The language of the statute 15 USC 1541 states:

(c) Presidential executive power as Commander-in-Chief; limitation

The constitutional powers of the President as Commander-in-Chief to introduce United States Armed Forces into hostilities, or into situations where imminent involvement in hostilities is clearly indicated by the circumstances, are exercised only pursuant to (1) a declaration of war, (2) specific statutory authorization, or (3) a national emergency created by attack upon the United States, its territories or possessions, or its armed forces.

So much for strict construction.....

PS - you might try reading the rest of it (sections 1542-1544 as well. You could learn something useful).

RayThom · Post by **RayThom** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 4:06 am

BoSoxGal wrote:Just dropped 60 Tomahawk missiles on an airfield in Syria. No response yet from Russia, who warned us not to... What are we in for now?!...

My guess? Hours of endless transcripts and videos highlighting Trump's 'golden shower' tryst at the Moscow Ritz Carlton.

BoSoxGal · Post by **BoSoxGal** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 4:20 am

Trump & his supporters:

Gob · Post by **Gob** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 4:43 am

That looks like Hillary.

rubato · Post by **rubato** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 5:05 am

Military retaliation against Assad is the right thing to do. Obama should have, and would have, done the same but he made the mistake of asking for support from the (Republican led) congress. They pussied out.

The de minimus response is to eradicate a military airfield.

yrs,
rubato

Bicycle Bill · Post by **Bicycle Bill** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 5:09 am

RayThom wrote:
BoSoxGal wrote:Just dropped 60 Tomahawk missiles on an airfield in Syria. No response yet from Russia, who warned us not to... What are we in for now?!...
My guess? Hours of endless transcripts and videos highlighting Trump's 'golden shower' tryst at the Moscow Ritz Carlton.

Ah, yes ... the 'honey trap'. This is such an old tactic in spycraft and coercion that it already had long gray whiskers on it when it was used as a plot point in the 1957 James Bond novel "From Russia With Love" —

‘Oh, well. Not interested in that sort of thing myself. But they got some nice pictures of you two.’ Nash tapped his coat pocket. ‘Whole reel of 16-millimetre. That’s going into her handbag. It’ll look fine in the papers.’ Nash laughed — a harsh, metallic laugh. ‘They’ll have to cut some of the juiciest bits, of course.’

The change of rooms at the hotel. The honeymoon suite. The big mirror behind the bed. How well it all fitted! Bond felt his hands wet with perspiration. He wiped them down his trousers.

-"BB"-

BoSoxGal · Post by **BoSoxGal** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:25 am

How many points will Trump's approval rating climb by the end of April? Predict & discuss.

BoSoxGal · Post by **BoSoxGal** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:28 am

BREAKING NEWS: Putin calls US airstrikes on Syria an 'illegal act of aggression'

https://www.google.com/amp/www.dailymai ... ssion.html

Putin says relations between our countries are already in tatters; is this whole thing an elaborate ruse to distract and protect Trump from further congressional investigation?

Lord Jim · Post by **Lord Jim** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:45 am

is this whole thing an elaborate ruse to distract and protect Trump from further congressional investigation?

If it is, it wont succeed...that investigation, as it should, has its own relentless process that will go forward...

That having been said, I have to say that I am glad to see some action at least being taken against Assad, and I whole heartedly approve of it...

The Rand Pauls of the world who are saying we shouldn't even have done this much can get stuffed in my view...(Once again, The Junior Senator From Kentucky has validated my conviction that he is utterly unfit for the Presidency)

I take second place to no one in my condemnation of, and criticism for, Donald Trump...

But on this one, I applaud his actions, and the only criticism I have is that he didn't go far enough...

Lord Jim · Post by **Lord Jim** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 8:01 am

BoSoxGal wrote:How many points will Trump's approval rating climb by the end of April? Predict & discuss.

Trump will definitely get an uptick in his approval rating...

Any time the POTUS (any POTUS) launches a military attack against an evil villain who has been caught gassing children, their approval rating will go up...

It's very difficult to imagine not approving of that...

The only disapproval I have in this case is that I don't think we have done nearly enough...

It's a pin prick; we should have destroyed Assad's air force...

But at least it's a step in the right direction...

Big RR · Post by **Big RR** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:34 pm

rubato wrote:Military retaliation against Assad is the right thing to do. Obama should have, and would have, done the same but he made the mistake of asking for support from the (Republican led) congress. They pussied out.

The de minimus response is to eradicate a military airfield.

yrs,
rubato

Perhaps, but then to what end? To drive Assaad from power? And replace him with what? We saw how well that worked in Iraq and Afghanistan. Or maybe to send a warning--but of what? Just to bluster blindly into putting American troops at risk for some ill-defined policy and objective is not a proper response IMHO.

And as for military action, it is (or should be) only a prelude to a well-planned and likely peace, otherwise it's just saber rattling and the rest of the world knows it. You would think out recent debacles would have taught us that, but it seems we refuse to learn. We refer to go in swinging with no plan or goal, and then leave when we get tired of it. And the Trumpster seems to fit this profile in just about everything he does.

Burning Petard · Post by **Burning Petard** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:29 pm

59 Tomahawk missiles hit a Syrian military air base. (I am guessing one more fired but it missed) Each carrying one thousand pounds of conventional explosive. Pictures from European news sources show the two runways not hit (no big deal, those usual craters can be filled and covered in half a day) Six airplanes survived. Lots of damage to surrounding buildings.

Leaves me to conclude this was more stupid americans trusting big technology to fix it all without risking any American blood. While the actual damage is probably enuff to make the Syrians, Iranians, Russians really pissed, but not hurt them very much.

snailgate.

wesw · Post by **wesw** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:47 pm

did Obama get an authorization for use of force from congress before he went after the Libyan forces?

I can t recall him doing so, but my I may have forgotten.

I m not taking either side, but the left is nothing if not inconsistent.

they seem to believe that no one has memories.

the gorsuch nomination is but one example of the Dems abounding hypocrisy.

don t get me started on the cowardly GOP, who seem too frightened to govern....

or john mc cain pounding the table and demanding war yet again......

and Sweden s govt is lousy with cowardice and dishonesty , just to stay current and international.....

Lord Jim · Post by **Lord Jim** » Fri Apr 07, 2017 2:45 pm

Frankly, when the story of this sarin attack first broke, I fully expected Lord Dampnut to accept the shameless Russian lie ("it happened because of a bombing raid on a chemical weapons cache held by the rebels") and say something like:

"Well, this is terrible but we have no idea who did it. Our so-called 'intelligence services' claim it was Assad, but they don't really know. Remember how wrong they were about WMD in Iraq? Maybe it was Assad, but who knows?"

But first through Nikki Haley's superb performance at the UN, and then also through Tillerson, and finally by his own words at his joint press conference with King Abdullah, for once he fully and unreservedly embraced the truth... and put the blame exactly where it belonged...

Trump actually accepting facts...how weird is that?

You would think out recent debacles would have taught us that

What the tragedy of Syria should have taught us, is the terrible cost that is paid when the United States refuses to act...

Our failure to move swiftly to support the rebels when the uprising first began, (establishing a no fly zone along the Turkish border, sending in training personnel and equipment to support the pro-democracy rebels who were the first to oppose Assad, etc.) created a power vacuum that was filled by the Islamist "JV team" on the one hand, and ultimately by the Russians on the other...

The result has been the creation of a Jihadist "Caliphate", hundreds of thousands dead, and the largest refugee crisis (six million and counting...1/3 of Syria's total population) since the aftermath of The Second World War...

This is the price tag for American inaction...

Trump was quite correct when he faulted Obama for this, (but as usual, Il Boobce is a very poor messenger...he actually opposed US action at the time)...

When Obama got cold feet after he failed to have enough juice with the Brits to get them to join in the "line in the sand" military action he promised, (the first time in 70 years that a US government was unsuccessful in getting requested support from our closest ally) and then climbed down from his decision and came up with this bizarre idea that he needed a congressional resolution to take action, (something that no President in American history had ever sought for a military operation of this limited scale) he committed the worst foreign policy blunder of his Presidency...

NO ONE in the political leadership on The Hill on either side was arguing that he needed Congressional approval for what he was proposing. In fact just the opposite; John Boehner and Mitch McConnell both publicly said they supported his proposed action, that it was within his prerogative as Commander-In-Chief, and saw no requirement for any Congressional approval...(the only ones arguing that congress needed to be involved were fringe morons like Rand Paul)

Then after that completely unforced error, he followed it up with two weeks of him and Kerry making a strangely incoherent and contradictory case for the airstrikes... ("The attacks will be unimaginably small"..."no the US doesn't do 'pin pricks'"...

)

And then he capped it all off with the biggest boneheaded play of all...

Signing on to a deal brokered by Vladimir Putin...

Yeah that'll work...

So that's how we got where we are, but as I said before, we are where we are...

The only good thing that can be said for that bogus deal is that it provided the justification for the action taken last night, (and any subsequent actions)

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