Election 2020

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Econoline
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Econoline »

A *LOT* has happened in politics in these few short weeks, none of it good. :evil: :cry: :? I'm still really bummed out from Liz Warren's departure yesterday...and I'll probably stay that way for a while. As one comment I saw put it, she should've at least stayed in until after March 15, because one (or both) of those oooold geezers might just keel over right on the podium during the debate...



And Tulsi Gabbard is still running? How can that be? :loon
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Crackpot
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Crackpot »

As much as I don’t like it the departure of Buttigeg and Klobashaur (I know I butchered those names but I don’t he even the time or inclination to correct) made sense. If the moderates didn’t clear the field Sanders would win the nomination and probably lose the election. I don’t think people are willing to bet on an unknown quantity again. (Especially given how the last one turned out). Now Trump is known and the effects of his mistakes have yet to be felt by those who don’t look beyond their immediate surroundings.
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

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Guinevere
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Guinevere »

Image

Leaving this here to remind ourselves what was lost and what might have been.

Being left with two old white men in their late 70s is not progress.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

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Bicycle Bill
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Bicycle Bill »

Just reminding you that Mayor Pete was not an "old white man in his 70s" either.
Or are you saying that no one with a 'Y' chromosome should even be considered as a presidential candidate?
Image
-"BB"-
Yes, I suppose I could agree with you ... but then we'd both be wrong, wouldn't we?

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Guinevere
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Guinevere »

1. Stop putting words in my mouth. 2. Learn how to read. 3. Stop playing the fucking victim.

ETA: no, I had no clue that Mayor Pete wasn’t in his 70s. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

Big RR
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Big RR »

Being left with two old white men in their late 70s is not progress.
Compared with Trump, Methuselah would not only be progress, it would be a revolution.

the sad thing is that I'm not sure either Bernie or Joe can beat Trump, especially if they keep beating each other up. I will support either of them over Trump, but then I can't think of anyone I wouldn't support over him.

And I have to say I am extremely pleased that Warren didn't leave the race until she forced Bloomberg out. She did us all a great favor.

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Guinevere
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Guinevere »

Trump took us back to the 30s and 40s. Bernie and Biden get us to the 80s and 90s. That’s not progress, just relativity.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

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BoSoxGal
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Re: Election 2020

Post by BoSoxGal »

Guinevere wrote:Image

Leaving this here to remind ourselves what was lost and what might have been.

Being left with two old white men in their late 70s is not progress.
:cry:



I wish Biden had sat it out.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan

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MajGenl.Meade
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Re: Election 2020

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

24 hours from Tulsi . . .
.
. . . dropping out????
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

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Crackpot
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Crackpot »

I think Joe can win he has demonstrated some ability to cut through Trumps crap
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.

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MajGenl.Meade
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Re: Election 2020

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

I think it will be Biden and that's a big sigh of relief. At least I can vote for him.
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

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Scooter
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Scooter »

The Privilege of Saying You’re A “_______ or Bust” Progressive

MARCH 6, 2020 / JOHN PAVLOVITZ

Progressives don’t need Donald Trump’s to defeat us.

We’re doing fine on our own.

The enmity and ugliness of the Democratic primary season has been off the charts, and particularly shortsighted given the fierce adversary we’re facing, how much damage the infrastructure of our nation has sustained—and how fully complicit the Republican Party has been in enabling the degradation of our planet, the perverting of our courts, and the dismantling of our systems over the past three-plus years.

It’s been sickening by any measure decent people use.

And yet somehow, despite the historic atrocities they’ve witnessed and despite how much pain so many people are in and despite the brazen, unchecked criminality in the White House—apparently there are progressives who are fine allowing it to continue for another four years. They’re perfectly willing to subject humanity to another season of abject brutality if their guy doesn’t get the nomination.

If you ever want to see privilege personified, there it is.

Having a Democratic candidate who is a deal breaker, or threatening to opt out if your chosen candidate isn’t on the ballot in November is a clear and vociferous declaration that the current Administration has not that adversely affected you yet. It is confirmation that you are insulated enough from harm that you can be that cavalier with your vote or your lack of it, that you’re prepared to endure 1,460 more days of this.

This is the very heart of privilege: to look at the state of this nation, at the unprecedented lawlessness of this administration, the stratospheric malevolence of this president—and still decide you’ll be fine with it continuing so that you can make a point.


Declaring “Bernie or Bust” or “Biden or Bust” (or “Anyone or Bust” to this point), is a sure sign that you don’t fully comprehend or appreciate what bust looks like for truly vulnerable people right now—and what it would become the further down the road we go.

Bust, is children taken from their parents and placed in cages and being refused medical care and affection and decency.

Bust, is terminally ill people having to choose between staying alive and keeping their homes.

Bust, is decades of protections for the air and the water and wildlife and habitat tossed into the garbage.

Bust, is Muslims and atheists and Jewish people, and every other non-Christian human, being subjugated to a nationalist, white supremacist Evangelicalism.

Bust, is women losing autonomy over their own bodies and healthcare decisions.

Bust, is a Judiciary that is being rapidly polluted, looted, and repopulated with bigots, sycophants, and Republican shills who have no interest in justice.

Bust, is a CDC woefully unprepared for public health crises.

Bust, is an Administration slowly closing off access to the Free Press and manufacturing and broadcasting fictional propaganda.

Bust, is LGBTQ people daily losing hard-fought rights and protections in their workplaces, in the military, in their communities.

Bust, is Native American burial sites bulldozed for pipelines and border walls.

Bust, is an unchecked President and Republican-controlled Congress having no limits on their unabated cruelty for another four years.

This is what bust looks like.

If you can view this as acceptable collateral damage of you a making a point about how much you love your guy—you don’t have that much skin in the game or you haven’t studied history or you aren’t paying attention yet.

Some people don’t have that option.


Fathers living in churches under sanctuary right now aren’t able to let this President have his way for another term to make a point.
Transgender teenagers don’t have the luxury of letting their vote be a middle finger to the Democratic candidate they have an issue with.
Families with children with preexisting conditions aren’t able to play chicken with their purity politics.
The marginalized and vulnerable people continually assailed by this Administration likely aren’t arguing over whether one guy is establishment or another guy is a socialist: they know that the guy across from both of them is a tyrant, and the only thing that matters is his removal.

I’m not saying the “_______ or busters” don’t have struggles or ideals or valid criticisms of the system, and I’m not saying they shouldn’t passionately advocate for their candidate of choice during the Primary. I’m saying that at the end of the day, if they refuse to strategically consolidate their voices with other like hearted people, they’re ultimately willing to gamble using other people’s lives—and that’s not something anyone should be proud enough of to punctuate social media posts with.

Yes, the two-party system is restrictive and it’s antiquated and perpetuating systemic inequities, but the only way that system will be changed is through Democratic control of the system, right now, period. The Dems aren’t the sole answer, but they are the mechanism to us buying time to find it.

A revolution of policy or a renaissance of humanity cannot happen without participation in and access to the process—and we all will lose that access if we do not move in concert right now. Yes, some people are opting out because they feel no party offers them hope, but our responsibility is to energize them and to secure the opportunity to fix what is broken together. We need to stop using false equivalencies—because there is nothing comparable to the malevolence of this presidency.

I believe progressives, liberals, and moderates can and will figure out how to navigate our differences and to build an America that everyone can feel ownership of—but we need to space to do that.

This is a historic spot in our national history and we don’t have the luxury of using it as leverage to have everything we want right now. So no, I won’t be okay with protest votes or abstaining from voting or privileged purity stances while America is burning.

In this moment, we cannot allow a man so bereft of decency and a party so complicit in inhumane acts on his behalf, to possess it for another four years, because we will have lost the method of speaking at all.

Donald Trump is a threat to public safety. He is a bigot and a predator and he will not relent in destroying this nation for profit, and the Republican Party has proven they will ride his coattails into fascism.

We need to stop using him a threat or an ultimatum.

America deserves better than that.
"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're on the menu."

-- Author unknown

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Guinevere
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Guinevere »

Yup.

From a friend:
1. You're not just voting for President.

2. You're voting for who replaces RBG on the Supreme Court.

3. You're voting for the next Secretary of Education.

4. You're voting for federal judges.

5. You're voting for the rule of law.

6. You're voting for saving national parks.

7. You're voting for letting kids out of cages.

8. You're voting for clean air and clean water.

9. You're voting for scientists to be allowed to speak about climate change.

10. You're voting for what a President says and does on Twitter.

11. You're voting for housing rights.

12. You're voting for LGBTQ people to be treated with dignity.

13. You're voting for non-Christians to be able to adopt and to feel like full citizens.

14. You're voting for Dreamers.

15. You're voting so that there will be Social Security and Medicare when you retire.

16. You're voting for veterans to get the care they deserve.

17. You're voting for rural hospitals.

18. You're voting so that someone else can have health insurance.

19. You're voting for the preservation of PBS.

20. You're voting to have a President who doesn't embarrass this country every time she or he attends an international meeting.

21. And you're voting against allowing the USA to become yet another authoritarian regime.

22. You're voting for sensible gun laws.

No Democrat is perfect.

Your first AND second choices may have dropped out. Your third might. But the nominee, no matter who she or he is, won't be perfect. They won't pass your purity test. And yet every single one of them will be better than four more years of Trump!!!

Please be reasonable.
Neither my first, second, third, fourth, or even fifth choice is left standing. Both dinosaurs remaining are are near the bottom of my choices. I do prefer one over the other, but not by much. But regardless, in November I will be voting for the old white man the Dems nominate. And more than that, I’ll be sending him money and probably even volunteering for the campaign all summer and fall.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

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BoSoxGal
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Re: Election 2020

Post by BoSoxGal »

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan

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Scooter
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Scooter »

Image
"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're on the menu."

-- Author unknown

rubato
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Re: Election 2020

Post by rubato »

On the whole I think the dems showed restraint in their attacks on each other, with a few lapses. Warrens' attack on Buttagieg (sp?) attending a fundraising dinner in a wine cave showed really bad judgement on her part.

They need to step away from attacking the rich as a class of people and attack the laws which drive the widening economic gap instead. Attacking the class of people whips up a desire for revenge rather than repair. Appealing to primitive emotions leads to primitive and often harmful actions.

On the bright side I hear the Trump has grabbed the third rail by promising to cut SS and Medicaid.

yrs,
rubato

Burning Petard
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Burning Petard »

On the other hand, It was postulated on Cobert last night that we are all in a giant scientific experiment: will ordinary people listen to scientists and wash their hands?

Bye Don 2020 (copy right Mike Lukavich)

snailgate.

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Joe Guy
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Joe Guy »

Not being happy with two candidates because they are white men in their 70s is not progress. It's interesting how members of a party that wants to be known as all inclusive can't accept two people based on their age, sex and color.

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Econoline
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Econoline »

With a few exceptions (none of them female) it's been old white men over and over and over for a couple of centuries. Even if you loooove a certain food, if you eat it every day for a hundred years you'll probably be in the mood for something different tonight. (Especially if something different and delicious was on the menu until just before you were ready to order.)
People who are wrong are just as sure they're right as people who are right. The only difference is, they're wrong.
God @The Tweet of God

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Joe Guy
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Re: Election 2020

Post by Joe Guy »

To me it sounds like a lot of poor losers trying to blame their favorite candidate's lack of appeal on the people who get the majority of the votes. It takes more than being young, a minority, gay or female to get elected president. I think Abraham Lincoln said that on Twitter back in the day...

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