2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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Big RR
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by Big RR »

While I could vote for him over Trump (then again, who would not fit this bill?), his lack of any real experience at the national (or even state) level does concern me. A cabinet position could help here, as would any significant legislative experience in either house of Congress or ven experience in the governor's office.

I do not think serving as the mayor of a small to medium city like South Bend is any way way "as relevant as any experience that I could have in a legislative job in Washington".

One thing Trump showed us is that experience of some sort is needed for the job. And while I appreciate the earnestness of his intentions, just wanting to do a good job is unsifficient; if it were, Jimmy Carter woudl be among our greatest presidents.

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Sue U
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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RayThom wrote:I'd be quite happy with a Warren/Buttigieg ticket but I don't think that will resonate with the majority of Dem voters. I do hope that Pete will be offered a key Cabinet position, thereby further honing his skill for a run for president in 2028.

My gut feeling tells me it will be Biden/Warren, and if they should win, Biden will pass up a second term and let Warren make the run in 2024. And maybe Pete will get the nod for Veep.

It's time.
Warren is not interested in playing second fiddle to Biden and the Democratic Party base is done with Joe. Once the field thins some more, you'll see Biden's numbers continue to slide and the other "top tier" candidates rise. It's way too early to predict who will be on the ticket, but I think we can start talking about who won't.
GAH!

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RayThom
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2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by RayThom »

Sue U wrote:... Warren is not interested in playing second fiddle to Biden and the Democratic Party base is done with Joe...
Yes, I know Warren's steadfast position here. I expect no less from a serious candidate. IF Biden gets the nod, Warren is smart enough to know which way the winds of her political future are blowing. She'll sign on with him.

Regardless, I'm voting for Mrs. Potato Head if somehow she becomes the Dem nominee.
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Scooter
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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Joe Guy
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by Joe Guy »

We need a candidate who is not a practitioner of tergiversation.

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Scooter
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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I don't see tergiversation (thanks for making me look up and use a new word, btw) as one of Buttigieg's qualities, do you see it differently?
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RayThom
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2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by RayThom »

Joe Guy wrote:We need a candidate who is not a practitioner of tergiversation.
But isn't that the basis for all political discourse?

The voters job is trying to chose the candidate who is the most forthcoming.
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Joe Guy
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by Joe Guy »

Scooter wrote:I don't see tergiversation (thanks for making me look up and use a new word, btw) as one of Buttigieg's qualities, do you see it differently?
No. At this point I believe his lack of tergiversation is what makes Buttigieg admirable.

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Lord Jim
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by Lord Jim »

Scooter wrote:Image
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That poll comparison is interesting in a couple of ways...(though it would be a mistake to read too much into the results of just one poll)

First, it suggests that at least for now, (at least in Iowa) Buttigieg is emerging as the alternative choice to Biden for the moderate/liberal center-left Democratic primary vote... (which is also the strongest general election lane)

His poll number rose by the same percentage that Biden's fell...

This makes sense; Buttigieg's positions on the major issues (healthcare, etc.) are much more aligned with Biden's then they are with Warren or Sanders...If you're a Biden supporter that's becoming concerned that Joe's getting to be too politically damaged , Buttigieg is a logical choice...

The other thing I think you see in that poll is the Sanders Heart Attack Effect...

Warren's number went up by exactly the same number that Sander's fell...

ETA:

Mayor Pete also has a much more rational and thoughtful (not to mention Constitutional) position on the subject of same sex marriage recognition and tax exempt status for churches than the desperate panderer, Beto O'Rourke:

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RayThom
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2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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Mayor Pete continually shows me why my contributions haven't gone to waste. The guy never fails to impress me.

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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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RayThom
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2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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“... Biden and Buttigieg may also be benefiting from the 52% of likely Democratic caucusgoers who say they would rather see their nominee advocate for proposals that have a good chance of becoming law even if they do not represent big change,” the Des Moines Register reports...
Warren isn’t surging. But Buttigieg is.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... tigieg-is/

Go Pete.
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rubato
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by rubato »

Glad to see Mayor Pete doing well. He is not my favorite candidate and has serious problems with black and Hispanic voters who are crucial demographics to win the WH.


yrs,
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RayThom
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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rubato wrote:Glad to see Mayor Pete doing well. He is not my favorite candidate and has serious problems with black and Hispanic voters who are crucial demographics to win the WH.
yrs,
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Or so "they" say.
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Lord Jim
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by Lord Jim »

RayThom wrote:
rubato wrote:Glad to see Mayor Pete doing well. He is not my favorite candidate and has serious problems with black and Hispanic voters who are crucial demographics to win the WH.
yrs,
rubato
Or so "they" say.
Well, if one looks at the polling, this is one of those rare occasions where rube's assertion is backed-up by actual data...

I have been very favorably impressed with Mayor Pete since the first time I saw him interviewed. (I believe I may have been one of the first people around here to post about him.) I did not expect to be particularly impressed with a 37 year old Mayor of a mid-sized city, but Buttigieg has a gravitas, poise, thoughtfulness, and depth of policy knowledge that belies his lack national political experience. If he is the nominee, I will happily vote for him over Donald Trump. (Much more happily than I would vote for Warren or Sanders.)

But that being said, he isn't my number one candidate because I'm looking for the absolute strongest possible candidate to beat Trump. And as unfair as it is, the fact that Mayor Pete is an openly gay man represents a political handicap in that regard; there's no denying that.

Not just with African Americans and Hispanics but across the board, there is going to be a percentage of voters (not a huge percentage, but a significant one in a close election) who simply will not vote for an openly gay man for President, period. That doesn't necessarily mean they will vote for Trump, but it may well mean they'll take a pass on voting for President at all...

One important mitigating factor that Pete has with this group of voters is his military record. Many of the same folks who would be extremely disinclined to vote for a gay man for President are also very respectful of military service, so this would help him cut down on the percentage that absolutely would not vote for him because of his sexual orientation. (And of course while he is gay, he's not trying to make that any kind of major focus of his campaign, and he also obviously doesn't come across as any sort of "flaming queen"...)

But even with these mitigating factors, there will still be a percentage...

And if the polling versus election night results on most of the gay marriage referendum votes that were held is any kind of guide, a lot of that vote will not show up in the polling...

In the case of the gay marriage referendums, the anti vote was consistently 2-4 percentage points higher in the election results than showed up in the final polls.. this represented folks who would not vote for legalizing gay marriage, but who also would not admit that to pollsters...

I think it's reasonable to assume that if Mayor Pete is the nominee, there will also be a "wont vote for an openly gay man for President, but also wont admit it to the pollsters" percentage of the vote out there,,,

Now just how big that percentage is, is pretty much a guess; those gay marriage referendums were held a few years back and attitudes have changed somewhat since then, but I seriously doubt that it has completely gone away...

None of this means that Mayor Pete can't win the election; (even with this factor, I believe he would still be a much stronger candidate than either Warren or Sanders, who are politically handicapped by holding extremely unpopular positions on some major issues)

But if one is going to be honest, the political reality is that this weighs against his being the strongest possible candidate to meet the existential imperative of defeating Donald Trump...

For Mayor Pete to be assured of victory, he's going to need to have a bigger lead in the polls than other candidates would need to make up for the "wont vote for an openly gay man for President, but also wont admit it to the pollsters" percentage...

Like I said, it's not fair, but it's the reality...
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

I recently watched a CNN piece during which all four or sixty-two talking heads twisted themselves into pretzels in an effort to explain why, in a Southern State, young Pete polled less among Democrats than a 3-day dead buzzard. South Carolina I think it was.

What CNN so obviously avoided was the suggestion of any relation whatsoever between black (they specifically focused on black) southern voters and gaiety. Now, who knows what the Butt-man will actually gain at the real polls when the action starts in February. Maybe he'll do really well. But I was incensed by CNN's PC bias in not mentioning what seems to be a factor for many voters* and I emailed them accordingly. Pusillanimous pussies.

*it's as good a reason as any other. I expect some people will vote for Pete because of his happy nature and we don't condemn them for it, eh? I don't, anyway.
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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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rubato wrote:Glad to see Mayor Pete doing well. He is not my favorite candidate and has serious problems with black and Hispanic voters who are crucial demographics to win the WH.


yrs,
rubato
I presently work in an area where POC who significantly outnumber old white people like me. One thing I have noted is that POC tend to be, largely, rather homophobic. They voice their homophobia, in a hush hush environment, much like many old white people discuss POC when no POC are around. One POC told me she loves Trump but she can't say that to other POC. I guess she told me because I am an old white person so I would be cool with her liking Trump. :?

Mayor Pete has my interest.

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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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RayThom
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2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

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Every endorsement counts.

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Re: 2020 Presidential Candidates: Pete Buttigieg

Post by Scooter »

Buttigieg addresses several of the criticisms that have been launched at him in the past while. Starts at about 24 minutes in and lasts about 42 minutes (lots of blank space on either end).



At 32:10 he is asked how if he thinks he can handle the torrents of abuse that Trump is sure to heap on him if he is the nominee. My favourite parts of his response:
I've also seen a lot worse incoming than a tweet fully of typos.
You can tell, by the way, that this president hasn't figured out what to do or say about me, although I will admit that it did bother me when he said that he dreams about me, because I don't know what exactly goes on in this president's dreams, but I am certain that I want absolutely nothing to do with them
But you should tune in to hear his delivery, because he really has mastered the art of twisting the knife while not looking as if he is hitting below the belt.
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