Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

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Will the court dismiss charges against Flynn?

No.
3
50%
Yes.
3
50%
 
Total votes: 6

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BoSoxGal
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by BoSoxGal »

Big RR wrote:
Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:09 pm
To anyone who is interested, I commend the Brief BSG linked, it's quite well written and persuasive and worth of a read (unlike the US attorneys brief previously linked in this thread).
I would also point out that it is double-spaced, contains several pages of case listings and footnotes so is not as voluminous as the page count would suggest.

Darren should be ignored in any further comments he makes on this subject unless he first reads this brief in full.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
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ex-khobar Andy
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by ex-khobar Andy »

From the Brief (and yes, well worth reading):
Flynn further admitted making additional materially false statements and omissions in FARA filings relating to his work for the principal benefit of the Republic of Turkey, though he was not charged for that conduct.
The charge which was not made - additional to the lying stuff - was that this work was while he was not registered as a foreign agent. If he wishes to withdraw his guilty plea on the lying thing, then the government has the right to resurrect the foreign agent business. Get the IRS involved. Manafort got 90 months total for these little efforts. That should cause Flynn to reconsider.

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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Darren »

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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by ex-khobar Andy »

Darren - re your signature line:
You know you're in great company when you, China, Iran and Russia all want Trump out of office.
I'm pretty sure that China and Iran want Trump out of office because he's a fucking idiot. Coincidentally, for precisely the same reason, Putin wants him to stay there.

From ABC's interview with Bolton:
Bolton told ABC News, which will broadcast the full interview on Sunday: "I think Putin thinks he can play him like a fiddle. I think Putin is smart, tough. I think…he sees that, he's not faced with a serious adversary here… I don't think he's worried about Donald Trump."

Darren
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Darren »

ex-khobar Andy wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:32 pm
Darren - re your signature line:
You know you're in great company when you, China, Iran and Russia all want Trump out of office.
I'm pretty sure that China and Iran want Trump out of office because he's a fucking idiot. Coincidentally, for precisely the same reason, Putin wants him to stay there.

From ABC's interview with Bolton:
Bolton told ABC News, which will broadcast the full interview on Sunday: "I think Putin thinks he can play him like a fiddle. I think Putin is smart, tough. I think…he sees that, he's not faced with a serious adversary here… I don't think he's worried about Donald Trump."
"A new proposal to clarify and expand U.S. sanctions on the Nord Stream 2 pipeline has been just introduced in the U.S. Senate. Spearheaded by Senators Ted Cruz (R) and Jeanne Shaheen (D) the bill has a rare bipartisan support. If expanded, the sanctions would impact all pipeline laying activities as well as companies that provide insurance, port facilities, or tethering services for pipeline laying vessels.

But the proposal is only one from a series of difficulties the NS2 pipeline has been currently facing. In December 2019 the pipeline’s construction stopped to a screeching halt only 100 miles (6%) away from being completed due to the first set of U.S. sanctions that targeted pipeline-laying vessels. And earlier that year the EU introduced a regulation that would make it difficult for Gazprom to own and operate the pipeline within the EU internal gas market."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/thebakersi ... 55594c7d1d
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Econoline
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Econoline »

From Charlie Pierce:
"We were too slow. Th' inimy got th' first cheat.”
—Finley Peter Dunne, Mr. Dooley’s Philosophy


The bag job is now complete. Bill Barr’s work is finally done. From CNN:
Despite Flynn twice pleading guilty for lying to the FBI about his conversations with then-Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak during the presidential transition, the Justice Department moved last month to dismiss the case against him. Sullivan did not immediately act, instead asking for a review of the decision. If unchallenged with further appeals, the ruling exonerates Flynn after he sought to change his plea and claimed innocence. The three-judge panel on the DC Circuit Court of Appeals decided the trial judge, Sullivan, didn't have enough reason to question the DOJ's prosecution decisions in this case. They also said Sullivan having a third-party attorney weigh in on Flynn's case, the former judge John Gleeson, isn't needed anymore.
They did it very neatly, and with complete confidence that the DC Court of Appeals was back there at shortstop. The judge who wrote the opinion, Neomi Rao, was appointed by this administration* to replace Brett Kavanaugh, when PJ and Squi’s pal got bumped up to The Show. (Her primary qualification was an apparent unfamiliarity with parts of the law.) And, in this decision, Rao has proven that she knows where her fundamental allegiance lies, and it’s not with the law, and she has put her court on the record as saying that a court may not question the government’s motives even if the government’s case is brought in bad faith. And Rao also established her Federalist Society Drama Queen credentials, as well. As Mark Joseph Stern pointed out, she actually reprimanded trial judge Emmet Sullivan for havin the audacity to “probe the government’s motives,” and she called Sullivan’s actions, “unprecedented intrusions into individual liberties.” Take a breath, Your Honor.

It is probable that the case now go en banc to the full court of appeals since the whole thing is so transparently designed to get Flynn off the hook, eliminate the prosecutor’s leverage over him, and obviate the need for a presidential pardon. But, so far, up to and including today’s decision, it is a case study in what a second term for this administration* would look like, and what the federal judiciary is going to look like for the next 30-40 years.
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Econoline
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Econoline »

William Barr's Law School Calls For His Censure, Investigation, And Resignation

Jun 23, 2020

The George Washington University Law School “with a heavy heart” calls for Barr to resign and be censured.

The George Washington University Law School released a statement on June 23, 2020 calling for Attorney General William Barr to resign, for Congress to censure him, and for the Justice Department’s Inspector General to investigate him.

Barr received a Juris Doctorate from the Law School in 1977, served on its board of advisors, and has previously been honored by the school.
  • “80% of the active full-time faculty with voting privileges” signed the letter, in addition to 18 emeritus professors, deans, and legal professionals.
  • The signers include members of “both major political parties, and of none.”
  • The statement also endorses the recommendation of 2,500 Department of Justice alumni from both Republican and Democrat administrations who call for Barr to resign, for Congress to censure him, and for an inspector general to begin a formal inquiry into his conduct.
The Law School’s statement cites the following as instances of Barr’s failure to uphold his constitutional oath to “support and defend the Constitution of the United States.” The signers assert that Barr
  • Deliberately misled Americans about the contents of Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s report,
  • Intervened in Roger Stone’s sentencing,
  • Interfered with the prosecution of Michael Flynn,
  • And violated civilians’ First Amendment right to assemble and protest at Lafayette Square on June 1, 2020.
The letter states, in part,
We feel a special obligation to speak out because of the long relationship Attorney General Barr has with our law school and our university… William Barr’s actions as Attorney General since 2019 have undermined the rule of law, breached constitutional norms, and damaged the integrity and traditional independence of his office and of the Department of Justice.

Read the statement.
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TPFKA@W
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by TPFKA@W »

Oops wrong thread.

Big RR
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Big RR »

What Barr fails to realize (or more likely ignores) is that the attorney general is the attorney for the people of the US, not just the president.

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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

Now we have the answer.

He's not been exonerated

He's been whitewashed.
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

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Guinevere
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Guinevere »

Just for the record, the GWU Law statement on Barr is not a statement “of the University” but of the faculty of the Law School. Two very very different animals (and I say that with love to the faculty, but also as a member of the governing board of my law school).

What shoddy reporting not to be clear about who is speaking.
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by ex-khobar Andy »

I'm not exactly sure what point you are making, Guin. The post from Econoline above makes it clear that the original statement was from the GWU Law School and when you go to the press release itself it says (in part) "The GWU Law statement . . . " Elsewhere the press release refers to the statement as "The GWU Law faculty statement . . ."

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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by ex-khobar Andy »

This is truly scary.

There is a video of Flynn and some of his family (??) reciting the QAnon catchphrase/oath/whatever: where we go one we go all. Check out the dress of the woman on the right of the frame. Of course Flynn's lawyer says it's a slogan Kennedy had on his boat. There is no confirmation of this; I really doubt that such committed Trumpists want to pay any sort of homage to JFK; and even if it were true, it's a bit like saying "Oh this swastika tattoo is a sacred Sanskrit meme and nothing to do with good-ole-boy Adolf."

So Flynn is not just a right wing nutjob somewhere on the usual spectrum; he's a delusional fucking conspiracy theorist who thinks that the world is controlled by paedophiles in legion with the Clintons, Soros and the Comet PIng Pong Pizza Parlor.

Lock him up.

Darren
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Darren »

ex-khobar Andy wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 3:11 am
This is truly scary.

There is a video of Flynn and some of his family (??) reciting the QAnon catchphrase/oath/whatever: where we go one we go all. Check out the dress of the woman on the right of the frame. Of course Flynn's lawyer says it's a slogan Kennedy had on his boat. There is no confirmation of this; I really doubt that such committed Trumpists want to pay any sort of homage to JFK; and even if it were true, it's a bit like saying "Oh this swastika tattoo is a sacred Sanskrit meme and nothing to do with good-ole-boy Adolf."

So Flynn is not just a right wing nutjob somewhere on the usual spectrum; he's a delusional fucking conspiracy theorist who thinks that the world is controlled by paedophiles in legion with the Clintons, Soros and the Comet PIng Pong Pizza Parlor.

Lock him up.
I've yet to read any info linking Soros. As for networks, the busts have been increasing. In case you missed it, the feds have placed increased emphasis on stopping any kind of sex trafficking along with porn involving children.

Wanna bet Flynn will be hired again by Trump?
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by ex-khobar Andy »

Darren wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 3:27 am
ex-khobar Andy wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 3:11 am
This is truly scary.

There is a video of Flynn and some of his family (??) reciting the QAnon catchphrase/oath/whatever: where we go one we go all. Check out the dress of the woman on the right of the frame. Of course Flynn's lawyer says it's a slogan Kennedy had on his boat. There is no confirmation of this; I really doubt that such committed Trumpists want to pay any sort of homage to JFK; and even if it were true, it's a bit like saying "Oh this swastika tattoo is a sacred Sanskrit meme and nothing to do with good-ole-boy Adolf."

So Flynn is not just a right wing nutjob somewhere on the usual spectrum; he's a delusional fucking conspiracy theorist who thinks that the world is controlled by paedophiles in legion with the Clintons, Soros and the Comet PIng Pong Pizza Parlor.

Lock him up.
I've yet to read any info linking Soros. As ever Google is your friend. Type in QAnon and Soros and the first hit I get (an LA Times piece) gives me this quote:
The QAnon conspiracy theory is founded on the belief that the world is run by a powerful group of evil politicians and celebrities including the Clintons, the Obamas, the Bushes, George Soros and Hollywood celebrities including Oprah Winfrey and Tom Hanks.
You may mean that you have yet to read any info linking Soros to the child porn people who are trying to take over the world and I agee, I have not seen that evidence. As for networks, the busts have been increasing. In case you missed it, the feds have placed increased emphasis on stopping any kind of sex trafficking along with porn involving children. I hadn't seen that and I'm pleased to hear it. But does that have anything to do with my point which is that Flynn appears to believe this shit?

Wanna bet Flynn will be hired again by Trump? I'm trying to get my head around the logic of this statement. If I say yes that means yes, I do want to bet that Flynn will be hired again by Trump which means that you don't think he will. Darren I don't want to take your money, so the answer is no.
Edited to add: I knew of course that Clintons and Obama and Soros were plotting to take over the world but I didn't know that Tom Hanks was in on it.
We saw such a nice side of him with Meg Ryan in "You've Got a Houseboat in Seattle" but of course there's obv a darker side to him. Did you see those humungous pecs in Castaway?

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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Darren »

I've yet to read any CREDIBLE info linking Soros to child porn.

The Q stuff is something else I haven't tried to follow. Qanon is given short shrift on the one conservative site I've followed since 1998.
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by ex-khobar Andy »

And of course, as expected for a while, Flynn has been pardoned.

If I recall correctly, and someone will tell me if I am wrong, he is pardoned for the specific crimes he has committed and not for crimes of the future. He cannot refuse to testify in a criminal case involving someone else on 5th Amendment grounds relating to those crimes. So if for example there was a case involving (say) what was said to the Russians and who told him to say it, he could be required to testify. He cannot be prosecuted for what he said; but if he testifies falsely he could be prosecuted for perjury, and his evidence, if he testifies truthfully, could be used against whoever told him to do it.

A pardon can be double edged.

And BTW, wasn't he fired for lying to Pence? His pardon seems to be based on the (tenuous at best; nonsensical at worst) grounds that he never should have been prosecuted. Has that lie to Pence gone away?

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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Bicycle Bill »

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Yes, I suppose I could agree with you ... but then we'd both be wrong, wouldn't we?

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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Scooter »

So the answer to the question posed by the title of this thread is "no", because accepting a pardon is an admission of guilt.
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Econoline
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Re: Will General Michael Flynn be exonerated?

Post by Econoline »

Beat me to it, Scooter.
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