Graveyard of Empires

[BoSoxGal]

Excellent remarks from President Biden just now. I applaud his unwavering conviction to getting us unmired from Afghanistan.

[rubato]

?

[rubato]

Going in to Afghanistan was the morally and practically right thing to do. We had to. Al Queda had comitted an act of war against the US and we were entitled and required to bring them to justice. We had a right of retaliation and revenge. The Taliban were protecting and harboring them thus we were obliged to root them out at the same time and destroy their government.
...
The problem was with what came next. We thought that we were obliged to install a legitimate, relatively non-corrupt, and effective government before we lift and that is just not so. The only people who could do that are the Afghan people. But we persisted in the fantasy that this was a military problem and it obviously is not. We could be there 40 more years and spending thousands more lives and trillions more resources and they would still be where they are now.
...
By calling it a military problem we blinded ourselves. But it was cheap and convenient. We have a great military, a nice shiny tool to roll out,best in the world. We were fat lazy and stupid and not smart enough to see that military force was never going to address the real problem.
...
The Taliban are going to act exactly as they did before. They will use torture, terror, murder and suffering to control a population too cynical to save themselves.

yrs,
rubato

[BoSoxGal]

That’s exactly what Biden said, but far more succinctly.

[Econoline]

When your only tool is a military-industrial complex, every problem looks like a war.

[liberty]

The other day I wrote that blacks are underrepresented in combat arms MOSs. Check out the photos of the thirteen that were killed in Afghanistan this week. Of the thirteen, I saw two that appeared Mexican, and the rest seemed to be white or at least Caucasian; I saw no blacks. Check it out for yourself. Meade thinks I was trying to insult blacks; that is not it. I was commenting on a social phenomenon. Why is it the case that there are so few black Americans in combat jobs in the military?

[Joe Guy]

Why is it the case that there are so few black Americans in combat jobs in the military?

Maybe because military service is voluntary and black people aren't stupid?

[liberty]

Why is it the case that there are so few black Americans in combat jobs in the military?

Maybe because military service is voluntary and black people aren't stupid?

Why is it the case that there are so few black Americans in combat jobs in the military?

Maybe because military service is voluntary and black people aren't stupid?

Is that what you believe; you believe that one race is more intelligent? That is not what I believe. All races have the same needs, wants, and abilities; what makes the difference is culture. And culture can make a profound difference. Why don’t blacks go into combat MOSs? I don’t know, but I don’t think it has anything to do with courage; they don’t have a problem killing each other.

[Joe Guy]

Is that what you believe; you believe that one race is more intelligent?

Where did I write anything about one race being more intelligent than another?

Why don’t blacks go into combat MOSs?

Maybe they aren't interested.

[MajGenl.Meade]

Meade thinks I was trying to insult blacks

No, I wasn't. One can only be insulted by one's equals or betters; all others are attack chihuahuas.

No, I think you were stating something you "feel" to be true without providing any actual evidence (per norm). Or per anyone. You've still not backed it up with anything but anecdotes e.g. the photo you cite.

But it's not worth discussing really, as someone else wrote in the earlier thread.

Cheers my dear Dinty

[Big RR]

I have no idea whether blacks are underrepresented in combat arms branches in the military (and I really don't care enough to look it up), but I recall when I was in the army (and later when there was a lot of discussions relating to women in the military), that advancement (especially for officers) did require some combat experience (except for certain specialized positions such as physicians, nurses, and ministers); indeed, as I recall, combat experience was necessary for a regular army commission beyond captain (a key to progression in the ranks) when I was in the army (although it was a long time ago, so this may well have changed; I think now all commissions are RA commissions). If this claim is true, it might be due to a desire to block the advancement of blacks and (women, before they could even serve in a combat role) . It wouldn't surprise me.

[BoSoxGal]

Read this:

I served in Afghanistan as a US Marine, twice. Here’s the truth in two sentences

[Burning Petard]

What I can't figure out is the position of our "allies" the French and the British, on this withdrawal. According to the talking heads at the three major tv networks, the French and the Bits want an extension on this withdrawal operation so they have time to get their supporters out.

And yet, both of them STOPPED their withdrawal operations last Friday. They want US to continue, but THEY have already quit?

snailgate

[Big RR]

I'd bet they want us to step up airport security as well, and think this is a way to get us to stay longer. I hope they have a backup plan.

[ex-khobar Andy]

Good piece in The Atlantic: Biden Deserves Credit, Not Blame, for Afghanistan.

Note of course it was uber-dealmaker Trump who negotiated with the Taliban - and I actually think that was a good idea and a good use of American diplomacy - and who made the agreement that 5000 militia guys should be released from prison (not such a good idea). Of course fantasist Trump tells us that none of this would have happened had he still been president.

[Gob]

The Taliban Air Force: Islamists now have 48 aircraft including Black Hawks and A-29 attack planes after US retreat left them with more air power than one in three NATO nations.


The Taliban have seized an air force worth tens of millions of pounds, including US-bought helicopters and attack planes, giving them more aerial firepower than a third of Nato members.

Over the last few months, the jihadists have captured 10 major airfields from Bagram to Mazar-i-Sharif, and today took to the skies in a $6 million Black Hawk helicopter in their fight against the resistance in the Panjshir Valley.

Taliban chiefs are reported to have ordered their troops to hunt down pilots from the disbanded Afghan Air Force, who received expensive training from the US and its allies to fly high-tech warplanes and choppers.


The jewel in the crown, Hamid Karzai International Airport in Kabul, was seized on Tuesday by triumphant jihadists who were seen clambering into the cockpit of a $14 million Hercules transport jet.

The Afghan Air Force was operating 167 aircraft, including 108 helicopters and 59 planes, according to an official U.S. government inspection on June 30.

Before Kabul fell, Uzbekistan confirmed that 46 Afghan aircraft, including 24 helicopters, had arrived in the country in order to prevent them from falling into the hands of the Taliban.

The commander of the US evacuation mission, Gen. Frank McKenzie, said American troops disabled 73 aircraft before finally leaving the country on Monday night.

That leaves as many as 48 aircraft seized by the Taliban, although it is unclear what the breakdown is in terms of planes and helicopters.

Nevertheless, the Islamists have more air power than 10 of the 30 Nato members, including: Albania, Bosnia, Estonia, Iceland, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Montenegro, North Macedonia and Slovenia.

[Scooter]

So who are they going to get to fly them willingly? All any pilot they attempt to force to fly them has to do is take off and fly across the nearest border.

[Crackpot]

Yeah the heavy machinery is not nearly the concern that the other “light” armaments left behind. If someone needs extensive training to use it it won’t likely be a big problem.

[Gob]

So who are they going to get to fly them willingly?

I don't know. Any Taliban pilot with the necessary skills I suppose. They are already flying some of the helicopters.

[Burning Petard]

These were NOT abandoned and left to them by the American troops. This was equipment we gave to the Official Afghanistan government. The people (except for one small district) who turned their coats and joined the Taliban.

snailgate