I Am An Innocent Man....

[BoSoxGal]

Trump would be the perfect caricature of new money with hideous - odious! - taste, except he’s real. Richie Don in his gold plated chandeliered mansions - a chandelier in every room!

[Joe Guy]

Donald Trump, shortly after reading classified documents at Maralago....

[Scooter]

[Bicycle Bill]

Trump would be the perfect caricature of new money with hideous - odious! - taste, except he’s real. Richie Don in his gold plated chandeliered mansions - a chandelier in every room!

There would be one long staircase just going up,
And one even longer coming down,
And one more leading nowhere, just for show...
          .....  "If I Were A Rich Man" from "Fiddler on the Roof"

-"BB"-

[Scooter]

[Sue U]

FB_IMG_1686432234873.jpg

[Sue U]

Best summation of the indictment I have seen is here, I loled:
fooler initiative

[BoSoxGal]

Best summation of the indictment I have seen is here, I loled:
fooler initiative

That was hilarious, thank you. Apparently I am missing some good stuff in the Twitterverse.

[BoSoxGal]

In a speaking engagement Friday night, former gubernatorial candidate Kari Lake said with regard to Biden, Garland and special counsel Jack Smith, that they were going to have to go through 75 million Americans like her to get to Trump, and:

Most of us are card-carrying members of the NRA. That’s not a threat, that’s a public service announcement.

https://www.salon.com/2023/06/10/kari-l ... and-biden/

[liberty]

Wouldn't it be best to divide the country as in a national divorce?


https://www.vice.com/en/article/wxjjgb/ ... -civil-war

‘We Need to Start Killing’: Trump’s Far-Right Supporters Are Threatening Civil War
Within minutes of Trump’s indictment, supporters lit up social media platforms with violent threats and calls for civil war.
David Gilbert
By David Gilbert
June 9, 2023, 7:33am

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FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP
FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP AT HIS TURNBERRY COURSE ON MAY 2, 2023 IN TURNBERRY, SCOTLAND. (PHOTO BY ROBERT PERRY / GETTY IMAGES)
In what is becoming a now all-too-familiar trend, former President Donald Trump’s far-right supporters have threatened civil war after news broke Thursday that the former president was indicted for allegedly taking classified documents from the White House without permission.

“We need to start killing these traitorous fuckstains,” wrote one Trump supporter on The Donald, a rabidly pro-Trump message board that played a key role in planning the January 6 attack on the Capitol. Another user added: “It's not gonna stop until bodies start stacking up. We are not civilly represented anymore and they'll come for us next. Some of us, they already have.”

[Crackpot]

Trump would be the perfect caricature of new money with hideous - odious! - taste, except he’s real. Richie Don in his gold plated chandeliered mansions - a chandelier in every room!

Except te fact that he isn’t new money

[Big RR]

In what is becoming a now all-too-familiar trend, former President Donald Trump’s far-right supporters have threatened civil war after news broke Thursday that the former president was indicted for allegedly taking classified documents from the White House without permission.

I'll worry about that if I see some of the US armed forces defecting to that side. A bunch of small handed (and what goes along with small hands) Walter Mitty types wearing horns can be a problem in the way Manson was a problem, but it's hardly the start of a civil war.

[BoSoxGal]

A recent poll revealed that a little over 4 million Americans believe the use of violence to retake the government is warranted in these times.

4 million to 326 million seems a forgone conclusion, except that most of them probably stockpile firearms and other munitions and depending on how many are infiltrated into military and police, we could actually see some serious violence.

[ex-khobar Andy]

Yes - although I will not be voting (I am not an American despite having lived here 39 years now) I will have a Biden - Harris sign on my lawn next November assuming that they are the nominees. Kentucky is a heavy red state although urban centers such as Louisville are less so. I think I will have a ring doorbell system before that happens.

[Big RR]

4 million to 326 million seems a forgone conclusion, except that most of them probably stockpile firearms and other munitions and depending on how many are infiltrated into military and police, we could actually see some serious violence.

I think you're right in the way we saw some serious Klan violence during the Jim Crow days when the police were tied in to the perpetrators. But even then, I note the National Guard and reserves were eventually used to quell a lot of it. If there is a significant portion of the US armed services who are willing to support an actual insurrection we may have a much bigger problem, but I just don't see that--at least now. Sure, thereare sme screaming for insurrection, but it takes more than that to spawn a civil war.

And, FWIW, I would not be averse to allowing some of the disaffected states to just up and leave the union if it came to that. I have always maintained we would have been a lot better off if we never fought in the Civil War and just let the confederate states leave. Sure, we would have still had some skirmishes, but nothing like what we fought for 4 years, and think what it would be like now if we were rid of those states (OK, I'd miss NEw Orleans, but I think the locals might well have left the confederacy to come back)>.

[Bicycle Bill]

Looking at your Confederacy / Civil War theory, I note that if we had let the Confederacy go its separate way, the Union would have given up control of the Mississippi River south of Memphis — and we all know the extent to which the Mississippi River was and still is a major artery for shipment of materials, primarily grain, to ocean ports.  This could have had serious effects on the development of the central part of the (remaining) United States for decades.

Secondly, had the Confederate states been permitted to secede, how long would they have been able to survive?  For better or worse their one main crop was cotton; they had little manufacturing or other natural resources at that time (the discovery and exploitation of oil was still some time off); and as a sovereign nation they would have then needed to create an entire federal infrastructure, complete with a monetary system, governmental body, laws, public security (police and national defense), and international interactions including but not limited to trade and treaties of alliance and support.  Oh – and remember. this area is particularly prone to destructive floods and hurricanes.  I wonder what Galveston would look like today if Texas had NOT been a part of the United States in 1900 and thus been unable to receive an outpouring of relief and reconstruction funding from the common pot of the rest of the nation?

Which brings me to the 1900s, and the Spanish-American War, and later on, WWI and (especially) WWII.  I can easily see Hitler licking his chops over the possibility of choking off the Confederacy until they sued for peace and establishing a foothold on the American continent; in fact, historical fact shows that for a period of time, the Gulf of Mexico and the Atlantic seaboard — which would have been the Confederacy's southern and eastern coasts and thus their responsibility to defend and protect — was for all intents and purposes a pond full of German U-boats wreaking havoc on shipping, despite the presence of the US Navy, Air Corps, and other armed forces.

I contend that had the Confederacy been permitted a bloodless secession, it wouldn't have been much more that forty or fifty years before it realized that their visions of secession and independence were pipe dreams at best, and the states would have sought reunification on their own.

-"BB"-

[Big RR]

Bill you bring up some interesting points, but we may well have been able to work out with the confederacy the ability to navigate the Missisippi River and some of the other things you point out. But they are for another thread, not this one.

As for the point I was trying to make, letting some of the disguntled states out of the union, then or now, is not the end of the world and might not even be a bad thing. not that it's going to happen, but it's fun the speculate.

[Scooter]

[ex-khobar Andy]

A nice piece in today's Guardian about Trump's efforts to find lawyers to defend him on these charges. Amongst other things:

Part of the problem of recruiting new lawyers has been Trump’s reputation for being a notoriously difficult client who has a record of declining legal advice and seeking to have his lawyers act as attack dogs or political aides rather than attorneys bound by ethics rules, people close to the process said.

I feel sorry for (no, not really) Walt Nauta - Trump's valet who allegedly moved boxes before the lawyers and feds got there (in my day a valet's job was to iron your socks etc so that you were not shamed in front of your chums) - I wonder if Trump is paying his legal fees.

[BoSoxGal]

Even if Walt Nauta requires appointed counsel, he will be well served - probably better served than if he is represented by someone whose fees are paid by Trump and who might be influenced by Trump’s agenda.

The federal public defender is a fine organization with high standards, it is not the equivalent of a state public defender service. Private attorneys who make it onto the federal defender panel are experienced and capable. The same is true for federal defenders who work directly for the federal defender organizations. It’s not like the state public defender office with a bunch of greenhorns straight out of law school.

Nauta needs to cooperate with the feds so he can enjoy his life and not spend a decade or more in prison for Cheeto Mussolini.