I Am An Innocent Man....

[Joe Guy]

Sung to the tune of 'Innocent Man' by Billy Joel...

(intro with bass guitar & snapping finger...)

Some people say that I paid off a whore
So her mouth would not be opening up
To tell the world and Melania
I grabbed Stormy with my little hand

Some people think that I started a riot
In January two oh two one
They think that I was responsible
For causing some people to die

I was only protecting you all!
You must be thinking of somebody else!

Some other person

But I know you know, the election was rigged
I got more votes than any loser has had
And I took a few classified things
To keep cuz I know I can

And Biden took files, left them in Chinatown
Yes I really think that he should be hung
And maybe then he should even die
Because I am an innocent man

I ammmmmmmmm.... an INNOCENT MAN!
Oh, yes I am
An innocent man .....

[BoSoxGal]

United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump United States v Donald John Trump

I just love the sound of that!

[Big RR]

I do too, but I am almost certain nothing will come of it. Politiicians of both sides protect their own, always have and always will. I would love to see a different conclusion, but I doubt I will. Of course, if it hurts his chances in the primary, that's something.

[MajGenl.Meade]

Oh, if only t'were so! (Jail, that is). No, he's laughing all the way to the bank. He thrives on firing up the supporters and adding to their number with his persecution theme. Look at DeSanitize et al (him too) falling all over themselves to chant Trump's tune that it's all just dirty politics and Joe Biden is behind it all, trying to take out his main competitor not by ballots but by Democrat lawyers.

We all can sneer at such lies but he's not appealing to us. He's laying out the "They are after YOU" welcome mat to bring back any who might be wavering toward Floriduh Man or any of the other wannabe Replicants.

And it's working.

[Scooter]

[Big RR]

Very true Meade, and even Pence (who has a pretty good reason to detest Trump) has said several times that a former president should not be investigated and/or indicted and/or tried ; I guess he believes the fire a gun down 5th avenue and get away with it Trump bullshit--these people are just special and deserve special treatment. Personally, there are a lot of recent presidents I would have like to be seen taken to task--some I voted for, others, absolutely not, but I hold they shouldn't be treated any differently under the law (of course Pence is just saying what IMHO most politicians believe).

[Bicycle Bill]

From the upcoming series 3 of those NFTs he shills to his followers...

-"BB"-

[BoSoxGal]

BigRR, I’m wondering what role you think politicians can play now that he is indicted by a federal grand jury of citizens and that indictment is filed into federal court?

The DOJ has already established under Garland and the 1/6 prosecutions that politics won’t guide the process, and clearly indicting Trump says Garlands legacy intends to be sweeping away the shame of the Nixon pardon by establishing us as a country which is mature enough to hold former presidents accountable- which many other countries have managed to do without total meltdown. In the long run this strategy should rebuild faith in our judicial system, at least in more than half the people. If they do it right, it should. Godspeed to Jack Smith.

Maybe it will be horrible. I’d rather take the risk than live in a USA which stands for zero accountability for criminals who once occupied the WH. Trump’s crimes show he has no respect for the Constitution or the citizens he was sworn to serve and protect. In return he deserves a totally transparent experience of due process in the courts just as any other citizen, no matter how scummy, has the right to expect.

[ex-khobar Andy]

I worry about the jury - I assume this will be a 12 person jury but someone will correct me if I am wrong.

With the nation as divided as it is, it will be very difficult to find 12 people who do not have an opinion. If I were up for jury service I like to think that I could be objective - and for reference I think, had I been on the OJ jury I would have voted for acquittal because even though I thought he was guilty, I didn't think that California had made their case - but based on what I have seen and my hatred for Trump I really doubt that I could vote to acquit. Equally there will be those who regardless of the evidence will never vote to convict.

The chance for a unanimous jury is slim at best. I know there is voir dire to supposedly eliminate those with prejudice one way or another: but unless they find people who have been living under a rock for the last seven years I don't see it.

[liberty]

Once you get him into prison, you can kill him and even make it look like natural causes. But, what about his kids; how do you take care of them? I think the youngest is Baron, and he's something like 15. Shit Head would volunteer for that job. The boy would take days to die, and shit head would squeeze every bit of pleasure out of it he could.

I think Donald Trump wants to be a martyr. That's one way to be remembered by history.

[BoSoxGal]

Last night on MSNBC one of the commentators was the federal prosecutor who took on Paul Manafort in Florida federal court - Andrew Weissman. He talked about how one of his jurors was a MAGA hat wearing woman who was hardcore, but who promised to leave her MAGA hat in the car. They convicted and she was later the only juror to speak publicly and she warned Trump not to pardon Manafort. The discussion was then about the solemnity with which most jurors take the oath and their adherence to applying the law to the facts established as they are instructed by the court.

Attorneys who try cases in court before juries, whether civil or criminal, often comment on the unpredictability of juries - it’s why we are all driven to settle cases whenever possible. But in truth I have a lot of faith in the jury system and I feel the most outrageous miscarriages of justice have very little to do with juries but rather with the decisions made by the state and the court in deciding what evidence they will be allowed to see.

If this case even goes to trial, it would have to be that some kind of MAGA nut got on the jury by somehow evading the careful screening process in voir dire. I’m not saying it is totally impossible, but given the level of practice and care taken by federal prosecutors and most federal judges, I think it’s not hugely likely.

From what I’m hearing about the indictment - I haven’t read it yet myself, I’ve been really good about avoiding news so even on this historic day I was doing other things all day - the allegations are so gross, so abhorrent that it seems most run of the mill Trump voters might be appalled to hear what recklessness he engaged in with secrets that could really harm Americans and especially American service people and intelligence officers.

It’s going to be interesting to see how this plays out. Any sane person facing the evidence and charges Trump is facing would be hard at work to negotiate the best possible plea deal because this case is indefensible. But the whole issue here is and always has been that this man has a personality disorder so severe that he really isn’t all that sane. Obviously I don’t mean that he meets the test for legal insanity as to culpability for criminal behavior, but that his malignant narcissism prevents him from acting in his own best interests. He is dangerous and unpredictable and unfit to be president. I can’t believe he could be elected again by honest means. I refuse to believe the American people are that reckless.

[Joe Guy]

The Indictment

(It's a PDF document, so you'll need a PDF reader to open it)

[Sue U]

I read the indictment earlier today and it is holy shit why isn't this fucker in jail already, assuming only half of it is true. The risk he has been posing to national security for his own personal gain (largely through petty vendettas) is off the charts. And there are tapes and photos and text messages and witness testimony to back it all up. And to top it all off, the indictment quotes Trump himself repeatedly criticizing Clinton for improper handling of confidential or classified information to show he knew what he was doing was wrong. Where is the Lock Her Up crowd now?

[Burning Petard]

Judge Cannon, who will take the pleas of the accused on this indictment seems to be an incompetent hack that perhaps got her J.D from the law department of Trump University. She already made two decisions to stall this whole case and both were reversed by the very conservative appeals panel. But she has the power to declare lots, perhaps nearly everything, inadmissible. That will lead to lots of appeals and stall stall stall. Won't even have a jury selected before the next presidential inauguration.

snailgate

[ex-khobar Andy]

Well we will see what happens with the jury and BSG undoubtedly has experience with them so I hope she is right.

One thing that appalls me - apart from trump's behavior of course - is the overall system (or rather non-system) for handling classified information in the first place. For about 30 years I ran an operation which was required by the feds (and many state agencies) to have a document handling system for SOPs. We had several hundred SOPS and between 50 and 100 employees.

The only 'official' copy of the SOP was the latest version which resided on a specific server. If you wanted a paper copy it was numbered, tracked and issued to you. If the server copy was updated your copy was reissued and you had to hand back the old copy for destruction. Periodically - I think every couple of months - we audited the system. Every copy was barcoded and copying was not allowed. I recall looking at new technology on the copier which would refuse to work if certain barcodes were present. I don't think we got around to ordering it before the operation closed down. We had an employee whose title was Document Control Officer - if she was absent I did it as lab director.

Every library has procedures to keep track of their documents - who has it, how long they are allowed to keep it, and a reminder to return it when time is up. Yes I know the federal government is far larger and there are millions of classified (and probably many are over-classified) documents. But keeping track of them is a problem that has been solved many times over - take any reasonable library system and multiply up. At the end of Trump's presidency (and Obama's etc etc) there should have been a reminder - our records show that you have the following documents and you have XX days to return them or you will be in breach of USC YYY.

[ex-khobar Andy]

And my hope is that his co-defendant, his ex-military aide Waltine Nutter (was a cook in the Navy and then Trump's valet) will decide that he does not want to spend the next 10 years in the slammer so he will drop his old boss right in it.

[ex-khobar Andy]

Clearly a fake picture. Who puts a chandelier in a bathroom? The feds must really be trying to nail Trump when they resort to such a very crude and obvious Photoshop.

[Big RR]

BSG--I honestly don't know what will happen, I just think that something will to disrupt this whole process (or prevent Trump from being pusnished). Again, I can think of many recent other presidents who deserved punishment for what they did in office, but nothing happened to them (take Reagan or W for example) or they were preemptively pardoned (Nixon). We, as a nation, could survive a trial and even conviction and punishment, but American politicians (especially those at high levels) are not used to being held accountable for their actions, and I'll be they don't want to start. So will we see a Biden pardon to spare American the divisiveness of a trial? I wouldn't be surprised. Or some behind the scenes maneuvering to cancel (or postpone until it becomes too late) the trial ? Maybe. There's a lot of things that just wouldn't suprise me except Trump being tried, convicted, and sentenced. He deserves it, surely, and I'll cheer if it happens. But I'll just wait and see.

And for those who think he doesn't deserve it, read the indictment. Sue is right, anyone else would be in jail awaiting trial--we'll see if he even has to post bail.

[Bicycle Bill]

Clearly a fake picture. Who puts a chandelier in a bathroom?

Oh, I don't know ... how about the same guy who was given a golden toilet from the Guggenheim Museum to shit into?



-"BB"-

[Joe Guy]

Yeah, but then in order to believe the photo is real, you'd have to believe that Trump does a lot of reading.