Plan B Forum

How concerned are you, if at all?

https://www.project2025.org/policy/


Are we going to sleep walk or stumble into Gilead?

Very. It is confirmation of the old quote from Will Rogers: I am not a member of an organized political party. I am a Democrat.

snailgate.

BoSoxGal wrote: ↑

Sun Jun 23, 2024 6:08 pm

How concerned are you, if at all?

Frankly, I'm quite alarmed. Because Trump has no agenda for governing other than keeping himself out of prison and punishing those he considers his enemies, he will give these nutballs free rein to make their ideology law. The damage Trump has done to American politics will seem as nothing compared to what the Heritage Foundation and the Christian Nationalists have in store for us.

ETA: I was freaked out by these people two years ago, and I'm certainly not feeling any better about the fact that they're now more organized, more connected and in a position to gain real access to government power.

We can but hope...

I am somewhat concerned, but I do have faith in democracy and the American people not to let this happen (a faith, incidentally, that is waivering but still strong). Indeed, if we progress further down that road, I fear democracy as a way of governance is seriously threatened, and that concerns me much more than anything uber conservative groups can dish out.

Happy Independence Day, women of America! Best get out to vote in November!

My wife will. Already working with the campaigns.

Big RR wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 24, 2024 1:31 pm

I am somewhat concerned, but I do have faith in democracy and the American people not to let this happen (a faith, incidentally, that is waivering but still strong). Indeed, if we progress further down that road, I fear democracy as a way of governance is seriously threatened, and that concerns me much more than anything uber conservative groups can dish out.

I had faith that the American president would not do anything as daft as to invade Iraq in 2003. I had faith that the American people would not select Trump as the GOP candidate in 2016. I had faith that despite that, the American people would not elect him as President. I had faith that, during his presidency, the system of checks and balances as written into the Constitution (e.g., judicial review, Senate approval of major Executive and Judicial branch appointments) would do its job and prevent executive foolishness, mendacity and criminality. That faith has been tested and consequently I cannot describe it as 'strong.' No fucking way.

Edited to correct a grammatical error.

Andy--I'm no Pollyanna; we have done that, and more, recently and throughout our history; and there are a lot of recent actions that have concerned me. But we have also seen the error of our ways and have changed our direction many times throughout our history. And, IMHO, we have thrived because of that. Things look pretty bleak now--especially considering that we may actually have another four years of the asinine Cheetoh, but I am confident the American people and their ability to recognize the errors of their ways again.

Indeed, if I didn't believe that, I would think the concept of democracy is doomed. However, I trust the wisdom of the people (the "mob") far more than I trust the wisdom and veracity of any president, legislator, or judge. But, sadly, it could be hell until that change of heart arrives.

BigRR do you have confidence that the people's rights to vote will remain intact under another Trump term?

Not sure, he and his handlers can do a lot of damage, but I am confident the trend will eventually reverse.

Is this you? Maybe? A little? ein bisschen?

No, I don't think so; I will work and fight for what I think is right, but I do have confidence that we can overcome anything, as we have in the past. Americans are fairly resilient and will tend to fight for freedom when it is threatened, but it can take time. On top of that, I think Trump can't help himself and will usually sabotage his plans with his personality (we still have Obamacare because of this); I'd far more want to have an ass like him in the the white house than someone like Nixon who understood how to play the game much more and did get some pretty bad things things done. His election (if it happens) can, and will, cause a lot of upheaval and pain, maybe it's what we need to get around this nationalist bullshit and make people realize the value of some of the social programs we have; it won't be a good 4 years, but I'd bet the midterm will show a turnaround with the dems keeping the Senate and taking the House again.

If that's sticking my head in the sand, tell me what more can be done; many things will get worse, but most of them have not gotten that much better (don't get me wrong, some things have, but Gitmo is still open, no meaningful progress has been made on immigration, very little has been accomplished with global warming...). Sure, I'd take a decade of Biden over a month of Trump, but I'd welcome some real progress on a lot of issues important to me, and maybe the American people need a little more Trump to realize how important these issues are.

The reality, with links to each and every statement.

https://www.usmessageboard.com/threads/ ... t-34819078

Well that's all right then. At least their positions are "not explicitly" against freedom and democracy.

Love the weasel words - "doesn't explicitly call for the elimination of X", while leaving unstated "but the elimination of X is the only possible result of what we are saying".

Jarlaxle wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 06, 2024 3:45 pm

The reality, with links to each and every statement.

https://www.usmessageboard.com/threads/ ... t-34819078

Yes; and Kavanaugh and Gorsuch told us and the Senate that Roe v Wade was an oft-reaffirmed precedent and strongly implied that it was safe.