Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

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Scooter
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by Scooter »

rubato wrote:Still waiting for proof that "Jewish" is a race.
Your own Supreme Court says it was:
Jews can state a § 1982 claim of racial discrimination, since they were among the peoples considered to be distinct races, and hence within the protection of the statute at the time it was passed.
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Gob
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by Gob »

LOL!! I await a "Brits are in recession ugh!" reply to that one Scoot!
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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Lord Jim
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by Lord Jim »

No, I'm betting he comes back with some brilliantly on point retort about who got the right to vote when....
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MajGenl.Meade
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

rubato wrote: The election of Obama stands alone.
No it does not
MajGenl.Meade wrote: Alberto Fujimori in Peru is a better candidate in the modern era; Mahendra Chaudhry in Fiji; Leon Blum in France
Technically rubato may have a niggling point, neh? After all, any person can convert to Judaism and be described as a "Jew" - is that not so? If I became a Jew, that would not change my race.

It might be more accurate to say that Hebrew is a race - or maybe not? God certainly thought they were a "people" during the Genesis and Exodus adventures rather than a religion as such - although of course they also happened to be "Jewish" religiously and no-one else was at the time.

On the other hand, Israel recognises that one parent can make a person "Jewish" in the sense of eligible for Israeli citizenship - and since 'religion' cannot be genetically passed on, only race could account for it

Meade
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

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Gob
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by Gob »

Rubato missed the point that Obama is a mixed race person, not an ethnic minority.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

rubato
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by rubato »

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What kind of bigots would say these are a race? As opposed to a religion?

The ignorant kind.

yrs,
rubato

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Gob
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by Gob »

Rubato must have missed the question, which "racial minority" does Obama belong to? I think he also missed Scooters point at the top of this page. (Unless he's calling the US Supreme court "ignorant") Also seems to have missed the point that Disraeli was a Marrano And the fact that Cream named an album after him.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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MajGenl.Meade
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

People who are 1/32nd 'native American' (i.e. invaders from Asia) sometimes claim racial privilege based upon that genetic inheritance. It is even more the case if a grandparent or one parent were 'native American'.

Now historically, particularly in the USA and in South Africa (under white rule), almost any degree of black blood was used to declare people "black" and therefore inelegible for benefits and very eligible for discriminatory action.

This was at one time decried - having a black ancestor did not make a person black, was the argument. That kind of denial was important when being black brought with it all kinds of dangers and difficulties.

Eventually, as impediments began to be removed (in the USA) the "black is beautiful" idea rightly sought to re-establish pride in ancestry rather than fear.

But black as such isn't a 'race' either is it? Shared ancestry/shared genes (below) are surely not a common factor to all "black" people. President Obama's ancestry and genes are what they are - I do not see why his ethnicity is not defined by both sides of his ancestry. Rather as I think of Tiger Woods as being at one time the greatest Asian golfer and the greatest black golfer and the greatest golfer ever.

I think rubato wildly overstates the case that only bigots would consider 'Jew' as a race.
Are Jews a Race?

• Judaism has been described as a religion, a race, a culture, and a nation
• All of these descriptions have some validity
• The Jewish people are best described as an extended family

In the 1980s, the United States Supreme Court ruled that Jews are a race, at least for purposes of certain anti-discrimination laws. Their reasoning: at the time these laws were passed, people routinely spoke of the "Jewish race" or the "Italian race" as well as the "Negro race," so that is what the legislators intended to protect.

But many Jews were deeply offended by that decision, offended by any hint that Jews could be considered a race. The idea of Jews as a race brings to mind nightmarish visions of Nazi Germany, where Jews were declared to be not just a race, but an inferior race that had to be rounded up into ghettos and exterminated like vermin.

But setting aside the emotional issues, Jews are clearly not a race.

Race is a genetic distinction, and refers to people with shared ancestry and shared genetic traits. You can't change your race; it's in your DNA. I could never become black or Asian no matter how much I might want to.

Common ancestry is not required to be a Jew. Many Jews worldwide share common ancestry, as shown by genetic research; however, you can be a Jew without sharing this common ancestry, for example, by converting. Thus, although I could never become black or Asian, blacks and Asians have become Jews (Sammy Davis Jr. and Connie Chung).
http://www.jewfaq.org/judaism.htm
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

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Gob
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by Gob »

So then, what "minority race" is Obama? The British Kenyan race?
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

Big RR
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by Big RR »

[quote[ however, you can be a Jew without sharing this common ancestry, for example, by converting. Thus, although I could never become black or Asian, blacks and Asians have become Jews (Sammy Davis Jr. and Connie Chung).[/quote].

False; Al Jolsson converted to black for many shows and movies. Indeed, others have as well--I saw Olivier in Othello and he was a black as well. :lol:

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Gob
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by Gob »

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“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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MajGenl.Meade
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Re: Some Interesting Ideas On Immigration

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

Lee? Lee? Sounds Chineseish

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For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

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