Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

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Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Lord Jim » Thu Jan 10, 2019 5:24 am

This ought to do the trick... :evil:

Police demand DNA from Phoenix care staff after woman in coma gives birth

The CEO of Hacienda HealthCare has also stepped down after woman in vegetative state for 10 years delivered a baby on 29 December

Police have served a search warrant Tuesday to get DNA from all male employees at a long-term care facility in Phoenix where a patient who had been in a vegetative state for years gave birth.

Male staff members at a Hacienda Healthcare center in Phoenix, Arizona, were asked to give DNA samples as part of an investigation into how the patient got pregnant, according to a press release from the long-term care facility.

The chief executive of the company which cared for a Phoenix woman who gave birth despite having been in a vegetative state for 10 years has resigned.

Hacienda HealthCare’s chief executive, Bill Timmons, stepped down on Monday, spokesman David Leibowitz said. The decision was unanimously accepted by the board of directors.

Azfamily.com first reported that the woman, in a vegetative state after a near-drowning, delivered a baby on 29 December. Her identity has not been reported and it is not known if she has a family or a guardian. It is also unclear if staff members at the Hacienda de Los Angeles facility were unaware of the pregnancy until the birth.[ :?: :?: :?: How the fuck could that be? A woman lying in a coma in a 24 hour a day care facility becomes nine months pregnant and nobody notices till the baby pops out? :loon :shrug ]

In a statement, board member Gary Orman said Hacienda “will accept nothing less than a full accounting of this absolutely horrifying situation”.

“We will do everything in our power to ensure the safety of every single one of our patients and our employees,” Orman said.

Hacienda HealthCare said it welcomed the DNA testing of employees. “We will continue to cooperate with Phoenix Police and all other investigative agencies to uncover the facts in this deeply disturbing, but unprecedented situation,” the company said in a statement.


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... eo-resigns
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Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby RayThom » Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:10 pm

... but wait, there's more.

Court records reveal more about life of Phoenix woman in vegetative state who gave birth
https://www.azfamily.com/news/investigations/hacienda_healthcare/court-records-reveal-more-about-life-of-phoenix-woman-in/article_4064ee58-1483-11e9-8690-13c8389bc60b.html

The woman was at the care facility for 27 years. Obviously her rape was not "one and done." I suspect she has been repeatedly raped over the years. Sadly, I bet someone at some administration level knew about this. The chief executive who quit, maybe?

Sick.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Burning Petard » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:12 pm

Why are then checking only the DNA of males. My wife pointed out that there is a strong possibility that a female staffer could have permitted or invited a male family member to visit her at work, and there by had opportunity for this crime.

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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Crackpot » Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:02 pm

And what woman could impregnate the victim?
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Long Run » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:47 am

Crackpot wrote:And what woman could impregnate the victim?


If one let a male relative rape the victim, then the DNA would reveal the female accomplice. I'd start with the male workers and go from there.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Crackpot » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:53 am

But that wouldn’t find non relatives or husbands
Okay... There's all kinds of things wrong with what you just said.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Long Run » Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:45 am

Which is why I think that they should only resort to female testing (and other secondary suspects) after they look for the more likely suspects who had daily access.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Big RR » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:46 pm

Interesting, but if I worked there I am not sure I would voluntarily turn over my genetic sample to them without some significant constraints on what it could be used for and how it will be secured. A serious crime has occurred, but that does not justify management's intrusion into an employee's privacy and demanding of physical samples without some sort of due process. I'd wait for a court to order me to submit a sample.

I recall when I was a teen that some money went missing from the place I worked and they wanted to fingerprint everyone to see if they could determine who stole it (I think it was from the safe, to which most employees did/should not have access). I refused (I also had nothing to do with the theft) and was threatened with dismissal; I told them I would permit them to fingerprint me, but that they had to return the fingerprint card to me after I was cleared, and they refused. They kept pushing for a few weeks, but I would not back down; ultimately I left for another job I had previously applied for. Their security contacted me a couple of more times, and I told them to have me arrested if they were so concerned, but that I would hold them liable for false arrest eventually when I was cleared (admittedly, I knew nothing about false arrest, nor did they, it seems). It ultimately dropped; I don't know if they ever found out who did the theft.

The point is, we should not give up on our rights so readily just to prove our innocence. Coupling that with the mischief that can be done with what is submitted, significant deliberation should be given to any decision to provide a sample.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby MajGenl.Meade » Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:03 pm

Big RR wrote:A serious crime has occurred, but that does not justify management's intrusion into an employee's privacy and demanding of physical samples without some sort of due process. I'd wait for a court to order me to submit a sample.


Quote the OP: "Police have served a search warrant Tuesday to get DNA from all male employees at a long-term care facility in Phoenix"
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Big RR » Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:10 pm

Thanks meade, I should read more closely. I would also make sure to have my lawyer review any such warrant before I gave a sample.

ETA: CNN reports the warrant was for records and that the police have requested male employees to provide samples, stating that they will get a court order to compel the sample if the employee refuses.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Lord Jim » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:43 pm

after they look for the more likely suspects who had daily access.


It's logical to assume that focusing on male employees who had daily access would just be the first step and that others will be taken if necessary...

In theory, any male above the age of puberty who was on the premises during the time frame a little over 9 months ago, (I doubt they'll be able to to pinpoint it to the exact day that the woman was impregnated) is a potential suspect...

Not just staff or relatives and friends of staff, but also vendors, delivery men, and all male visitors...

Any logs that people would have to sign to gain entrance to the facility, as well as any and all CCTV tapes that may be available will have to be scrutinized...

Though I suspect that in a facility where it is possible for a comatose patient to go through nine months of pregnancy with nobody (not a single doctor, nurse, orderly...nobody) noticing that something might be amiss, security might be a little on the lax side... :roll:
Last edited by Lord Jim on Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Big RR » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:53 pm

Ya think?
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby BoSoxGal » Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:40 pm

I’m horrified by this story for so many reasons - how can this baby possibly be healthy? The adult woman in whose uterus it gestated has spent 27 years in vegetative state - since age 3! Presumably she’s fed by g-tube and only enough calories to sustain basic life functioning of a totally sedentary body. For that fetus to have accessed enough nutrition to develop in a healthy fashion at optimal growth rate, the poor woman’s organ systems and muscle mass must have borne the burden. Pregnancy is an assault on a healthy body, never mind a stressed one. There is so much horrific negligence here - I hope the poor baby is reasonably healthy. My heart breaks for the poor vessel who bore him, and has endured God only knows how much abuse, assault and neglect over the decades.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby ex-khobar Andy » Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:41 pm

This story is horrific enough without it, but I'll add one more emerging detail. The company is being investigated for a $3.4 million Medicaid fraud. That's not to say that they are guilty of course but it's consistent with what we have heard about them.

There is a whole question going begging here: does it make any kind of emotional or fiscal sense for a woman to be kept on life support for 26 years? It seems to me that there was a tragedy affecting a three year old girl all those years ago: but how she has been treated since then - bearing in mind that I know no more than I read in the news - seems to have compounded that tragedy, not lessened it. I know that if it were me I would not want to be kept alive that way, and I hope that I would have the same attitude if it were someone close to me.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Big RR » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:02 pm

26 years is a very long time to be kept on "life support". My guess is that she breaths on her own (she may get oxygen, since some accounts mention tubes for breathing) and needs nutrition to be provided by a gastric tube. I also heard that the staff was alerted to her entering labor by moaning, so she has some level of consciousness, even though she cannot communicate. Putting the pregnancy and sexual assault aside, she is not reported being in any pain or discomfort, and my guess is that the law would not permit her nutrition to be discontinued as it might for a cancer patient in great pain. I agree I wouldn't want to be kept alive in that state either, but I am not sure the family would have much of a say in what is done.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Lord Jim » Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:57 am

Unfriggin' believable... :roll: :evil: :loon

"Baby's turning blue!": 911 call reveals moments woman in vegetative state gives birth



A dramatic 911 call made from an Arizona long-term care facility reveal the moments a patient in a vegetative state gave birth. CBS affiliate KPHO-TV obtained the call from Phoenix police. In the call, a nurse at Hacienda HealthCare repeatedly yells, "the baby's turning blue!"

"One of the patients just had a baby and we had no idea she was pregnant," the nurse said during the call. "We were not expecting this."

The nurse is also heard saying the "baby's not responsive," while giving updates on CPR that was being performed on the baby.

The mother, whose identity has not been identified, gave birth on Dec. 29. She has been in a vegetative state for 10 years following a near-drowning. Police are now investigating, and said earlier this week they are still gathering DNA from all male employees at the facility.

"She was not in a position to give consent to any of this," police spokesman Tommy Thompson said. "So if anyone can understand that, this was a helpless victim who was sexually assaulted."

He did not reveal the conditions of the patient and her child, who have since been taken in by family.

A lawyer for the woman's family said they were outraged at the "neglect of their daughter."

Hacienda HealthCare serves infants, children and young adults who are "medically fragile" or have developmental disabilities. It has multiple complaints dating back to 2013,[There's a big surprise] most for emergency preparation or Medicaid eligibility, according to the state's online complaint database for care facilities.

After the patient's delivery was revealed, the Arizona Department of Health Services said new safety measures have been implemented, including increased staff presence during any patient interaction, more monitoring of patient care areas and additional security measures involving visitors. The facility's CEO also resigned.
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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Burning Petard » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:48 pm

'tis a puzzlement.

Was the staff never noticing whether of not she was having female monthly's? She was so fat that she showed no baby bump? (that was the case for my own mother with her fourth child) Just how 'vegetative' was this mother, actually? Those 911 recordist mention mother making sounds.

We males are so ignorant about this kind of stuff. On the other hand, I frequently go into places to buy a cuppa coffee and ask for Black, No Sugar, and it comes with cream and/or sugar. If wait-staff can go through the motions with their brain running on auto-pilot I guess caretakers in this kind of establishment can move patients around to feed, wash and prevent bedsores, and never notice any details changing.

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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby BoSoxGal » Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:16 pm

A vegetative state doesn’t preclude moaning and other vocalizing, nor a range of other bodily movements, including open and moving eyes which might at times appear to focus - vegetative refers to the absence of cognitive awareness. Think Terri Schiavo.

I’m interested in details about the baby’s vitals upon birth. Distress could’ve been from the length of labor - she might’ve labored for many hours unnoticed, considering the obvious lack of attention to patient care at this place. They apparently got him breathing fairly quickly so maybe no harm there - but he got no prenatal monitoring and was nourished by a vessel bedridden for 27 years and fed by g-tube feed calculated to preserve basic functions of said vessel - it assaults the mind to contemplate! Poor baby. :cry:
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Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby RayThom » Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:48 pm

Welcome to Hacienda Health Care and Unplanned Parenthood Center.

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Re: Just In Case You Aren't Pissed Off Enough...

Postby Lord Jim » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:00 pm

I’m interested in details about the baby’s vitals upon birth.


I've poked around a little on the interwebs, but I haven't been able to find out much about the baby's condition, beyond a statement that he is "healthy" (whatever that means) and that the mother's family will be taking care of him.

I think you raise some excellent points; how does a baby born under these horrible conditions not come to term severely underweight and nutritionally deprived?

The good news for him, (and lord knows, nobody deserves some good news more than this little fellow) is that financially at least, he's going to be set for life...

From his medical bills, to his upbringing costs, to his college tuition, to a comfortable retirement, all of his wants and needs will undoubtedly be met by the millions of dollars that will be provided either by settlement or a jury verdict courtesy of Hacienda "HealthCare"...
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