Church massacre

[wesw]

what a little pussy that Nazi is. did you read that, he couldn t go into the ghetto alone, so he killed some nice Christians (paraphrased)? what a f***ing little coward.

some black hoodlums beat up the little white hoodlum and banged his girlfriend for her heroin fix, so he became a little Nazi andwent and killed some nice Christians. that s my guess. I only read the parts of the manifesto that were posted here but that was enough, I only got thru a few pages of Mein Kampft too.

[Lord Jim]

Overheard at the bar last night, out of the mouth of one of the local yokel redecks: "It's about time a white person fought back."

That's beyond disgusting...

[Gob]

BTW "Dylan Storm Roof" seriously?

That's "Dylann" with two "Ns"...

Racism!! That's anti-Welsh!!

The etymology of the name Dylan is somewhat complex. In Welsh, there is a bound item dylanw- which appears in dylanwad ‘influence,’ dylanwadol ‘influential’ and dylanwadu ‘to influence’.[3][4] This element dylanw- appears itself to be a compound of the prefix dy- and the noun llanw ‘tidal flow’. The prefix dy- appears in numerous words in Welsh and is reconstructed in Proto-Celtic as *dī- with the meaning of ‘off, away’.

The item llanw is reconstructed in Proto-Celtic as *φlanwo- ‘flood, filling.’ This *φlanwo- may plausibly have had a reduced form *φlanu- ‘flood.’ This etymology is echoed in the following Gaelic (Irish) words:

[tuinne] nf. in : gob na tuinne, the water edge
[tòn] nf. g. tòine; d. tòin; pl.+an, the fundament
[tonn] nm. g.v. tuinn; pl.+an and tuinn, wave, surge, billow

Alone, the Welsh element dy can mean ‘thy, thine’ or rather ‘your’ (singular) but there is no gloss of this word meaning ‘great,’ as the most cursory glance at the Welsh dictionary proves. The name Dylan, then, can be maintained to be the descendant of a compound of Proto-Celtic elements *dī- φlanu-s which together basically mean something in context relative to one of the following:

‘The flood that recedes’

'The wave that floods'

'The tide that returns'

BTW: Gold's Gym should sue, he 's not a great advert for a body building firm.

[Econoline]

Oscar Hammerstein got it right when he wrote this in 1949.

[BoSoxGal]

Overheard at the American Legion bar tonight, from a veteran: "That kid's gonna get a reward from Crimestoppers."

I think I'll skip watching Sox games at the bar until I get back from my visit to Fenway.

[liberty]

Anyone have any thoughts on the role that the internet played in this tragedy, based on scumbag's own admissions?

If you will check out African American forum on topixs. I can see how it could generate racist both white and black if you will agree there can be such a thing as a black racist. But I think it could be especially bad for young white boys with low self esteem. He goes there and learns how evil white people are. Self esteem is important for a healthy mind set. Perhaps a license should be required to use the internet for visiting bulletin boards.

[Lord Jim]

if you will agree there can be such a thing as a black racist.

Of course there are black racists; but I don't see what that has to do with the case at hand...

And there are black racist websites, but again that has nothing to do with what happened here...

Scumbag didn't hone his "philosophy" or become a radical racist because he was visiting black racist websites...

I'm having trouble following the relevance of your points...

[BoSoxGal]

I'm having trouble following the relevance of your points...

Status quo with liberty, no?

[liberty]

...

Scumbag didn't hone his "philosophy" or become a radical racist because he was visiting black racist websites...

...

Do we know that to be the case?

[Joe Guy]

[BoSoxGal]

Liberty did you read his manifesto? Try taking him at his word - it's pretty clear what kind of propaganda he was ingesting.

[Lord Jim]

Do we know that to be the case?

Uhh, yes, in fact we do... Rock solid, 100%...

As I posted earlier from Roof's "manifesto":

The event that truly awakened me was the Trayvon Martin case. I kept hearing and seeing his name, and eventually I decided to look him up. I read the Wikipedia article and right away I was unable to understand what the big deal was. It was obvious that Zimmerman was in the right. But more importantly this prompted me to type in the words “black on White crime” into Google, and I have never been the same since that day. The first website I came to was the Council of Conservative Citizens. There were pages upon pages of these brutal black on White murders. I was in disbelief. At this moment I realized that something was very wrong. How could the news be blowing up the Trayvon Martin case while hundreds of these black on White murders got ignored?

From this point I researched deeper and found out what was happening in Europe. I saw that the same things were happening in England and France, and in all the other Western European countries. Again I found myself in disbelief. As an American we are taught to accept living in the melting pot, and black and other minorities have just as much right to be here as we do, since we are all immigrants. But Europe is the homeland of White people, and in many ways the situation is even worse there. From here I found out about the Jewish problem and other issues facing our race, and I can say today that I am completely racially aware.

Here again is the link to his complete opus:

http://lastrhodesian.com/data/documents/rtf88.txt

(It's really not that long; you can read it in about five minutes...if you have doubts about what was "informing" his perspective, I strongly advise you to read it.)

And here's a link to the "Statement Of Principles" page for the "Council of Conservative Citizens" website:

http://conservative-headlines.com/intro ... rinciples/

And here's the second "principle" they list:

(2) We believe the United States is a European country and that Americans are part of the European people. We believe that the United States derives from and is an integral part of European civilization and the European people and that the American people and government should remain European in their composition and character. We therefore oppose the massive immigration of non-European and non-Western peoples into the United States that threatens to transform our nation into a non-European majority in our lifetime. We believe that illegal immigration must be stopped, if necessary by military force and placing troops on our national borders; that illegal aliens must be returned to their own countries; and that legal immigration must be severely restricted or halted through appropriate changes in our laws and policies. We also oppose all efforts to mix the races of mankind, to promote non-white races over the European-American people through so-called “affirmative action” and similar measures, to destroy or denigrate the European-American heritage, including the heritage of the Southern people, and to force the integration of the races.

Does that look like something you'd find on a "Black Racist" website?

And bear in mind, this extreme right wing xenophobic operation, was just basically his "gateway drug" into the world of racial hatred websites....from there he undoubtedly went on to sites that were even more extreme and up front about their white supremacist world view...

It's highly unlikely that from the CofCC website he then moved on to The Nation Of Islam website, or the website for the New Black Panther Party....

[liberty]

[quote="Lord Jim"][quote]

Does that look like something you'd find on a "Black Racist" website?

quote]

Well Jim, it was no fun but I read it and you are right there is no mention of a hateful racist exchange on a black web site, but he did say something about white boys being picked on and beat up for being white in a black schools. I wonder if he is talking about himself. I was right about one thing he does appear to have low self esteem:
“Even if my life is worth less than a speck of dirt, I want to use it for the good of society.”.
Someone had convinced him that his life is worthless, I don‘t think people are borne that way.

[liberty]

[quote="Lord Jim"][quote]

Does that look like something you'd find on a "Black Racist" website?

quote]

Well Jim, it was no fun but I read it and you are right there is no mention of a hateful racist exchange on a black web site, but he did say something about white boys being picked on and beat up for being white in a black schools. I wonder if he is talking about himself. I was right about one thing he does appear to have low self esteem:
“Even if my life is worth less than a speck of dirt, I want to use it for the good of society.”.
Someone had convinced him that his life is worthless, I don‘t think people are borne that way.

[Gob]

The leader of a rightwing group that Dylann Roof allegedly credits with helping to radicalise him against black people before the Charleston church massacre has donated tens of thousands of dollars to Republicans such as presidential candidates Ted Cruz, Rand Paul and Rick Santorum.

Earl Holt has given $65,000 to Republican campaign funds in recent years while inflammatory remarks – including that black people were “the laziest, stupidest and most criminally-inclined race in the history of the world” – were posted online in his name.

After being approached by the Guardian on Sunday, Cruz’s presidential campaign said it would be returning all money the senator had received from Holt.

Holt, 62, is the president of the Council of Conservative Citizens (CofCC), a Missouri-based activist organisation cited by the author of a manifesto-style text that was posted on a website registered in Roof’s name along with photographs of the gunman. The FBI said on Saturday it was investigating the website.

[Lord Jim]

he did say something about white boys being picked on and beat up for being white in a black schools. I wonder if he is talking about himself. I was right about one thing he does appear to have low self esteem:
“Even if my life is worth less than a speck of dirt, I want to use it for the good of society.”.
Someone had convinced him that his life is worthless

Well lib, he dropped out of school in the ninth grade, couldn't hold a job, got into drugging and heavy drinking, and didn't have a girlfriend...

So if he has "low self esteem" it seems to me he earned it.

Also, the way that post reads to me it sounds like you're actually expressing sympathy for this piece of garbage...

Please tell me I've got that wrong...

It also sounds like (from this post of yours and earlier ones) you're desperately trying to find some way to blame black people for this guy doing what he did when all of the evidence points overwhelmingly in the opposite direction...

I frankly don't give a shit if he had "low self esteem". (My personal feeling is that like many other losers who commit these kinds of heinous acts, he actually thought quite highly of himself and was resentful that society didn't have the same high opinion of him. The fact that he told the person he let go to "tell the world" what he had done tells me a lot in that regard.)

There's no evidence that he was ever "picked on" by anybody, but I wouldn't care if there were. I don't care that he came from a broken home, or if he didn't get enough attention, etc., etc., etc., blah, blah, blah....

Millions of people have those kinds of backgrounds and experiences (and worse) and they aren't stone cold evil enough to gun down nine defenseless people who welcomed them into their house of worship.

[Lord Jim]

I thought that this was a really good article showing the stark contrast between scumbag and those who made statements at his bond hearing. Here are some excerpts:

June 20, 2015

Mercy and a Manifesto in Charleston

By David Remnick

It is an enduring mystery of life how the moral range of humanity can stretch from a twisted young racist such as Dylann Roof, who faces charges of slaughtering six women and three men during a Bible-study class, to a woman such as Nadine Collier, who is the daughter of one of the victims, Ethel Lance, and who was able to find it in her heart to turn to Roof at his bond hearing and say, “I forgive you.”

How many of us are capable of that? Imagine the capacity for grace in Felicia Sanders, who lost her son, Tywanza, in the Emanuel A.M.E. Church massacre, and who said to the alleged killer at the hearing, “Every fibre in my body hurts, and I will never be the same. But as we say in Bible study, we enjoyed you. But may God have mercy on you.” We enjoyed you. This is a superhuman form of endurance and pity. The world is such a fallen place that it is somehow easier to comprehend the deranged cruelty of Dylann Roof than the unfathomable and uncompromising mercy of Nadine Collier and Felicia Sanders.

Dylann Roof does not stand at the head of a movement. He did not enter Emanuel A.M.E. Church with a mob trailing behind him. He is a loner, a solitary fanatic. But he derives his hatreds and obsessions from a history of American racism and a still-existing cultural seedbed of white supremacism. On Saturday, some persistent amateur investigators on Twitter uncovered what appears to be Roof’s Web site. It is called lastrhodesian.com.

The manifesto reflects a stark and twisted obsession with minorities and race, particularly African-Americans but also Jews and Hispanics. It is drenched in white-separatist racial solidarity; mordant self-pity; and conspiracy thinking. The text moves from blunt hatred (“Niggers are stupid and violent”) to a kind of lunatic auto-didacticism:

“In a modern history class it is always emphasized that, when talking about ‘bad’ things Whites have done in history, they were White. But when we lern about the numerous, almost countless wonderful things Whites have done, it is never pointed out that these people were White. Yet when we learn about anything important done by a black person in history, it is always pointed out repeatedly that they were black. For example when we learn about how George Washington carver was the first nigger smart enough to open a peanut.” (I’ve left all of the grammatical and spelling mistakes uncorrected. It seems the least one could do.)

The anti-Semitism in the text is such that it is a wonder the killer did not make a stop at a local synagogue on the way to Emanuel A.M.E. Church with his .45-calibre handgun. (“Just like niggers, most jews are always thinking about the fact that they are jewish. The other issue is that they network. If we could somehow turn every jew blue for 24 hours, I think there would be a mass awakening, because people would be able to see plainly what is going on.”)

Such was the nature of Roof’s self-education and inspiration. Unlike so many race murderers of another time, Roof felt lonely, unsupported. He writes in the text about the absence of a coherent movement that shares his desire to spark a race war. He seems resentful that his point of view lacks scale, strength, and organization. “I have no choice. I am not in the position to, alone, go into the ghetto and fight. I chose Charleston because it is most historic city in my state, and at one time had the highest ratio of blacks to Whites in the country. We have no skinheads, no real KKK, no one doing anything but talking on the internet. Well someone has to have the bravery to take it to the real world, and I guess that has to be me.”

Outside Emanuel A.M.E. Church on Saturday, hundreds of people gathered to mourn together. My colleague Jelani Cobb, who is in Charleston, told me he thought the crowd was distinctly mixed, “maybe fifty-five to forty-five black.” Beyond that scene of mourning and love, the one thing capable of lifting the spirit was the thought of those remarkable people at the bond hearing. Bethane Middleton-Brown, whose sister DePayne Middleton-Doctor, was killed, was yet another of these. She told Dylann Roof that she was angry for her loss, but that “we are the family that love built. We have no room for hate, so we have to forgive.” How many are capable of such mercy? Nadine Collier, Felicia Sanders, and Bethane Middleton-Brown do not ask to be admired, but still we honor them and take courage from them and join them in their grief and resolution.

http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk ... charleston

[Crackpot]

That's exactly what he's doing and what he does every time there is "white on black crime" and still he adamantly insists that he's not a racist. Not to mention despite his sig line all that bozo seems to do is regress further down his bigoted road.

[Lord Jim]

Well, I have said before that I didn't think that lib was a racist, but that I could easily understand why others could reach that conclusion...(I'm personally very reluctant to make that accusation, probably because I was falsely smeared with it myself repeatedly at the CSB)

But that having been said...

I have to say I'm hard put to come up with an alternative explanation for why someone would be appearing to try so hard to find some way to blame black people in a case like this, where the evidence is so stark, massive and incontrovertible that it was the ideology of white supremacy that formed the "rationale" for what this bastard did.

The unwillingness to accept the overwhelmingly obvious in this case, (and instead try to concoct some sort of fanciful alternative explanation based on absolutely nothing) seems quite peculiar....

Like I said, if the explanation for trying to do this isn't racism, I'm having a really hard time thinking of what else it could be...

[MajGenl.Meade]