Confess Your Sins - Go to Prison

[loCAtek]

All of which leans towards the priest overreacting and going out-of-bounds. Will he(she?) get any disciplinary action?

[Scooter]

Under Canon Law he has incurred automatic excommunication, whose lifting is subject to the Pope alone. This is a VERY big deal. The furthest a priest is supposed to go in such cases, is to encourage the penitant to confess to civil authorities him/herself. If clergy in California are mandated reporters for child sexual abuse, then he was stuck between a rock and a hard place and apparently made his choice as to how he would get squashed.

[Lord Jim]

Scooter, since there's no article link in the OP, we don't really know if this was a Catholic Priest...

[dales]

JoeGuy.....

Do you have a Universal Resource Locator?

[Gob]

Interesting, I'm a "mandatory reporter" I have a legal obligation on me to report any abuse, factual or suspected. I wonder if priests and religious people have the same.

[Crackpot]

it's a foggy area. IIRC the RCC directs reporting of upcoming or continuous crimes but leaves others to personal judgement while frowning on the reporting of petty crimes.

[rubato]

In the local free newspaper I read an article on Thursday, July 15th about a teacher who confessed to her pastor that she recently had sex with a 16 year old boy. The pastor contacted the authorities and - to make a long story short, she has pleaded 'no contest' and faces one year in jail.

Did the pastor do the right thing?

Pastor, not priest.

An RC priest would know how to cover up child sexual abuse better than that. And he would have an entire worldwide apparatus to help him do it.

yrs,
rubato

[Scooter]

Sorry, I saw the word "confession" and jumped to a conclusion.

Whatever the sect, I would imagine that clergy would be subjected to an ethical requirement not to disclose those types of communications, and will be subjected to discipline for breaching it, which I would guess at the very least would involve the loss of his current pastorate and quite possibly the permanent revocation of his credentials. I doubt he took this decision lightly. Also, there is a juvenile victim here, and there may have been reason to believe that the the abuse may have been ongoing, meaning that the pastor had to weigh something more than his obligations to his congregant and to his professional obligations; he now had an obligation (at least a moral one, but possibly legal as well if he is a mandated reporter) to that child as the only adult other than his abuser who knows what is going on.

Interesting, I'm a "mandatory reporter" I have a legal obligation on me to report any abuse, factual or suspected. I wonder if priests and religious people have the same.

More and more now they do, although typically they exempt confessions or similarly penitential communications from the obligation to report.

it's a foggy area. IIRC the RCC directs reporting of upcoming or continuous crimes but leaves others to personal judgement while frowning on the reporting of petty crimes.

Nothing that is disclosed in confession can be disclosed to anyone, with the exception of some sins (e.g. abortion) which the priest cannot absolve on his own authority, and so he will describe the situation (without names) to his bishop to get permission to give absolution. But to civil authorities? Never.

[loCAtek]

Exactly.

The purpose of confession is not to excuse the crime, but to guide the perpetrator towards acknowledging one's responsibility for one's behavior. Mistakes are understood, but repentance without coercion is the goal.

Otherwise, you might as well bring back the Spanish Inquisition.



(I like they guy in the goggles.)

[Gob]

What does a penis and a bible have in common?

Both get rammed down your throat by a Catholic priest.

[rubato]

"...
Whatever the sect, I would imagine that clergy would be subjected to an ethical requirement not to disclose those types of communications, and will be subjected to discipline for breaching it, which I would guess at the very least would involve the loss of his current pastorate and quite possibly the permanent revocation of his credentials.

... "

Depends on the denomination. Many (most?) protestant denominations don't hold with the RC practice of keeping the confidentiality of confessions sacred because they reject the role of the priest/minister as necessary intercessor between the individual and god.


yrs,
rubato

[Big RR]

I agree rubato; adding to this that many ministers (at least potestant ministers) provide counselling and are trained in therapeutic methods, I don't see it as a major problem that a minister is required to have the same reporting obligations as any other mental health therapist. If it were a true preist/penitent matter (such as in the RC church) where an absolute expectation of secrecy is maintained, I might think differently, but I wouldn't make another exception for therapists who haoppen to have religious credentials.

Personally, I am against these reporting obligations in all but the most dire of circumstances because they interfere with the therapist/patient relationship and discourage those who might otherwise seek help from doing so, but I think if ministers choose to counsel, they should be subject to the same rule as other counsellors.

[Gob]

I find this shocking.

According to Davis, “We understand we will need all the help we can get to take on the might of the obscenely wealthy, manipulative Catholic Church.” She continues, “Our biggest problem is the fact that the Catholic Church has always demanded they be treated as above the law, by police, by courts and by lawmakers.

In NSW alone the Catholic Church is exempted from mandatory reporting of child abuse, protected by the statute of limitations, and cannot be sued because of an outrageous special interest law passed in 1936.” Page 2 of 3 MEDIA RELEASE SCAA will lobby for and provide input into the development of more "survivor-friendly" laws, hoping to reduce the triple whammy effect that currently denies victims justice.

According to Davis, “Victims are blocked from suing the Church in the civil courts, stripped of all their rights by the Church’s incredibly abusive internal system, Towards Healing, and raped all over again by a court system riddled with loopholes and biased in favour of sexual predators.” It is also SCAA’s intention to expose the Catholic Church’s bullying tactics, and callous attitude towards survivors for exactly what it is “A despicable act of inhumanity and immorality”, according to Davis.

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/june ... vivors.php

[rubato]

I find this shocking.

According to Davis, “We understand we will need all the help we can get to take on the might of the obscenely wealthy, manipulative Catholic Church.” She continues, “Our biggest problem is the fact that the Catholic Church has always demanded they be treated as above the law, by police, by courts and by lawmakers.

In NSW alone the Catholic Church is exempted from mandatory reporting of child abuse, protected by the statute of limitations, and cannot be sued because of an outrageous special interest law passed in 1936.” Page 2 of 3 MEDIA RELEASE SCAA will lobby for and provide input into the development of more "survivor-friendly" laws, hoping to reduce the triple whammy effect that currently denies victims justice.

According to Davis, “Victims are blocked from suing the Church in the civil courts, stripped of all their rights by the Church’s incredibly abusive internal system, Towards Healing, and raped all over again by a court system riddled with loopholes and biased in favour of sexual predators.” It is also SCAA’s intention to expose the Catholic Church’s bullying tactics, and callous attitude towards survivors for exactly what it is “A despicable act of inhumanity and immorality”, according to Davis.

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/june ... vivors.php

The central purpose of the Catholic church has been to perpetuate the sexual abuse of children, not expose it. What is remarkable is how well they have done getting civil society to help them by getting legal protections not offered to anyone else.

yrs,
rubato

[loCAtek]

I disagree, and I have no loyalty to the Catholic Church. Societies from large organizations to small communities are prone to denial in the face of critical judgment. Within my family and other Latino families, there were cases of abuse that were simply covered up; not reported; not talked about, because 'we protected our own'.

The CPS has to deal with a lot of that, either in investigations or in court; not due to religious reasons, but because of human nature.