Largest mass shooting in American history

All the shit that doesn't fit!
If it doesn't go into the other forums, stick it in here.
A general free for all
User avatar
dales
Posts: 10922
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2010 5:13 am
Location: SF Bay Area - NORTH California - USA

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by dales »

What plethora of regulations? If anything they are less regulated now. More places allow open carry and concealed weapon permits are easier to get. I can get a handgun in two weeks just like I could back in1991. I can't get a 15 round magazine in calif. Anymore.
Try obtaining a ccw here in CA.

The only persons who seem to have them are well-heeled politicos and other gadflies.

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
rubato

User avatar
MajGenl.Meade
Posts: 21506
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:51 am
Location: Groot Brakrivier
Contact:

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

rubato wrote:What plethora of regulations? If anything they are less regulated now. More places allow open carry and concealed weapon permits are easier to get. I can get a handgun in two weeks just like I could back in1991. I can't get a 15 round magazine in calif. Anymore.

And since when are security guards guaranteed the ability to buy an m-16?

You worship guns and treat them like sacred objects.
I don't worship guns, you silly little man; why I don't even own one, but I believe you do. No?

What has 1991 to do with anything? I spoke of 1963 when you could buy guns by mail without any resistance whatever. I don't know that security guards are guaranteed any ability - I do know the killer was (supposedly) vetted very thoroughly before being given license to carry weapons legally. So change the law - whatever. See how many Islamic terrorists are impressed enough to just quietly stay home at night.
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

User avatar
Joe Guy
Posts: 15478
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:40 pm
Location: Redweird City, California

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Joe Guy »

dales wrote: We as an extended family own gunz up the wazoo!
Sounds painful. Did y'all run out of space in your gun safes?... :nana

User avatar
Gob
Posts: 33646
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 8:40 am

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Gob »

An Islamic preacher who has called for gay people to be executed gave sermons in Orlando just weeks before the Pulse nightclub massacre.

Farrokh Sekaleshfar - a British-born doctor and Muslim scholar - has gained a following by urging Muslims to 'get rid of' homosexuals.

And in April, he took his speech titled 'How to deal with the phenomenon of homosexuality' to the Husseini Islamic Center in Sanford, just outside Orlando, Florida.

Two months later, 29-year-old Omar Mateen carried out the worst massacre in US history by opening fire on a gay club in the same city.

Mateen's father has said he believes the attack was motivated by his son's homophobia.

“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

User avatar
Bicycle Bill
Posts: 9825
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:10 pm
Location: Living in a suburb of Berkeley on the Prairie along with my Yellow Rose of Texas

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Bicycle Bill »

Gob wrote:Mateen's father has said he believes the attack was motivated by his son's homophobia.
Y'know, I always thought the suffix "-phobia" meant "fear" ... like in arachnophobia, agoraphobia, acrophobia, claustrophobia, orphidiophobia, or even triskaidekaphobia.  But this seems to go much further, past the bounds of fear to the outright despising of homosexuals.  I feel we need a new word.

So, if someone who despises women is a "misogynist", someone who despises mankind in general is a "misanthrope", and an "iconoclast" is someone who attacks cherished beliefs or traditions, shouldn't the term being tossed around in the wake of this incident be something more along the lines of "misohomic" or "homoclast"?
Image
-"BB"-
Yes, I suppose I could agree with you ... but then we'd both be wrong, wouldn't we?

User avatar
Scooter
Posts: 17319
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:04 pm
Location: Toronto, ON

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Scooter »

An Islamic preacher who has called for gay people to be executed gave sermons in Orlando just weeks before the Pulse nightclub massacre.

Farrokh Sekaleshfar - a British-born doctor and Muslim scholar - has gained a following by urging Muslims to 'get rid of' homosexuals.

And in April, he took his speech titled 'How to deal with the phenomenon of homosexuality' to the Husseini Islamic Center in Sanford, just outside Orlando, Florida.

Two months later, 29-year-old Omar Mateen carried out the worst massacre in US history by opening fire on a gay club in the same city.

Mateen's father has said he believes the attack was motivated by his son's homophobia.
An Italian Roman Catholic bishop gave a homily last Sunday saying the same thing. Are we going to start turning back Catholics at the border in case one of them decides to put the bishop's words into action?
"Hang on while I log in to the James Webb telescope to search the known universe for who the fuck asked you." -- James Fell

User avatar
RayThom
Posts: 8604
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:38 pm
Location: Longwood Gardens PA 19348

Largest Mass Shooting In American History

Post by RayThom »

Bicycle Bill wrote:... I feel we need a new word... something more along the lines of "misohomic" or "homoclast"?
Yo, BB, apparently there are other like-minded people out there.
Misohomic:
https://answers.yahoo.com/question/inde ... 005AAR34r1
Homoclast:
https://superfineapostate.wordpress.com ... ps-family/

And then there are Rich Hall's Sniglets. You might try getting in touch with him to see if you can get you new words added to the lexicon.
http://grammar.about.com/od/rs/g/Sniglet-term.htm
Image
“In a world whose absurdity appears to be so impenetrable, we simply must reach a greater degree of understanding among us, a greater sincerity.” 

User avatar
Gob
Posts: 33646
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 8:40 am

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Gob »

Scooter wrote: An Italian Roman Catholic bishop gave a homily last Sunday saying the same thing. Are we going to start turning back Catholics at the border in case one of them decides to put the bishop's words into action?
Wouldn't be a bad idea.

Image
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

User avatar
RayThom
Posts: 8604
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:38 pm
Location: Longwood Gardens PA 19348

Largest Mass Shooting In American History

Post by RayThom »

Image[/quote]

Well, I say 'amen' to that, Gob.

Image
Image
“In a world whose absurdity appears to be so impenetrable, we simply must reach a greater degree of understanding among us, a greater sincerity.” 

User avatar
dales
Posts: 10922
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2010 5:13 am
Location: SF Bay Area - NORTH California - USA

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by dales »

THESE THREE MURDERED PERSONS MIGHT NOT AGREE WITH THAT.

Image

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
rubato

User avatar
MajGenl.Meade
Posts: 21506
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:51 am
Location: Groot Brakrivier
Contact:

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

Stalin wasn't it? Or Pol Pot? Or Mao? One or more of them anyway
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

User avatar
RayThom
Posts: 8604
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:38 pm
Location: Longwood Gardens PA 19348

Largest Mass Shooting In American History

Post by RayThom »

Madalyn Murray O'Hair's brand of atheism varied widely from mine. She wasn't wrapped too tight and had enemies of all stripes.

Just like there are many psychotic christians out there, there is also a handful of psychotic atheists. I accept it as the human condition.
Image
“In a world whose absurdity appears to be so impenetrable, we simply must reach a greater degree of understanding among us, a greater sincerity.” 

User avatar
Bicycle Bill
Posts: 9825
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:10 pm
Location: Living in a suburb of Berkeley on the Prairie along with my Yellow Rose of Texas

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Bicycle Bill »

Found these on someone's Twitter feed.  The video is only about eight minutes, and she pretty well sums up most of my feelings on the subject.

Image

Image
-"BB"-
Yes, I suppose I could agree with you ... but then we'd both be wrong, wouldn't we?

User avatar
Guinevere
Posts: 8990
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2010 3:01 pm

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Guinevere »

Driving a car is a privilege, not a right. It is long past time that owning guns be a privilege too.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

User avatar
MajGenl.Meade
Posts: 21506
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:51 am
Location: Groot Brakrivier
Contact:

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

That may be so, Guin. But thus far, owning guns is a right and I doubt that will change (much). OTOH, I think I'd be fine with a ban on semi-automatic pistols and long arms.
For Christianity, by identifying truth with faith, must teach-and, properly understood, does teach-that any interference with the truth is immoral. A Christian with faith has nothing to fear from the facts

MGMcAnick
Posts: 1358
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 10:01 pm
Location: 12 NM from ICT @ 010º

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by MGMcAnick »

MajGenl.Meade wrote: OTOH, I think I'd be fine with a ban on semi-automatic pistols and long arms.
Do you mean fully automatic, or do you think all guns should require reloading after each single shot like my grandfather's .22 Winchester? My son will probably pass that 112 year old gun on to one of his children. None have hit the age at which him or me first shot it.

We're not "gun nuts" but we do own a few. I've never bought a gun. All three of my guns were inherited.
A friend of Doc's, one of only two B-29 bombers still flying.

User avatar
Bicycle Bill
Posts: 9825
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:10 pm
Location: Living in a suburb of Berkeley on the Prairie along with my Yellow Rose of Texas

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Bicycle Bill »

MGMcAnick wrote:Do you mean fully automatic, or do you think all guns should require reloading after each single shot like my grandfather's .22 Winchester? My son will probably pass that 112 year old gun on to one of his children. None have hit the age at which him or me first shot it.

We're not "gun nuts" but we do own a few. I've never bought a gun. All three of my guns were inherited.
No need to go from one extreme to the other; there are other ways to get a second round into the chamber than a gas or spring recoil and return that happens each time (and as fast as) one pulls the trigger.  There's bolt action like on the German Mauser K98k rifles of WWII or my own Marlin .22, lever action like on the Winchester carbines found in the saddle scabbards of just about every western movie ever made, or pump action like the old Remington model 870s.  And yes, there's still always "break open and reload" like the old sporting shotguns of the British aristocracy of the 19th and early 20th century.
Image
-"BB"-
Yes, I suppose I could agree with you ... but then we'd both be wrong, wouldn't we?

User avatar
Sue U
Posts: 9135
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:59 pm
Location: Eastern Megalopolis, North America (Midtown)

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Sue U »

Guinevere wrote:Driving a car is a privilege, not a right. It is long past time that owning guns be a privilege too.
MajGenl.Meade wrote:That may be so, Guin. But thus far, owning guns is a right and I doubt that will change (much).
As I have repeatedly said, the point is exactly to change it. By now, the entire fucking country should be so fucking sick and fucking tired of fucking gun crimes to finally get up on their fucking hind legs and shout E-FUCKING-NOUGH!!!!!

Yes, in fact, I DO want to take away your fucking guns. All of them. As far as I am concerned, if you want to go out and try to mass murder people with rocks or whatever, fine, but I'm not going to let you have a fucking gun to do it, let lone a gun that can mow down dozens of people in a minute of mayhem. But I am perfectly capable of recognizing that my own personal view of NO FUCKING GUNS -- no matter how rational -- is not necessarily going to work for everyone in this stupid fucking country.

So like I keep saying, using my fucking inside voice despite my fucking rage, the Second Amendment is an anachronism that has long outlived whatever use it may have had. There is absolutely NO rational public policy justification for enshrining gun ownership as a constitutional right. The constitution is not the sacred Word of God, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with changing it in light of a world that has changed to replace muskets with semi- or fully automatic weapons. Especially since the Second Amendment, as the fundamental obstacle to effective gun control, is directly responsible for the fucked up gun policy we are forced to live with.

Repeal of the Second Amendment (unfortunately) DOESN'T mean that all guns will be outlawed. All it means is that federal, state and local governments would be able to regulate ownership, type and use of firearms without fear of constitutional infraction. State and local governments could implement the type of regulations that are appropriate for their particular areas and populations. If my city wants to severely restrict or even outlaw handguns because they are routinely used in crime here, why shouldn't we be permitted to do so? I understand that there are legitimate reasons for gun ownership -- even handguns -- but that doesn't require a blanket constitutional "right" to ownership.

There is nothing wrong with making gun ownership a licensed privilege rather than a right. Nobody needs a fucking right to a fucking gun.

If I sound angry and disgusted, it is because I am.
GAH!

User avatar
Guinevere
Posts: 8990
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2010 3:01 pm

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Guinevere »

I do love you so!
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

Big RR
Posts: 14932
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 9:47 pm

Re: Largest mass shooting in American history

Post by Big RR »

Sue--while I agree your approach is the correct one, I seriously doubt we could get enough broad based support to repeal the second amendment; hell we couldn't even pass the equal rights amendment. From what I have seen, guns are too far ingrained into the American culture to permit the amendment to be repealed--even if it were to win in Congress, I would bet we couldn't get enough states to ratify it.

So the alternative is to work within the law and promote reasonable regulation of firearms that will pass constitutional muster. Better background checks, mandatory waiting permits for purchases, background checks for gun shows and private sales all would pass Constitutional muster and can be promoted. Be angry, but don't let the rhetoric play into the hands of the NRA to whip up opposition to even reasonable controls.

IMHO, that's exactly what the proposal to ban gun sales to anyone on the Justice Department's list will do. It is inconceivable that those promoting it would think that the executive could draw up a list and then use it to restrict the rights of the persons on it without any involvement of the courts (or even a right to challenge it) would be upheld in light of the second amendment. Perhaps we could enact a law to permit some on the list to be charged and adjudicated as such dangers (and then be denied their rights), but this would require (IMHO) the right to review the evidence and confront the accusers, and I doubt the executive branch would want to allow either. So we have people pandering to fear and frustration, proposing a blatantly unconstitutional law which will, in all likelihood, be struck down by the courts, just so they can say "we tried". I'd rather see them campaign for repealing the second amendment--or, even better, regulations that would be constitutional, but the rhetoric is better with the proposed ban.

Post Reply