George Zimmerman Trial to Start in June

[Lord Jim]

Facts rule over emotion, well done.

I think that says it very well.

Oh-oh.....................it's going to be a long hot summer.

Well, Dale the good news, (very good news) about that is there has apparently been no immediate outbreak of violence either in the community there in Sanford or anywhere else in the country. (There's a march going on at the moment right here in San Francisco, but it's been peaceful.)

Tomorrow there will be marches and rallies all over the country, but if we get past tomorrow night without violence, I think we could be out of the woods on that. If everything remains peaceful in the reaction to this I think that would be a fantastic watershed moment for the country. It will break the cycle of expectation that every time there is a high profile racially charged case that if the decision doesn't go a certain way, the result will be violence, and that would represent an enormous step forward.

As for Zimmerman himself, any idea that he has somehow escaped punishment, is completely eroneous. He will of course no doubt write a book that will set him financially, but he still will have to spend at least the next few years of his life in hiding and seclusion. (Even if there is no mob violence, there are still a lot folks out there who I'm sure would be happy to act on their own directly against him, given the chance.)

Also as Liberty pointed out there's still the possibility of a civil suit, and tonight the NAACP announced that it's going to pursue civil rights charges with the Justice Department. (Personally I don't think that's going to happen; this isn't the Rodney King case. The Justice department is going to see the same evidence that was brought in this case, and when they look at that I believe the decision will be made not to bring charges that will likely fail and only serve to further stir up racial animus.)

As for the civil suit, yes the standard is preponderance of the evidence, but given the evidence even that is significant bar, and while I'm sure the pressure will be strong from publicity seekers like Crump to pursue it, the Martin family will need to think long and hard about whether they want to go through that, when there's a very good chance they could wind up facing the same pain and disappointment they are feeling tonight.

[Lord Jim]

I want to say something about the prosecutors in this case.

From what I said here earlier today, one could get the impression that I think they somehow did a bad job, or were poor lawyers. That is certainly not the case.

I think they probably did just about as well anyone could given the paucity of what they had to work with. For political reasons, they were saddled with a case that was over-charged, given the evidence and testimony that did not support the charge. I don't blame them for building their case around the appeal to emotionalism; it was really all they had.

If they hadn't been faced with having to try to prove the elements of 2 degree murder, and instead had been able to structure their case around the manslaughter charge, would they have had a better chance of getting a conviction? Certainly. But it still would have been far from a slam dunk, given how strong the evidence was for self defense, and the fact that they would still have had the reasonable doubt standard, I believe the odds would still have been against them.

I've seen a lot of finger pointing towards the prosecutors by those pundits and legal analysts on the news channels who have seen Zimmerman as guilty of murder since day one, claiming they somehow blew the case. These folks simply do not want to accept that this was a lousy case, and that the evidence for conviction was objectively, on the merits, extremely weak. The finest legal minds imaginable would have been hard put to get a conviction with the available evidence. Of course there are some folks who will simply never accept this.

I've seen a lot of outrageous hyperbole expressed this evening, (Melissa Harris-Perry said that her 11 year old texted her that "there's no justice in America", ) but the first place blue ribbon for this has to go to attorney Benjamin Crump, who likened Trayvon Martin to Medgar Evers...

[Lord Jim]

Well, turns out there was violence one place in the country...

Guess where:

OAKLAND -- About 100 people marched late Saturday night throughout downtown Oakland, breaking windows, vandalizing cars and buildings with spray paint and starting fires in the street in protest of George Zimmerman's acquittal hours earlier in a Florida courtroom.

The atmosphere was tense, with some marchers attempting to start fights and police dressed in riot gear in front of the police department headquarters, according to staff photographer Anda Chu. Footage from television helicopters showed protesters trashing a police squad car and a line of police blocking the protesters' path.

Occupy Oakland organized the gathering over Twitter at 10 p.m., encouraging protesters to wear hoodies, as Trayvon Martin did when he was shot to death by Zimmerman.

Some protesters held a banner declaring: "We Are All Trayvon Martin." Others spray-painted anti-police graffiti throughout Frank Ogawa Plaza, while a small contingent of officers looked on from afar.

The group began to march around 11 p.m. and some began breaking windows, including some on the Oakland Tribune downtown offices.

One BART police car was also vandalized with spray paint and its windows were smashed. Protesters also burned an American and a California state flag at a McDonald's restaurant on 14th and Jackson streets and spray painted Alameda County's Davidson courthouse.

The Oakland protest followed a San Francisco rally by a couple hundred people who marched peacefully from the Mission and 24th Street BART station to 16th Street and back over a two-hour period while a dozen police vehicles escorted them. After some loud protests, San Francisco organizers ended their march around 10 p.m., asking participants to return Sunday at Powell and Market streets.

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-new ... an-verdict

[dales]

Stay Classy, Oakland











A lot of these cretins remind me of the Occu-tard movement of years past. Some old retreads, same old violence and their ugly faces look WHITE..................LMFAO!

[Jarlaxle]

Indeed, Zimmerman is a marked man and it would serve his best interest to burrow down into the depths obscurity. I wouldn't be surprised if that Black Panthers have put a price on his head.

Grow your hair long, a beard and head west.

He needs to skip the country, or he won't live a year.

[rubato]

the pithiest comment I've seen yet:

Tom Marney said...

"'He’s going to be looking over his shoulder the rest of his life,' Robert Zimmerman Jr. said during an interview on CNN."

Wow, Zimmerman is, like, an honorary black man now.

http://delong.typepad.com/sdj/2013/07/t ... .html#more

[Lord Jim]

I have to admit rube, that's a good one....

[liberty]

Well Jim, Zimmerman did follow the kid after the police had advised him not to; was that not negligent?

[dales]

No, it was STUPID.

[rubato]

It looks like there's going to be a civil trial for damages. He'll have a lot tougher time.

yrs,
rubato

[dales]

Yes, he will.

[Joe Guy]

Well Jim, Zimmerman did follow the kid after the police had advised him not to; was that not negligent?

Sorry, but that's an incorrect statement that I've heard many times throughout this trial and continuing.

First, it was a recording of Zimmerman's call to the Non-Emergency Line. 2nd, it was a dispatcher, not the "police" talking to him and he said, "We don't need you to do that."

3rd, it was never established in court that Zimmerman followed Trayvon, although people have been repeating that all along.

The act of negligence was also never established in court. I don't even recall the term being used but I could have missed it.

We'll never know what might have happened if Zimmerman had stayed in his car. One can only speculate.

[dales]

We'll never know what might have happened if Zimmerman had stayed in his car. One can only speculate.

Nothing except perhaps a B and E (if Trayvon was out to steal something) that would have been the worst thing instead of a killing.

[rubato]

Well Jim, Zimmerman did follow the kid after the police had advised him not to; was that not negligent?

Sorry, but that's an incorrect statement that I've heard many times throughout this trial and continuing.

First, it was a recording of Zimmerman's call to the Non-Emergency Line. 2nd, it was a dispatcher, not the "police" talking to him and he said, "We don't need you to do that."

3rd, it was never established in court that Zimmerman followed Trayvon, although people have been repeating that all along.

The act of negligence was also never established in court. I don't even recall the term being used but I could have missed it.

We'll never know what might have happened if Zimmerman had stayed in his car. One can only speculate.

Horse shit.

If Zimmerman had not followed Trayvon he would not have been anywhere near him.

It is stupid to suggest otherwise.

yrs,
rubato

[Joe Guy]

Horse shit.

If Zimmerman had not followed Trayvon he would not have been anywhere near him.

It is stupid to suggest otherwise.

Then don't stupidly suggest that.

I didn't.

[Lord Jim]

A civil trial will not be a slam dunk, not even with the lower preponderance of the evidence standard...

Yes, Zimmerman can be compelled to testify, but there's also a lot of evidence, (not favorable to the Martin family) that would likely come in that was excluded in the criminal trial...

Like a pattern of behavior and a number of text messages from Martin that would tend to show him to have a "short fuse" and a proclivity for violence...

Speaking of civil trials, Zimmerman's got a pretty good case pending....Against NBC...(specifically MSNBC)

Shortly after this story broke in the national news, somebody at MSNBC edited the tape of Zimmerman's initial call to make it appear that Zimmerman had answered the 911 operator's question, "what makes him look suspicious? " by saying "he looks black"....

Which is not at all what Zimmerman said...he said "he looks black" in answer to a later question from the operator asking him if the person looked "white, black or Hispanic"...

And then they aired the edited tape...

[Lord Jim]

The bottom line here is this...(No matter how much some folks apparently don't want to accept it....)

Yes it, is undeniably true that if George Zimmerman had stayed in his car that night none of this would have happened...

It is also undeniably true that being followed when one is doing nothing wrong, is going to seem obnoxious, irritating and annoying....

However, someone behaving in a way that is obnoxious, irritating and annoying, (but who has not laid hands on you, or physically threatened you in any way, and broken no laws) does not give you the right to respond by physically assaulting that person by breaking their nose, and then sitting astride them pounding their head into the sidewalk....

And if you choose to respond that way to the obnoxious, irritating and annoying person, he has a presumptive right to act in self defense.

[Jarlaxle]

Florida has an unusual law: anyone who has killed someone in self-defense CANNOT BE SUED FOR THAT PERSON'S DEATH in civil court! There will be no wrongful-death suit against Zimmerman. (Statute 776.032)

[dales]

George Zimmerman will get his gun back now that he has been cleared of murder and his lawyer said today that Zimmerman needs the weapon "even more" than before.

Zimmerman's lawyer Mark O'Mara also practically dared the family of Trayvon Martin to file a widely expected civil suit against him, but said that Zimmerman might be filing lawsuits of his own.

O'Mara, in an exclusive interview with ABC News, suggested that Zimmerman has no regrets about carrying a gun on Feb. 26, 2012, the night he killed Martin, a teenager.

Watch ABC News' Exclusive Interview With George Zimmerman's Lawyer on World News Tonight at 6:30 PM

Prosecutors in their closing argument had said that Zimmerman getting out of his car with a loaded gun to follow the teenager led to Martin's shooting. He was acquitted Saturday night of murder in Martin's death in a case that has sparked widespread outrage among supporters of the Martin family.

The lawyer said Zimmerman, 29, will be entitled to get his Kel Tec 9 pistol back.

"Yes, he does," O'Mara said. "The concealed weapons permit is another matter because that's a decision by another state agency and they will make that decision."

The George Zimmerman Case in Pictures

He said that Zimmerman intends to rearm himself. When asked if he would carry a gun, O'Mara said, 'Yes. [There's] even more reason now, isn't there? There are a lot of people out there who actually hate him, though they shouldn't."

The former neighborhood watch captain wears a protective vest when he goes out in public, although he didn't wear it to court, O'Mara said.

Zimmerman does not believe that having a gun caused Martin's death, his lawyer said.

"I think that he feels truly in his heart that if he did not have that weapon that night he might not be here.... [He] would have continued to get beat even though he was screaming for help."

Zimmerman is expected to have other court battles, some that he might initiate.

"I think there are going to be a number of civil suits. I would be very surprised if any of those civil suits are filed against George Zimmerman and we welcome them," O'Mara said.

He indicated that Zimmerman may file suits against others, however.

"There are a number of events that happened during this case and the way certain people handled it that we may need to hold responsible. We'll see," O'Mara said.

Zimmerman's lawyer suggested that his client might want to move to another part of the country.

"If I was him I would go somewhere else," O'Mara said.

He said Zimmerman will be unable to find a job.

"I don't think he can work. I don't think anyone can hire him... George is a pariah," his lawyer said.

[dgs49]

Zimmerman can hook up with that babe who killed her baby - also in hiding. Casey Anthony?

Dialog that never happened: "Hey kid, what are you doing here; this is a gated community?"

"I'm visiting my father who lives in the next block."

End of conversation. End of incident.

I read a comment on another BBS last week, that Trayvon had only two choices, "fight or flight." I believe the writer was an American of black African ancestry.

This kind of caustic stupidy is the reason why Trayvon is dead. And from all indications, it is no great loss.

Now we will have the joy of reading attorneys' explanations of why a Civil Rights prosecution is not "double jeopardy."