Crocodile tears

[Long Run]

Man who made his living killing African wildlife gets eaten by African wildlife
[BGR News]
Mike Wehner
BGR NewsApril 21, 2017

Scott Van Zyl made his living taking wealthy clients on “safaris” for the sole purpose of bringing home trophies like leopards, zebras, wildebeests and even lions. Now, investigators in Zimbabwe believe that Van Zyl ended up on the wrong end of the predator-prey relationship, and DNA tests have confirmed that he was attacked, killed, and eaten by crocodiles while on a hunting trip.

Van Zyl, who ran SS Pro Safaris, offered specials for hunters to spend a week or more on his hunting lands which border nature preserves, with the promise of killing up to seven different species for $9,000. He also offered other hunting expeditions with targets like elephants and giraffes, though specifics for those, including prices, aren’t listed on the company’s site. Photos of clients holding the bodies of several rare species are posted on Van Zyl’s site, along with the motto “Stop whining, go hunting.”

The circumstances surrounding his death are spotty, but reports suggest that Van Zyl and a second hunter and a pack of dogs. The two men split up, choosing to travel on foot alone, but when the dogs returned to the base camp without Van Zyl, his companion knew something was wrong.

His footprints were tracked to a riverbank where searchers found his backpack as well as several large Nile crocodiles. Authorities killed the crocs after getting clearance to do so and subsequently discovered human remains inside the stomach of one of them. Tests of the remains matched Van Zyl. The incident is just one of a handful of fatal crocodile attacks tallied so far in 2017 alone.

[rubato]

Allowing paid hunting gives an economic value to the wildlife so that local populations have an incentive to protect them. When they have stopped hunting the animals became a nuisance and an unrealized food source to the locals who killed them off.


yrs,
rubato

[Gob]

Scott Van Zyl made his living taking wealthy clients on “safaris” for the sole purpose of bringing home trophies like leopards, zebras, wildebeests and even lions. Now, investigators in Zimbabwe believe that Van Zyl ended up on the wrong end of the predator-prey relationship, and DNA tests have confirmed that he was attacked, killed, and eaten by crocodiles while on a hunting trip.

Karma can be a bitch...

[Sue U]

I gotta say, in situations like this I root for the crocodiles.

[Jarlaxle]

Allowing paid hunting gives an economic value to the wildlife so that local populations have an incentive to protect them. When they have stopped hunting the animals became a nuisance and an unrealized food source to the locals who killed them off.


yrs,
rubato

Spot on.

[Bicycle Bill]

Allowing paid hunting gives an economic value to the wildlife so that local populations have an incentive to protect them. When they have stopped hunting the animals became a nuisance and an unrealized food source to the locals who killed them off.

yrs,
rubato

So let me get this straight .... we protect them so that we can hunt them, because if we didn't hunt them no one would have any interest in protecting them.

I thought we had moved past Viet Nam, the Tet offensive of 1968, and the famous quote attributed to an unnamed US Army major who claimed that "... it became necessary to destroy the town (of Bến Tre) to save it."

-"BB"-

[liberty]

Allowing paid hunting gives an economic value to the wildlife so that local populations have an incentive to protect them. When they have stopped hunting the animals became a nuisance and an unrealized food source to the locals who killed them off.

yrs,
rubato

So let me get this straight .... we protect them so that we can hunt them, because if we didn't hunt them no one would have any interest in protecting them.

.gif[/img]
-"BB"-

African have some strange ideas about eating. They don’t understands that they are blessed, they don’t have to worry about getting fat and having to loose weight. Why can’t they see how well off they are; some people can’t be grateful. Someone pass the steak, mashed potatoes and gravy. Lucky slobs over there don’t understand the curse of too much. Eating is just nasty habit anyway.

[rubato]

"...
So let me get this straight .... we protect them so that we can hunt them, because if we didn't hunt them no one would have any interest in protecting them.

... "

The experiment has been done. In an area where formerly controlled hunting was allowed and which helped to local economy by providing jobs it was banned. After it was banned the local people started killing off the lions because lions were now a threat and an economic cost to people who lived by herding goats and cows. The fees from hunting also helped a very poor country fund conservation programs they could not afford otherwise.

There is no logical analogy to the quote "we had to destroy the village in order to save it" . T

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-32815508

Why Zambia lifted ban on hunting lions and leopards
By Milton Nkosi BBC Africa, Johannesburg

25 May 2015
From the section Africa

Big-cat trophy hunting is regarded by many as primitive in this day and age.

So why would a country like Zambia lift the ban on the shooting and killing of its precious lion and leopard populations?

The answer is very clear - it is the need for foreign currency in order to fund sustainable wildlife programmes, which can be costly, and also to benefit local communities.

Trophy hunting is a multi-million dollar industry - a licence to shoot a lion can cost up to $25,000 (£15,000) in neighbouring countries.

Zambia's economy was built on the back of copper mining but now commodities are on a cyclical downward spiral. Consequently the country's currency, the kwacha, has lost a substantial amount of its value.

For this small country, tourism is another way of bringing in foreign currency.

There is no doubt that the beautiful banks of the Zambezi river in Livingstone and the Victoria Falls are still a draw card for international tourists but take a closer look at the numbers and it soon becomes clear that trophy hunters bring the lion's share of the greenback.
Different cats

Zambia's country director of the World Wildlife Fund Nyambe Nyambe told me that when the ban was initially announced back in 2013 "there were not enough monitoring systems in place". ... "

yrs,
rubato

[Lord Jim]

Rube's actually got the complete right end of the stick on this...

(Hey, not even Donald Trump is always wrong...)

[Bicycle Bill]

Zambia's New Economic Policy

Some countries have oil.
Some countries have mineral resources.
Some countries have a technologically competent workforce.
We've got lions.
Come, pay to shoot our lions.

My feeling is that a policy that promotes and encourages creating a steady supply of living targets and then depending on the economic income of someone paying to shoot them is not all that much different from raising cattle and then charging someone to come onto their range in order to take down a Texas Longhorn.  It's almost as bad as being a place that would promote and encourage sexual tourism, as was the case in several southeast Asian countries not all that long ago (and still is, to some degree, in certain cities in Europe).

-"BB"-

[wesw]

trophy hunters disgust me.

catering to the great white hunter is no way to live. it is subjugation.

now wildlife touristry, allowing others to enjoy your home, for a fee..., is sustainable..., and a bit more respectable and respectful of the people and the land.

....but what do I know" I m just a simple fisherman.

[Jarlaxle]

Do some actual research, actually try to understand what you are blathering about, Wes...you may not look quite this stupid.

[Lord Jim]

Do some actual research, actually try to understand what you are blathering about, Wes...you may not look quite this stupid.

No, I doubt that would help...

[Jarlaxle]

Yeah, fair point....................

[liberty]

This maybe old but it is still relevant:

http://www.beefmagazine.com/blog/why-de ... -producers

brought to you by
Livestock>Beef Quality
Why the death of Cecil the lion is relevant to beef producers
Amanda Radke 1 | Aug 04, 2015

Unless you’ve been living under a rock lately, you’ve probably noticed the hotly-debated death of Cecil the lion, a 13-year old African lion living in Zimbabwe National Park, that was killed by Minnesota hunter and dentist, Walter Palmer. The news of this hunt has spread like wildfire, thanks to social media, but why does it matter to cattle producers?
It matters because the same arguments used to defile hunting and hunters are used against ranching and ranchers. Agriculturalists are seasoned veterans at defending our management practices even in the face of an activist-released YouTube video or negative media headlines about food production. Often, hunting and livestock production get lumped together as one, which is why I feel compelled to comment on this topic.

sponsored content
Copper and immune function MAR 15, 2017
For starters, I think it goes without saying that, just like the bad apples in the agricultural industry, nobody should stand behind a hunter who illegally or unethically kills an animal. Ultimately, all the righteous rhetoric on
social media isn’t a court of law, and I’m in no position to judge whether Palmer did the right or wrong thing during this hunt. However, more than social media attacking Palmer, we are seeing the entire sport of hunting and fishing getting lumped into one basket. Recently, my husband, who is an avid sportsman, defended his hobby to a Facebook friend who made the grand-sweeping statement that she’ll never understand hunting for sport.
READ: What can ranchers learn from a hunting cheerleader?
Here is what Tyler had to say: “If everything the media is reporting is true, I agree this guy is not a true sportsman. He seems to live on the shady side of the law and needs to hire a more respectable guide for his safari. That being said, hunters and fishermen are the number-one contributors to conservation, by far. The $50,000 he spent probably went back into the village, which is more than likely very poor. More often than not, the hunter is looking for a mature male that is on the decline of his life and does not hurt the overall population at all. It actually keeps the population healthier because only the strongest animals are allowed to reproduce. Despite what activist groups tell us, many of the African animals we all love are actually doing very well because of the efforts of conservationists. Personally, I estimate that I have spent over $5000 in my life time just on licenses and fees. That does not count my donations and volunteer time to different wildlife groups and the thousands that my family and I have spent on conservation efforts on our land. I am not defending this dentist, the way he allegedly killed that lion was unethical and wrong, but without efforts of hunters and fishermen, many of the wild places everybody enjoys would not be there today. We shouldn’t be quick to lump all hunters into the same group, just like we wouldn’t stereotype others for the actions of one individual.”
Then there’s the other perspective. While some in the U.S. are ready to crucify the Minnesota dentist, I recently read a testimony from an African citizen who offers a different view on this subject.
“It’s so cruel, but I don’t understand the whole fuss, there are so many pressing issues in Zimbabwe — we have water shortages, no electricity, and no jobs — yet people are making noise about a lion?” said Eunice Vhunise, a Harare resident, in a recent interview. “I saw Cecil once when I visited the game park. I will probably miss him. But honestly the attention is just too much.”
What’s even more alarming than watching sportsmen get attacked on social media is the growing number of people who value the life of an animal more than the life of a human being. As food producers, it’s our responsibility and our nature to not only care for the livestock we manage, but to also feed and nourish people around the world. As a result, it’s disturbing to hear the public outcry over the death of an aging lion in an African game preserve instead of focusing on the water and food shortages the people in that region are suffering from.
According to the Borgen Project, in the land where Cecil once called home, Africans are facing 80% unemployment and 75% of the world’s poorest countries are located in Africa, including Zimbabwe, Liberia and Ethiopia. What’s more, approximately one in three people living in sub-Saharan Africa are undernourished, and 589 million people in sub-Saharan Africa live without electricity. Poverty in Africa results in over 500 million people suffering from waterborne diseases. More than 1 million people, mostly children under the age of five, die each year of malaria with 90% of the world’s malaria deaths happening in Africa.
Hunting and livestock production are very similar as they both stimulate the economy, contribute to conservation efforts and protect the land and the wildlife the general public gets to enjoy. As Twitter continues to blow up about the loss of a beloved wild animal — not a pet — let’s try to ignite some conversations about real issues — hunger, drought, disease and orphans around the world who need our love and support

[Burning Petard]

Well, BB, there are lots of 'hunting resorts' around North America that are pretty close to your description. It ranges from pheasants, quail, prairie dogs, feral pigs, white-tail deer, wild sheep, Bison, and 'exotic' game imported from other parts of the world and kept fenced in.

Nothing new about this. My church owns a camp ground near New Hope PA, called Deer Park. That's exactly what it started as, a preserve with red deer imported from Europe and available for rich tourist/shooters from England. about 150 years ago.

snailgate

[rubato]

How is hunting morally different from fishing?


yrs,
rubato

[Big RR]

Because it's the fish's fault--if he kept his mouth shut he wouldn't have been caught.

[oldr_n_wsr]