The history of the much feared Hydroxychloroquine.

[Darren]

"Hydroxychloroquine is one of many medications frequently used in rheumatology practice. Its remarkable versatility is attested by its routine use in lupus, in patients with an autoimmune coagulopathy, in patients with rheumatoid arthritis, as well as those with a low-level inflammatory arthropathy. It’s an amazing medication, with a novel history and wide array of indication and multiple actions that we now better understand."

"The HCQ story begins in 1638 when the wife of the Viceroy of Peru, Countess Cinchona, acquired malaria while living in the New World. Rather than getting the “approved” therapy, blood-letting, she was treated by an Incan herbalist with the bark of a tree (eventually, named for the countess-Cinchona Tree). Her response was dramatic; when the Viceroy returned to Spain, he brought with him large supplies of the powder for general use, which at the time was controlled by the Church and was thus called “Jesuit’s Powder”."

http://rheumnow.com/blog/nine-lives-hydroxychloroquine

[Scooter]

We could design a trial to compare it to injection of disinfectant and see which kills more participants.

[BoSoxGal]

There are moments I just want to scream my bloody head off - I can’t believe we have come to a point where this is our accepted reality.

I’m not talking about covid19, I’m talking about Donald J. Trump in the White House.

[BoSoxGal]

More than 90% of critical coronavirus patients treated with hydroxychloroquine developed signs of dangerous heart arrhythmias, two studies reveal

[rubato]

What is feared is stupid people recommending remedies with no evidence of effectiveness and a lot of evidence of harm.

yrs,
rubato

[Darren]

What is feared is stupid people recommending remedies with no evidence of effectiveness and a lot of evidence of harm.

yrs,
rubato

Could it be the real fear is a hydroxychloroquine pill costs about 40 cents? No one will get rich off that. We can't have cheap pharmaceuticals saving lives.

At the VA I occasionally donate a copy of The German Commission E Monologues to MDs, nurses, PAs, and techs that don't have their heads completely up their ass to the point supplements are the work of the devil.

Doc and I had a very interesting discussion with a tech recently. He'll get a copy of the Monologues the next time either of us has an appointment.

[MajGenl.Meade]

At the VA I occasionally donate a copy of The German Commission E Monologues to MDs, nurses, PAs, and techs

I'm sure all their pet parrots are grateful

[Darren]

At the VA I occasionally donate a copy of The German Commission E Monologues to MDs, nurses, PAs, and techs

I'm sure all their pet parrots are grateful

Since you're not interested in German medical science, perhaps you'd instead prefer to delve into the origin of the pharmaceutical industry and who funded that.

For that the Flexner Report is your friend. It's not too late to find an acorn.

[MajGenl.Meade]

[Bicycle Bill]

"The HCQ story begins in 1638 when the wife of the Viceroy of Peru, Countess Cinchona, acquired malaria while living in the New World. Rather than getting the “approved” therapy, blood-letting, she was treated by an Incan herbalist with the bark of a tree (eventually, named for the countess-Cinchona Tree). Her response was dramatic; when the Viceroy returned to Spain, he brought with him large supplies of the powder for general use, which at the time was controlled by the Church and was thus called “Jesuit’s Powder”."

What I hear you saying is that quinine cures malaria — or at least shows some effectiveness against it — so why not try it, or some variant of it, like hydroxycholorquine, against COVID-19?

I think Trump was binge-watching M*A*S*H and saw the episode "The Red/White Blues":

Klinger is excitedly packing for several days of R&R in Tokyo when Colonel Potter comes in and tells Klinger that I-Corps has several outdated reports from the 4077th, because the paper forms changed some time ago and Klinger didn't notice.  Potter cancels Klinger's leave as punishment for not keeping up with the daily reports.

Later, Col. Potter undergoes a routine physical — the last one he'll need to have while on active duty — and the results aren't good.  His blood pressure is way above the norm, and he runs the risk of being pulled from command and stuck behind a desk.  Potter begs Hawkeye to fudge the numbers, but he refuses.  Potter is adamant, and asks Hawkeye for two weeks to get his numbers down before the report has to be sent in to HQ.  Hawkeye agrees, but reminds him he's going to have to cut down on his drinking, his salt, his cigars, and his penchant for getting angry due to the pressures of being in command.  Hawkeye also promises to keep Potter's condition a secret, but almost immediately he spills the news to everyone, who start treating Potter with kid gloves, which of course drives him (Potter) nuts.

Back in his office, Potter flies off the handle when he thinks Klinger ordered the wrong medicine needed to preemptively deal with the malaria problem —- they're stuck with primaquine instead of chloroquine.  After blowing his stack, Hawkeye finds a letter enclosed that HQ was out of chloroquine, so they sent the other, less effective drug instead.  Primaquine is just a suppressant, not the cure ... plus, it also has negative side effects for blacks (in keeping with the culture and language of the '50s, the word 'negroes' was used).  But it will have to do.  Potter, chastened, apologizes to Klinger.

Later, Hawkeye is back in Klinger's office, and he's shocked to see the mountain of paperwork that covers the office.  He can't understand why Klinger isn't getting the work done, but Klinger insists its not out of laziness, its because he feels so worn out and tired.  Hawkeye isn't hearing any of it, and issues a direct order to Klinger to get all the work done before Potter comes back and sees the mess.

The doctors try to stall Potter in the officers' club, but without having any booze.  When Winchester is challenged over ordering a cognac, he references the temperance movement and Carrie Nation, who was arrested some 30 times between 1900 and 1910 for smashing saloons and their inventory.  They all settle for lemonade.  While the gang occupies the Colonel, Margaret checks up on Klinger.  The office is in even worse shape, and Klinger claims that he feels exhausted, along with severe back pain.  Margaret is furious, and when choppers arrive, she orders him to get up and help out.

While in pre-op, Margaret sees that one of the orderlies, Pvt. Goldman, is resting on a bench.  He complains of feeling tired with a bad back, and Margaret promises to have one of the doctors check him out.  Klinger, seeing this, gets mad, accusing Margaret of believing Goldman but not him, even though they have the same symptoms.  Margaret apologizes and tells him to rest, too.

After the OR session, Hawkeye and B.J. run blood tests and discover that, whatever it is that is affecting Klinger and Goldman, it's the same thing — they just don't know what it is.  B.J. points out that the only potential new factor is the primaquine medicine, suggesting that both men might have been rendered anemic by the drug.  While finishing up Klinger's paperwork, they come up with a plan to take Klinger and Goldman off the pills entirely.  The removal of primaquine has the desired effect, and Klinger returns to his normal self.

A few days later, the colonel gets another examination, and this time Potter passes with a few points to spare.  Overjoyed, he takes a drink and lights a cigar in celebration.  Some time after that, Klinger returns from R & R — having had a miserable time due to several accidents in Tokyo.  Then Goldman shows up from R & R also having had several accidents!  An on-screen text crawl just before the end credits reveal that primaquine was later found to also cause negative reactions, a glucose-6-phosphate dehydrogenase deficiency, in people of Mediterranean heritage (like Klinger and Goldman).

and probably thought, "Primiquine, chloroquine, hydroxychloroquine — what's the big difference?" and immediately started tweeting and running his mouth.

But once the Trumpanzees got wind of it, it was suddenly this fantastic new miracle cure that was for some reason being suppressed ... and from there on, anything the Snake-Oil Salesman in Chief suggested — from letting the disease run its course so the populace can develop 'herd immunity' (too bad about those few thousand, later upgraded to hundreds of thousands, who might die, but hey; they should be willing to give their lives for their children, right?) to exposure to summer heat, bright lights, and injecting or somehow introducing disinfectant into the body — all suddenly became miracle cures and treatments; better even than bathing ones' self in the healing waters of Lourdes.

And need I remind you that malaria — against which quinine IS effective — is caused by single-celled microorganisms (bacteria) of the Plasmodium group, while COVID-19 is caused by a virus?

I suppose that after his off-the-wall suggestion that we use atomic weapons to weaken or alter the course of hurricanes, we should at least be grateful that he didn't suggest setting off a series of neutron bombs to irradiate the virus and kill it that way.

-"BB"-

[rubato]

What is feared is stupid people recommending remedies with no evidence of effectiveness and a lot of evidence of harm.

yrs,
rubato

Could it be the real fear is a hydroxychloroquine pill costs about 40 cents? No one will get rich off that. We can't have cheap pharmaceuticals saving lives.

At the VA I occasionally donate a copy of The German Commission E Monologues to MDs, nurses, PAs, and techs that don't have their heads completely up their ass to the point supplements are the work of the devil.

Doc and I had a very interesting discussion with a tech recently. He'll get a copy of the Monologues the next time either of us has an appointment.

A stupid and ignorant assertion that it is beneficial is not improved if it is cheap. Cyanide is cheap you idiot.

Yrs,
Rubato

[MajGenl.Meade]

Here you go, Darren. Something new for you to promote. "reducing the elimination of symptoms" is a key goal of medicine.

The president of Madagascar Andry Rajoelina officially launched a local herbal remedy believed can prevent and cure patients suffering from COVID-19.

The herbal remedy has been developed by Congolese Doctor, Dr. Jerome Munyagi in partnership with the Malagasy Institute of Applied Research and branded COVID Organics. President Andry Rajaolina presented the remedy to the press on Monday.

COVID Organics contains Artemisia, a plant cultivated on the Big Island to fight against malaria. In other parts of Africa, Artemisia is cultivated in Cameroon, Kenya,Ethiopia, South Africa, Mozambique, Tanzania, Uganda and Zambia – all in high-altitude regions and/or regions with a pronounced cool period.

“All trials and tests have been conducted and its effectiveness in reducing the elimination of symptoms has been proven for the treatment of patients with COVID-19 in Madagascar,” the president said. The herbal remedy, COVID-organics is mandatory for children returning to school. President Rajaolina said Monday that it had cured two COVID-19 cases.

“The Covid-Organics will be distributed free of charge to our most vulnerable compatriots and sold at very low prices to others. All profits will be donated to IMRA to finance scientific research,” the president wrote on Twitter. “I’m convinced that, in fact history will prove us, but today there are already two cases that have been cured with the Covid-organics, but we’ll actually see what happens next.”

“Covid Organics will be used in profilaxis, i.e. preventive, but clinical observations have shown a trend towards its effectiveness in curative, other clinical studies are currently underway,” he stressed at the launch. As of May 1st, Madagascar’s case stats stood at 128 cases of which 92 had recovered with no deaths

https://africa.com/madagascar-launches- ... lDiCvLh9YY

[ex-khobar Andy]

"Hydroxychloroquine is one of many medications frequently used in rheumatology practice. Its remarkable versatility is attested by its routine use in lupus, in patients with an autoimmune coagulopathy, in patients with rheumatoid arthritis, as well as those with a low-level inflammatory arthropathy. It’s an amazing medication, with a novel history and wide array of indication and multiple actions that we now better understand."

"The HCQ story begins in 1638 when the wife of the Viceroy of Peru, Countess Cinchona, acquired malaria while living in the New World. Rather than getting the “approved” therapy, blood-letting, she was treated by an Incan herbalist with the bark of a tree (eventually, named for the countess-Cinchona Tree). Her response was dramatic; when the Viceroy returned to Spain, he brought with him large supplies of the powder for general use, which at the time was controlled by the Church and was thus called “Jesuit’s Powder”."

http://rheumnow.com/blog/nine-lives-hydroxychloroquine

The story of the Countess has long been debunked.. Paywalled, but you can read the intro.

Nevertheless it is Eurocentrism to say that the story of quinine (not, let me point out, hyroxychloroquine) started in 1638 as the Inca had long been using it.

And PS I can personally attest that quinine works for malaria. December 1979 in my case. Quinine hydrochloride IIRC.

[Darren]

The story of the Countess has long been debunked.. Paywalled, but you can read the intro.

Nevertheless it is Eurocentrism to say that the story of quinine (not, let me point out, hyroxychloroquine) started in 1638 as the Inca had long been using it.

And PS I can personally attest that quinine works for malaria. December 1979 in my case. Quinine hydrochloride IIRC.

I don't do politically correct bull shit (PCBS). The article gave credit to the Incas otherwise the countess was screwed (medically) when she got malaria. If you have some history of the Inca's discovery, I'd love to read it.

I'm still trying to figure out the viewpoints here about the German Commission E being bad as compared to allopathic medicine being the end all and be all.

The tree bark would have been described in the German Commission E Monologues if German medical science had gotten to that point. Perhaps an herbal book does exist from that time.

[rubato]

Evidence-based medicine is the end all and be all. Nutbar remedies based on rumors repeated by idiots is useless to harmful.

All you have to do to stop twitching and vomiting up post after post of self-justifying crap is to say "I was wrong." Either that or follow Trump's other recommendation and drink Lysol.

[Darren]

Evidence-based medicine is the end all and be all. Nutbar remedies based on rumors repeated by idiots is useless to harmful.

All you have to do to stop twitching and vomiting up post after post of self-justifying crap is to say "I was wrong." Either that or follow Trump's other recommendation and drink Lysol.

Why is it only those of a blue persuasion think Trump suggested they drink disinfectant? The rest of us are laughing our asses off.

[Joe Guy]

Trump suggested injecting covid patients with disinfectant. Drinking it wouldn’t be much of a stretch to his fans.

[Crackpot]

Yeah he merely suggested we check into the efficacy of doing so as if that wasn’t already well known to anyone who can read a warning label.

[RayThom]

I'm surprised the Big Grifter hasn't been talking this fizz water up. It contains real quinine.

[dales]

Ah, a Schweppe's enema - perfect for [a] Dump.