Is it me, or?

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BoSoxGal
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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by BoSoxGal »

Big RR wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:56 pm
And FWIW, I really don't want Trump's leadership; imagine how much worse things would be if he really understood government and knew how to get things done. He's caused enough trouble, but most of his initiatives have fizzled--imagine what it would be like if they did not.
I’m not sure how you can say this, considering two appointments to SCOTUS (so far) and over 200 - many unqualified - lifelong right wing judiciary appointments, many relatively young whose legacy will be a stain for decades to come.

He’s presided over the largest transfer of wealth in the history of the country, to the profound detriment of the vast majority of the population especially in light of his abject failure handling the pandemic.

He may not have passed much legislation, but he’s singlehandedly all but destroyed one of our major political parties and fomented violence in our streets. And quietly behind all the outrageous headlines, his administration has been eviscerating federal programs that benefit the environment and the people - with his current objective to kill Social Security via emergency payroll tax suspension that is legal, but morally reprehensible. It will take only one calendar year to entirely bankrupt SSDI (disability), and just another 1-2 to entirely bankrupt SS. The pandemic could easily last until 2022, considering historical evidence.

It will not be easy work to repair what 45 has wrought. Our country has been fomented to a lather of hostility and distrust that is really frightening. I frankly don’t know why Biden even wants this job; the fact that he does is all the evidence I need that he’s a true public servant.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan

ex-khobar Andy
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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by ex-khobar Andy »

Per BSG:
It will not be easy work to repair what 45 has wrought. Our country has been fomented to a lather of hostility and distrust that is really frightening. I frankly don’t know why Biden even wants this job; the fact that he does is all the evidence I need that he’s a true public servant.
Yes.

Jarlaxle
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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Jarlaxle »

BoSoxGal wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 4:01 pm
Big RR wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:56 pm
And FWIW, I really don't want Trump's leadership; imagine how much worse things would be if he really understood government and knew how to get things done. He's caused enough trouble, but most of his initiatives have fizzled--imagine what it would be like if they did not.
I’m not sure how you can say this, considering two appointments to SCOTUS (so far) and over 200 - many unqualified - lifelong right wing judiciary appointments, many relatively young whose legacy will be a stain for decades to come.

He’s presided over the largest transfer of wealth in the history of the country, to the profound detriment of the vast majority of the population especially in light of his abject failure handling the pandemic.

He may not have passed much legislation, but he’s singlehandedly all but destroyed one of our major political parties and fomented violence in our streets. And quietly behind all the outrageous headlines, his administration has been eviscerating federal programs that benefit the environment and the people - with his current objective to kill Social Security via emergency payroll tax suspension that is legal, but morally reprehensible. It will take only one calendar year to entirely bankrupt SSDI (disability), and just another 1-2 to entirely bankrupt SS. The pandemic could easily last until 2022, considering historical evidence.

It will not be easy work to repair what 45 has wrought. Our country has been fomented to a lather of hostility and distrust that is really frightening. I frankly don’t know why Biden even wants this job; the fact that he does is all the evidence I need that he’s a true public servant.
You assume he is aware enough to understand what's happening.

Make no mistake: you will not be voting for Joe Biden. You will be voting Kamala Harris for President.

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Sue U »

Jarlaxle wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:40 am
Make no mistake: you will not be voting for Joe Biden. You will be voting Kamala Harris for President.
No, that will be in 2024.
GAH!

Jarlaxle
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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Jarlaxle »

Well...I'm making a difference. I just asked my wife to see if she can reserve a second van (or a large SUV) from Budget for 11/2. With my vacation canceled, I have plenty of time off to use.

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by BoSoxGal »

Election Day is 11/3, just FYI.

Massachusetts will go for Biden/Harris no matter how many Trumpers you folks ferry to the polls - but kudos on your civic engagement.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan

Jarlaxle
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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Jarlaxle »

BoSoxGal wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 3:21 am
Election Day is 11/3, just FYI.

Massachusetts will go for Biden/Harris no matter how many Trumpers you folks ferry to the polls - but kudos on your civic engagement.
I know that...we will pick up the vans the night before, so we can start as soon as polls open. We'll be doing this in New Hampshire, I just emailed the state GOP.

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Big RR »

BoSoxGal wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 4:01 pm
Big RR wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:56 pm
And FWIW, I really don't want Trump's leadership; imagine how much worse things would be if he really understood government and knew how to get things done. He's caused enough trouble, but most of his initiatives have fizzled--imagine what it would be like if they did not.
I’m not sure how you can say this, considering two appointments to SCOTUS (so far) and over 200 - many unqualified - lifelong right wing judiciary appointments, many relatively young whose legacy will be a stain for decades to come.

He’s presided over the largest transfer of wealth in the history of the country, to the profound detriment of the vast majority of the population especially in light of his abject failure handling the pandemic.

He may not have passed much legislation, but he’s singlehandedly all but destroyed one of our major political parties and fomented violence in our streets. And quietly behind all the outrageous headlines, his administration has been eviscerating federal programs that benefit the environment and the people - with his current objective to kill Social Security via emergency payroll tax suspension that is legal, but morally reprehensible. It will take only one calendar year to entirely bankrupt SSDI (disability), and just another 1-2 to entirely bankrupt SS. The pandemic could easily last until 2022, considering historical evidence.

It will not be easy work to repair what 45 has wrought. Our country has been fomented to a lather of hostility and distrust that is really frightening. I frankly don’t know why Biden even wants this job; the fact that he does is all the evidence I need that he’s a true public servant.

Don't get me wrong, I don't endorse his USSC appointments, but at least them seem to have the intellectual chops to be on the Supreme Court, unlike some other appointments in the past few decades. They may well come to deciding cases on the law, not their own political views. And yes, the appointment of lower level judges does concern me, but I think we can deal with it as that part of the judiciary will undoubtedly expand and we can appoint future appellate judges from those who are more than idealogues.

His "transfer of wealth" or tax policy is pretty much SOP for the repubs (and even recent democrats, what president running for reelection hasn't lobbied for a tax cut? OK, Bush Sr, but he lost), and I place it clearly in the shoulders of Congress, which is why we need to focuses on changing Congress to democratic in both houses, whoever wins.

The SSI tax holiday is a concern, but I am not assuming it is legal for a number of reasons that distinguish it fro, his extension of the tax return filing deadline authorized by Congress, and I fully expect it to be enjoined. And he will suffer the backlash of seniors who are terrified of losing a major part of (or the only) the income they receive--and many of these were Trumps supporters. He might think he can do whatever he wants, but this could be a lesson to him and the ocuntry.

As for destroying the republican party singlehandedly, he had a lot of help; indeed, I think Newt and the subsequent tea partiers die much more to bring the GOP down than Trump did; add to that the toadies who won't stand up and call an ass an ass, and we see Trump has done littleto that downfall.

Yes, he has done things behind the scenes to screw with programs, but I sincerely think this is much less than someone who knew what they were doing could have done. Face it, he wants headlines far more than change and refuses to listen to those who know more than him.

Which brings us to your last point--rabble rousing and fomenting division and violence. This is where he excels. The man is another Jerry Springer who lives for just that. Yes, this is disturbing and has caused a lot of damage, which I lay clearly at his feet. But he didn't create this climate, it has been coming for years, and he''s pandering to the people who feel disenfanchised. If it wasn't him, it would be someone else.

I'm not saying he hasn't done damage, he clearly has, but getting someone smarter and more devious in the office could have caused much more damage; hell, if changes was his objective (rather than sowing the seeds of unrest for headlines), even he could have caused more damage. He as left us with a legacy that will require an effort to clean up, but I am happy that ti's not much worse,

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Big RR »

Jarl--good for you; I don't want Trump to win, but I think we all benefit when more people get a chance to vote, and rides to the polling places helps there.

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Sue U »

Big RR wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:52 pm
Which brings us to your last point--rabble rousing and fomenting division and violence. This is where he excels. The man is another Jerry Springer who lives for just that. Yes, this is disturbing and has caused a lot of damage, which I lay clearly at his feet. But he didn't create this climate, it has been coming for years, and he''s pandering to the people who feel disenfanchised. If it wasn't him, it would be someone else.
I disagree. No president in living memory -- or even a major party presidential candidate -- has actively stoked division and violence like Trump. (George Wallace in 1968 is about as close as it gets.) Trump actually attempted to justify the shooting of protestors in Kenosha and the vehicular homicide of a protestor in Charlottesville, has been encouraging white nationalist militias, and has suggested he and his supporters would not abide by election results if he loses. The Boogaloos, Proud Boys, neo-Nazis and rando vigilantes are all taking their cues from him, and people are literally getting killed in a deliberate campaign of stochastic terrorism.



ETA: In thinking about it, Trump's campaign both in 2016 and 2020 (just one long extended campaign, really) is remarkably similar to Wallace's 1968 campaign in its themes and rhetoric. The difference is that in '68, the GOP had an experienced national mainstream pol in Nixon, and its Southern Strategy to convert white Southerners into Republicans by playing to racial and working-class grievances had only just begun. (Wallace, an erstwhile Democrat, was never going to get the Democratic nomination, but could make enough of a mess to prevent an Electoral College majority and promote himself as king-maker.) Now that the 21st Century GOP has fully internalized Southern suburban racism as well as the KKK, it serves as the willing host of the revived '68 Wallace campaign, this time around personified by Trump. Thanks for coming to my TED talk.
GAH!

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Big RR »

Sue U wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 3:04 pm
Big RR wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:52 pm
Which brings us to your last point--rabble rousing and fomenting division and violence. This is where he excels. The man is another Jerry Springer who lives for just that. Yes, this is disturbing and has caused a lot of damage, which I lay clearly at his feet. But he didn't create this climate, it has been coming for years, and he''s pandering to the people who feel disenfanchised. If it wasn't him, it would be someone else.
I disagree. No president in living memory -- or even a major party presidential candidate -- has actively stoked division and violence like Trump. (George Wallace in 1968 is about as close as it gets.) Trump actually attempted to justify the shooting of protestors in Kenosha and the vehicular homicide of a protestor in Charlottesville, has been encouraging white nationalist militias, and has suggested he and his supporters would not abide by election results if he loses. The Boogaloos, Proud Boys, neo-Nazis and rando vigilantes are all taking their cues from him, and people are literally getting killed in a deliberate campaign of stochastic terrorism.



ETA: In thinking about it, Trump's campaign both in 2016 and 2020 (just one long extended campaign, really) is remarkably similar to Wallace's 1968 campaign in its themes and rhetoric. The difference is that in '68, the GOP had an experienced national mainstream pol in Nixon, and its Southern Strategy to convert white Southerners into Republicans by playing to racial and working-class grievances had only just begun. (Wallace, an erstwhile Democrat, was never going to get the Democratic nomination, but could make enough of a mess to prevent an Electoral College majority and promote himself as king-maker.) Now that the 21st Century GOP has fully internalized Southern suburban racism as well as the KKK, it serves as the willing host of the revived '68 Wallace campaign, this time around personified by Trump. Thanks for coming to my TED talk.

No president, I agree; likewise presidential candidates (and Wallace ia a good catch); but from Newt on we have had many candidates and legislators stoking the seeds of division and eschewing any semblance of compromise--the tea party extended this further to a hatred of those in opposition. Trump just road this wagon onward to getting the recognition he claims.

As for
Trump actually attempted to justify the shooting of protestors in Kenosha and the vehicular homicide of a protestor in Charlottesville, has been encouraging white nationalist militias, and has suggested he and his supporters would not abide by election results if he loses. The Boogaloos, Proud Boys, neo-Nazis and rando vigilantes are all taking their cues from him, and people are literally getting killed in a deliberate campaign of stochastic terrorism.


I disagree. Trump has not tried to justify anything in that I don't think he has any real position on any of those issues; he just wants to be outrageous and be seen in the headlines. He jumps around yelling and stoking but has no real policy or ultimate aim other than his own crass self promotion. Likewise, I don't think any of those groups take their cues from him; they're set in their politics and have their own tactics and goals, but I do think they're enjoying the press and support they're getting from erstwhile republicans who react and cheer Trump's every move. But if they ever got in power, he'd be the first one they shoot.

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Re: Is it me, or?

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So Trump’s not dangerous because the people he’s promoting would kill him and take the reins if they ever got into power as well?

To me that sounds like Trump is very dangerous - he’s opening the door to violent extremism without thought to the consequences even for himself. That’s reckless in the extreme.

Competence is not required for evil to flourish.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Burning Petard »

I really fear the Trump legacy, even if he is a one termer. I suppose it should really be considered as the Mitch legacy. I mean the federal judiciary. Mitch held up the nominations so that Obama get very few vacancies filled. Then since Trump became POTUS, the GOP had an assembly line all prepared, greased and ready to run full speed, with lots of very poorly qualified, according to the National Bar Assn, all in the hopper. The nation will be suffering under this for generations. Remember, it is not just SCOTUS that is a lifetime appointment.

snailgate

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Re: Is it me, or?

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7806009B-EBB2-4EDF-B172-A87B517156AC.jpeg
CD0E7EE9-C66C-4E62-B177-9E9D6183D212.jpeg
This morning I had Irish breakfast with a half teaspoon of Swan’s Tupelo honey - fabulous honey, if you’ve never had it, you must try some!

I love the amber of the brew and the reflection of my window in it.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan

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BoSoxGal
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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by BoSoxGal »

I have no idea why they posted upside down but I’m going to accept it as a metaphor for my life.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by dales »

It's Trump"s fault.

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
rubato

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Gob »

:lol:
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Big RR »

Well if Trump can really cause things to defy gravity, maybe he'll be nominated for a Nobel is physics as well. :D

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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Guinevere »

I’m reading a collection of Angela Davis’ speeches, as well as some interviews with her. I thought this question and her response was relevant here.
Q: You’ve been an activist for decades. What keeps you going? Do you think we should remain optimistic about the future?

A: Well, I don’t think we have any alternative other than remaining optimistic. Optimism is an absolute necessity, even if it’s only optimism of the will, as Gramsci said, and pessimism of the intellect. What has kept me going has been the development of new modes of community. I don’t know whether I would have survived had not movements survived, had not communities of resistance, communities of struggle. So whatever I’m doing I always feel myself directly connected to those communities and I think that this is an era where we have to encourage that sense of community particularly at a time when neoliberalism attempts to force people to think of themselves only in individual terms and not in collective terms. It is in collectivities that we find reservoirs of hope and optimism.

From Freedom Is A Constant Struggle, pub. 2016
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

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Sue U
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Re: Is it me, or?

Post by Sue U »

Guinevere wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 1:56 am
I’m reading a collection of Angela Davis’ speeches, as well as some interviews with her.
Saw her speak when I was in college, she is one of my heros. I swear i will make a Marxist of you yet, m'dear.
GAH!

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