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Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 1:04 pm
by Gob
Our old friend "cultural appropriation" rears its ugly head again....
Michael B Jordan has issued an apology, in the fallout from his announcement over the weekend that he was launching a line of rums called J’Ouvert.
The term signals the start of carnival in the Caribbean and is a cornerstone of tradition in Trinidad and Tobago; Jordan’s use of the word was felt by many to be cultural appropriation.
Critics were particularly angered by the line in Jordan’s trademark filing that claimed the term has “no meaning in a foreign language”. An online petition to stop the trademark had already topped 12,000 signatures and the government of the islands also expressed deep concern over the plan.
Singer Nicki Minaj, who comes from Trinidad, urged Jordan to change the “offensive” name on Tuesday; later that day Jordan posted an apology on Instagram Stories.
“I just wanna say on behalf of myself & my partners, our intention was never to offend or hurt a culture (we love & respect) & hoped to celebrate & shine a positive light on,” he wrote. “Last few days has been a lot of listening. A lot of learning & engaging in countless community conversations ...”
“We hear you. I hear you & want to be clear that we are in the process of renaming. We sincerely apologize & look forward to introducing a brand we can all be proud of.”
The term “J’Ouvert” originates from the French for daybreak; its relationship with the start of carnival in the Caribbean dates back to the 1800s.
At the start of the week, the minister of trade and industry, Paula Gopee-Scoon, told Trinidad and Tobago Newsday the intellectual property implications of the filing were “of extreme concern”.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 1:19 pm
by Big RR
If that's the case, even rum could be seen as a cultural appropriation, since it is integral to Caribbean culture and carnivales, in general. I've been to a couple of them in various islands, and the rum flowed pretty freely; it's the island beverage of choice for celebrations.
In fact, the term apparently translates to "I open" and it is, IMHO a fine fine name for a beverage which may open the celebration it is being served for, opening the joy and festivities.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:23 pm
by Gob
Made in Bolton, UK.
Just please don't tell anyone...
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 4:10 pm
by Sue U
Well, you told me it was Ipswich.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 4:34 pm
by Gob
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 6:24 pm
by Big RR
I have a shirt from New Orleans that says "laissez le bon temps rouler", let the good times roll. I kind of see in in the same way as this. Sure it's probably related to Mardi Gras, but it's a pretty universal, upbeat message, even if it is in French.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 7:33 pm
by Scooter
laissez le bon temps rouler
Whatever else that may be, it most certainly is not French.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 7:52 pm
by Big RR
Perhaps it's Cajun French?
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 8:01 pm
by Scooter
It's word-for-word translation of an English saying that makes absolutely no sense in French. Whenever I see it I say argghhh!
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 8:04 pm
by Crackpot
More fitting for Captain Morgan if you ask me.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 10:08 pm
by MajGenl.Meade
You crack me up, CP
Rum AND pirates!
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 10:49 pm
by Big RR
Scooter wrote: ↑Wed Jun 23, 2021 8:01 pm
It's word-for-word translation of an English saying that makes absolutely no sense in French. Whenever I see it I say argghhh!
Complain all you want, it is a common expression in New Orleans (and likely is in good Cajun French, even i it is not proper in current French). It is not something that was just made up by the tourists; indeed, Cajun French is its own idiom.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:41 am
by Joe Guy
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:57 am
by Joe Guy
And Mr DeepL says:
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:10 am
by Joe Guy
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:23 am
by Scooter
Obviously a word-for-word translation is going to translate exactly, regardless of whether the resulting translation has any meaning.
The phrase is one of the more extreme barbarisms resulting from the influence of English on Louisiana "French".
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:31 am
by Scooter
And my response to hearing someone use it would be something like maudit ciboire d'hostie de Christ en tabarnacle - try putting that through Google translate and see if you get anything meaningful.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:32 am
by ex-khobar Andy
Surely 'les' and "bons" ???
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:46 am
by Joe Guy
Scooter wrote: ↑Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:31 am
And my response to hearing someone use it would be something like
maudit ciboire d'hostie de Christ en tabarnacle - try putting that through Google translate and see if you get anything meaningful.
Re: Rum tale
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:17 am
by Scooter
Precisely. When the actual meaning is much closer to "fuck you and the horse you rode in on".
See how that works?