Plan B Forum

It could have been an accident, but being the naturally suspicious type, I'm going to suspect sabotage until evidence proves otherwise.

My prime suspects? Putin, S H and his sympathizers, Antifa, or perhaps a new incarnation of the Weather Underground.

This was a plant that produced explosives for the military, located in a red state. That alone makes it a potential target.

Antifa’s apparent stance is that conservative Americans have no place in this country. They want to expel them all, drive them out entirely.

Overly ambitious? Absolutely. But I think that’s exactly what they want.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/te ... rcna237021

Sixteen people are believed to have died in a powerful blast at an explosives plant in Tennessee, officials said Saturday, as crews continue to recover remains and carefully clear the site.

Initially there were 18 people said to be unaccounted for after Friday morning's explosion at an Accurate Energetic Systems facility that processes ammunition and explosives.

Two of those people were determined to have not been at the facility, which is located near the city of McEwen, at the time of the explosion, officials said. The error was because their vehicles and personal items were found after the explosion, Humphreys County Sheriff Chris Davis said.

Davis said at a Saturday evening news conference that more than 300 people have been through the site.

"At this time, I can tell you that we have not located any survivors. And we are making the assumption that all are deceased," he said.

The names of those believed dead have not been released.

"As of right now we have contacted all 16, and we’ll call them victims, our loved ones, families that we feel was part of this tragedy," Davis said. "It saddens me. I’m very thankful that we have located the other two."

He said the cause of the blast is still under investigation.

The federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco Firearms and Explosives is on the scene and investigating.

You are such a silly person. There is no such entity as "Antifa". I am antifa - being very much anti-fascism. The greatest generation of Americans (hint: they were adults between 1935 and 1945) were almost all anti-fascist. Lindbergh excepted of course. Why, I'd bet that everyone on this board is anti-fascist. I bet you are.

Since none of us want to drive American conservatives out of America (well . . . ) and I'm a conservative (and anti-fascist, see above), exactly who is it that wants to drive me out? Trump - yes because he is a fascist. And I am anti-fascist. And Miller, RFKjr, that loud-mouth War Minister, etc. - all of Trump's cabinet - all fascists and I'm against them. Being antifa. And conservative.

As to the matter in hand, it's possible some human person with some grudge blew the place up. But it is far more likely that it was an accident - a moment of carelessness - but the chances are, we might never know. It is not unknown for places where highly explosive materials are kept to go kaboom.

And calling out perpetrators based upon nothing more than prejudice and half-ass thinking is what Trump and his pals do. So

MajGenl.Meade wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 12, 2025 3:17 am

You are such a silly person. There is no such entity as "Antifa". I am antifa - being very much anti-fascism. The greatest generation of Americans (hint: they were adults between 1935 and 1945) were almost all anti-fascist. Lindbergh excepted of course. Why, I'd bet that everyone on this board is anti-fascist. I bet you are.

Since none of us want to drive American conservatives out of America (well . . . ) and I'm a conservative (and anti-fascist, see above), exactly who is it that wants to drive me out? Trump - yes because he is a fascist. And I am anti-fascist. And Miller, RFKjr, that loud-mouth War Minister, etc. - all of Trump's cabinet - all fascists and I'm against them. Being antifa. And conservative.

As to the matter in hand, it's possible some human person with some grudge blew the place up. But it is far more likely that it was an accident - a moment of carelessness - but the chances are, we might never know. It is not unknown for places where highly explosive materials are kept to go kaboom.

And calling out perpetrators based upon nothing more than prejudice and half-ass thinking is what Trump and his pals do. So

Check out their flag. One fist is black, representing anarchism, and one fist is red, representing communism. Communists do not tolerate any competing beliefs; this has been proven time and time again throughout the 20th century. They exterminate others in order to (purify the body politics). That means if you Meade, you're considered an infection that must be eliminated if they ever gain power.

You're equating Antifa with Anarchy and Communism, which is ridiculous. First, Communism and Anarchy are polar opposite. Communism (in the form it was implemented) is a form of totalitarian government. Anarchy is the lack of any government. Antifa supports neither.

The only thing Antifa and Anarchists have in common is a lack of central organization. But the 2 concepts are entirely different. There is an issue of people claiming to be Anarchist Antifa, when they are neither (those folks going around inciting riots and causing property damage) but they aren't doing it as a political movement, they are in fact doing it for personal gain. The term "Antifa" has been hijacked by groups of people intent on causing chaos, for the sole purpose of committing crimes under the cover of chaos. Many of them are in fact politically conservative, such as Proud Boys operating under a false flag.

Facism and Communism are in fact quite similar. They clam to be different but in the end, it's the powerful few in charge of everything. The only difference is in Fascism, powerful individuals and corporations loyal to the party control the means of production, whereas in communism the "state" theoretically controls it. In practice it's still party loyalists controlling everything, and those not loyal to the party are either marginalized or eliminated. You claim Communists do not tolerate competing beliefs. True, but neither do Fascists, of which you are one.

The current Republican party is a party of Facists.

You support them because, like most Facists, you want the Government to hurt or better yet, murder the people you don't like.

And then you claim that it's the other side doing it. When in fact it's you.

datsunaholic wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 12, 2025 4:25 am

You're equating Antifa with Anarchy and Communism, which is ridiculous. First, Communism and Anarchy are polar opposite. Communism (in the form it was implemented) is a form of totalitarian government. Anarchy is the lack of any government. Antifa supports neither.

The only thing Antifa and Anarchists have in common is a lack of central organization. But the 2 concepts are entirely different. There is an issue of people claiming to be Anarchist Antifa, when they are neither (those folks going around inciting riots and causing property damage) but they aren't doing it as a political movement, they are in fact doing it for personal gain. The term "Antifa" has been hijacked by groups of people intent on causing chaos, for the sole purpose of committing crimes under the cover of chaos. Many of them are in fact politically conservative, such as Proud Boys operating under a false flag.

Facism and Communism are in fact quite similar. They clam to be different but in the end, it's the powerful few in charge of everything. The only difference is in Fascism, powerful individuals and corporations loyal to the party control the means of production, whereas in communism the "state" theoretically controls it. In practice it's still party loyalists controlling everything, and those not loyal to the party are either marginalized or eliminated. You claim Communists do not tolerate competing beliefs. True, but neither do Fascists, of which you are one.

The current Republican party is a party of Facists.

You support them because, like most Facists, you want the Government to hurt or better yet, murder the people you don't like.

And then you claim that it's the other side doing it. When in fact it's you.

The only thing I can agree with you on is that there’s not much difference between so-called fascist regimes and communist regimes, especially in today’s China. In fact, most modern communist systems seem to have more in common with Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy than they do with the old Soviet Union.

As for me, I’m not a fascist, and I’m certainly not a “MAGA” hardliner. If anything, I’d describe myself as a fellow traveler, not because I fully support everything, but because the problems we’re facing are so serious that I feel we have to put up with Trump. Something has to be done.

Take just two examples: illegal immigration and the national debt.

Uncontrolled illegal immigration will destroy this country. We only have so much room, so many resources, and only so much space in the lifeboat. If we don’t get a handle on it, we risk overwhelming the system.

And then there’s the national debt. We can’t go on like this forever. At some point, we’ll hit a breaking point. Think about it: the only thing backing our money is faith. If it ever comes to the point where the U.S. government can’t make interest payments on the debt, we’ll face a catastrophe, one form or another. If people lose faith in the dollar, there’s no telling how severe the consequences could be.

liberty wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 12, 2025 7:02 pm

the problems we’re facing are so serious that I feel we have to put up with Trump. Something has to be done . . . And then there’s the national debt. We can’t go on like this forever.

I agree that uncontrolled immigration (legal or illegal) is not tenable. Biden and the Dems were too conscious of losing the Hispanic vote and/or just plain soft. By the time Senile Joe was ready to do something about it, it was too little and too late. You can see a steady fall in encounters at the border up until 2020 and then a huge increase into 2023. Numbers declined as 2023 passed but there's no doubt that Trump's aggression has scared off a lot of would-be immigrants - and not just on the southern border.



However, offering your concern about the national debt as a reason to "put up with Trump" shows that either you don't bother to keep up with facts or you do - and then ignore them.

On 4 July 2025, President Donald Trump signed into law the One Big Beautiful Bill Act (OBBBA). It contains tax and budgetary provisions and is projected by the United States Congressional Budget Office (CBO) to add up to $3 trillion to the national debt within the next decade, or $5 trillion including interest if the act’s measures, many of which are time-limited, become permanent

Source: https://www.bruegel.org/analysis/how-mu ... l-bill-act

Democrats are the party of Tax and Spend. Republicans are different they want to spend without taxing

snailgate

MajGenl.Meade wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 12, 2025 7:40 pm

liberty wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 12, 2025 7:02 pm

the problems we’re facing are so serious that I feel we have to put up with Trump. Something has to be done . . . And then there’s the national debt. We can’t go on like this forever.

I agree that uncontrolled immigration (legal or illegal) is not tenable. Biden and the Dems were too conscious of losing the Hispanic vote and/or just plain soft. By the time Senile Joe was ready to do something about it, it was too little and too late. You can see a steady fall in encounters at the border up until 2020 and then a huge increase into 2023. Numbers declined as 2023 passed but there's no doubt that Trump's aggression has scared off a lot of would-be immigrants - and not just on the southern border.



However, offering your concern about the national debt as a reason to "put up with Trump" shows that either you don't bother to keep up with facts or you do - and then ignore them.

On 4 July 2025, President Donald Trump signed into law the One Big Beautiful Bill Act (OBBBA). It contains tax and budgetary provisions and is projected by the United States Congressional Budget Office (CBO) to add up to $3 trillion to the national debt within the next decade, or $5 trillion including interest if the act’s measures, many of which are time-limited, become permanent

Source: https://www.bruegel.org/analysis/how-mu ... l-bill-act

MajGenl.Meade wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 12, 2025 7:40 pm

liberty wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 12, 2025 7:02 pm

the problems we’re facing are so serious that I feel we have to put up with Trump. Something has to be done . . . And then there’s the national debt. We can’t go on like this forever.

I agree that uncontrolled immigration (legal or illegal) is not tenable. Biden and the Dems were too conscious of losing the Hispanic vote and/or just plain soft. By the time Senile Joe was ready to do something about it, it was too little and too late. You can see a steady fall in encounters at the border up until 2020 and then a huge increase into 2023. Numbers declined as 2023 passed but there's no doubt that Trump's aggression has scared off a lot of would-be immigrants - and not just on the southern border.



However, offering your concern about the national debt as a reason to "put up with Trump" shows that either you don't bother to keep up with facts or you do - and then ignore them.

On 4 July 2025, President Donald Trump signed into law the One Big Beautiful Bill Act (OBBBA). It contains tax and budgetary provisions and is projected by the United States Congressional Budget Office (CBO) to add up to $3 trillion to the national debt within the next decade, or $5 trillion including interest if the act’s measures, many of which are time-limited, become permanent

Source: https://www.bruegel.org/analysis/how-mu ... l-bill-act

So, Biden and Trump both Increased the national debt, and it’s likely to keep Increasing again and again. But at least Trump eliminated two departments we didn’t need, and the few essential functions they performed were consolidated into other agencies. Do we really need an agency whose sole purpose is to give away money we don’t have? We have to borrow in order to give it away.

And yes, we’re going to have to raise taxes. It won’t just be the wealthy and will have an impact on economic performance.

But it’ll do no good to raise taxes if Congress is just going to spend the money. It has to go toward paying down the national debt. That might even require a constitutional amendment.

The ability to safeguard that money may need to be placed outside the federal government, perhaps in the hands of the states, because Congress has shown it cannot control itself when it comes to spending. But something has to be done. The interest on the debt is now a trillion dollars a year. How can that be allowed to keep increasing?

For pity's sake, review your damn posts and learn how to delete material - was it really necessary to quote my post twice?

This . . .

So, Biden and Trump both Increased the national debt, and it’s likely to keep Increasing again and again. But at least Trump eliminated two departments we didn’t need, and the few essential functions they performed were consolidated into other agencies. Do we really need an agency whose sole purpose is to give away money we don’t have? We have to borrow in order to give it away.

. . . makes utter nonsense of your first claim that "the problems we’re facing are so serious that I feel we have to put up with Trump". Whatever the Orange Asshat MAY have reduced in direct spending, is offset twice, three, four or more times by his reductions in government income. The one you support is pushing America into debt further than anyone you have ever opposed (or supported). Why do we have to put up with a moronic self-aggrandizing spendthrift and grifter?

Name the agency to which you refer and then provide some facts to go with your bald assertions above.

I ignore the rubbish about states having national fiscal responsibility

Name the agency to which you refer and then provide some facts to go with your bald assertions above.

OOH, OOH, I know, the agency that spends all this money activating national guard units to respond to "emergencies" that don't exist. if that isn't giving away money we don't have, I don't know what is.

And what'd agency is it now that'd is giving Chile a big sack of US taxpayer dollars because that country is having a little cash flow problem?

Why should anybody be surprise by the stuff posted recently in this thread? Before he figured out how to monetized his presidential office, he made most of his money by borrowing it and not paying it back or out right fraud, like Trump Academy.

He has not even been able to write his own book and now can't even remember what the name of the book was, the book with his name on the cover as author.

snailgate

Forgive me for going ignorantly back to the beginning of this thread. WHO is S.H. ? Some sort of left wing Q?

snailgate

Burning Petard wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 13, 2025 6:27 pm

Forgive me for going ignorantly back to the beginning of this thread. WHO is S.H. ? Some sort of left wing Q?

snailgate

Well, the second word is Head. You can take a stab at what S stands for. I presume it's Lib's repulsive insult for a fellow board member. He (lib) should be ashamed but probably is not.

Hey, lib - your hero at work ballooning the deficit:

Historic wave of retirements is putting huge strains on the government
Tens of thousands of federal employees have taken retirement or other voluntary departures on top of the Trump administration’s latest layoffs.

Source: Washington Post

MajGenl.Meade wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 13, 2025 6:49 pm

Burning Petard wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 13, 2025 6:27 pm

Forgive me for going ignorantly back to the beginning of this thread. WHO is S.H. ? Some sort of left wing Q?

snailgate

Well, the second word is Head. You can take a stab at what S stands for. I presume it's Lib's repulsive insult for a fellow board member. He (lib) should be ashamed but probably is not.

I can't help the way things are. Some people are simply repulsive; you know the kind of people who enjoy little acts of cruelty. The world is already cruel enough, no need to make it more so. We are currently involved in a proxy war with Russia, where our weapons are killing Russians and breaking the hearts of Russian mothers and fathers. I don't enjoy it; it's just something that has to be done. Those people who do enjoy it are the kind of people I don't want to deal with or be around. There's nothing you can do to change them. All you can do is identify them and keep your distance. What can I say? The name fits.

liberty wrote: ↑

Tue Oct 14, 2025 12:59 am

Some people are simply repulsive; you know the kind of people who enjoy little acts of cruelty.

Don't put yourself down, lib. Despite the cruelty of the nickname you keep spouting, it's my hope that you will enjoy it less and eventually cease such petty behavior.

MajGenl.Meade wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 13, 2025 2:44 pm

For pity's sake, review your damn posts and learn how to delete material - was it really necessary to quote my post twice?

This . . .

So, Biden and Trump both Increased the national debt, and it’s likely to keep Increasing again and again. But at least Trump eliminated two departments we didn’t need, and the few essential functions they performed were consolidated into other agencies. Do we really need an agency whose sole purpose is to give away money we don’t have? We have to borrow in order to give it away.

. . . makes utter nonsense of your first claim that "the problems we’re facing are so serious that I feel we have to put up with Trump". Whatever the Orange Asshat MAY have reduced in direct spending, is offset twice, three, four or more times by his reductions in government income. The one you support is pushing America into debt further than anyone you have ever opposed (or supported). Why do we have to put up with a moronic self-aggrandizing spendthrift and grifter?

Name the agency to which you refer and then provide some facts to go with your bald assertions above.

I ignore the rubbish about states having national fiscal responsibility

I said it would take a constitutional amendment. It should be clear, even to you, that Congress isn’t going to do it. But somebody’s got to.

MajGenl.Meade wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 13, 2025 2:44 pm

For pity's sake, review your damn posts and learn how to delete material - was it really necessary to quote my post twice?

This . . .

So, Biden and Trump both Increased the national debt, and it’s likely to keep Increasing again and again. But at least Trump eliminated two departments we didn’t need, and the few essential functions they performed were consolidated into other agencies. Do we really need an agency whose sole purpose is to give away money we don’t have? We have to borrow in order to give it away.

. . . makes utter nonsense of your first claim that "the problems we’re facing are so serious that I feel we have to put up with Trump". Whatever the Orange Asshat MAY have reduced in direct spending, is offset twice, three, four or more times by his reductions in government income. The one you support is pushing America into debt further than anyone you have ever opposed (or supported). Why do we have to put up with a moronic self-aggrandizing spendthrift and grifter?

Name the agency to which you refer and then provide some facts to go with your bald assertions above.

I ignore the rubbish about states having national fiscal responsibility

I said it would take a constitutional amendment. It should be clear, even to you, that Congress isn’t going to do it. But somebody’s got to.

The two of you are a great double act! Maybe a trick-cyclist is in your future

Evidently the states don't agree with you any more than rationality does:

An amendment to the U.S. Constitution can be started by either Congress, with a two-thirds vote in both the House and Senate, or by a national convention called for by two-thirds of the states' legislatures.

But you knew that, right? If you didn't, you will claim to have known it long ago and your statement about Congress standing in the way was just another joke. Right? You'll say that's what you meant by "somebody". Right?

You could begin with your state and legislators - start the process. You can report back on how loudly they laughed. Or you can take responsibility for not trying to get a national convention going. Either/or.