Plan B Forum

That cave is lucky his balls didn't hit it, would have taken out the arch.

rubato wrote:I saw the jump on TV. Very impressive but without any beneficial issue in proportion to the risk; i.e. "stupid on a stick". But how does "insane wingsuit jump" defferentiate from all others?


yrs,
rubato

I think you'll have to explain "fun" to him as well O-n-W.

rubato wrote:A human life is a uniquely precious thing. If a life is put at risk the value of the act must be in proportion to the risk otherwise you are valuing life too cheaply; an immoral act.


Some people think sniffing solvents and making home-made bombs is worth the risk too.


yrs,
rubato

oldr_n_wsr wrote:

rubato wrote:A human life is a uniquely precious thing. If a life is put at risk the value of the act must be in proportion to the risk otherwise you are valuing life too cheaply; an immoral act.


Some people think sniffing solvents and making home-made bombs is worth the risk too.


yrs,
rubato

I am guessing you never skydived, nor rode on a tree lined roadway on a motorcycle, nor jumped from the top of a waterfall into the pool below, nor swung on a rope tied to a branch over a lake and let go only to splash down in the water, nor climbed a tree as a kid pulling up wood and nails to make a tree fort as high as you could.
What a dull life you must have. IMHO
Some things are done just for the thrill of them, not for any value impact other than the adrenalin rush. We do them to feel good, to feel alive.
I have found I never feel more alive than when I go close to the edge and make it back.
But that's just me.

Gob wrote:Not just you mate, most thinking people will have realised the value of risk, and relished in the challenge.

rubato wrote: I have done all kinds of things, some stupid that I'd never try again, and some which definitely were worth it.

rubato wrote: The risk taken here is off the charts of all of those. Try thinking it through.

Gob wrote:

rubato wrote: I have done all kinds of things, some stupid that I'd never try again, and some which definitely were worth it.

Hell he once had his gin without ice or lemon in, living on the edge or what!

rubato wrote: The risk taken here is off the charts of all of those. Try thinking it through.

The skill used were well practiced, the jump had several rehearsals, and had multiple risk factors taken into account before executing. Your point is utter rubbish. (as per norm.)

rubato wrote: And that's how you would feel if Hatch tried it? Or Hen? What if it failed? You'd still be ok with that? Because that is the acid test. Not "did you get lucky this time" but if it failed you'd still think it was worth it. Was the achievement worth the end of a human life?

In this case I'd disagree. Nothing valuable was learned or achieved. Just some minor personal glory for the idiot who did it.

Grizzly Man
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For the 1996 documentary film about Troy Hurtubise and his armored suit, see Project Grizzly.

Background

Timothy Treadwell spent 13 summers in Katmai National Park and Preserve, Alaska. Over time, he believed the bears trusted him and would allow him to approach them; sometimes he would even touch them. Treadwell was repeatedly warned by park officials that his interaction with the bears was unsafe to both him and to the bears. "At best, he's misguided," Deb Liggett, superintendent at Katmai and Lake Clark national parks, told the Anchorage Daily News in 2001. "At worst, he's dangerous. If Timothy models unsafe behavior, that ultimately puts bears and other visitors at risk." Treadwell filmed his exploits, and used the films to raise public awareness of the problems faced by bears in North America. In 2003, at the end of his 13th visit, he and his girlfriend Amie Huguenard were attacked, killed, and partially eaten by a bear; the events which led to the attack are unknown, however Kevin Sander's details reasonable theories on his website.[1]

In order for this film to be produced, it was necessary for Jewel Palovak, co-founder of Grizzly People and close friend of Treadwell’s, to approve the production of the documentary. Logistical as well as sentimental factors needed to be taken into account regarding the footage. Grizzly People is a “grassroots organization,” concerned with the treatment of bears, that Palovak and Treadwell started together. After his death, Palovak was left with control of Grizzly People and all 100 hours of archival footage. As Treadwell's close friend, ex-girlfriend and confidante, she also had a large emotional stake in the production. Palovak had known Treadwell since 1985 and felt a deep sense of responsibility to her late friend and his legacy. He had often discussed the subject of his video archives with her. "Timothy was very dramatic," she once said. She quoted Treadwell as saying, "'If I die, if something happens to me, make that movie. You make it. You show ’em.' I thought that Werner Herzog could definitely do that."[2][3]
Synopsis

For Grizzly Man, Herzog used sequences extracted from more than 100 hours of video footage shot by Treadwell during the last five years of his life, and conducted interviews with Treadwell's family and friends, as well as bear and nature experts. Park rangers and bear experts give counterpoints to statements and actions by Treadwell, such as his repeated claims that he is defending the bears from poachers. Park rangers point out that while the bears may be subject to habitat loss and climate change, etc. there was never a recorded incident of poaching at this national park. Treadwell had also convinced himself that he had gained the trust of certain bears, enough to walk up and pet them like dogs. Park rangers again point out that bears are still wild and potentially dangerous animals, and that it was amazing that Treadwell survived as many years as he did without being mauled. One park ranger is so astonished by Treadwell's actions that he thinks the bears themselves were so confused by Treadwell's direct casual contact that they weren't quite sure how to react at first. Moreover, other park rangers point out that not only were the bears not under threat from any poachers, but Treadwell himself almost assuredly put the bears in danger: by familiarizing them with human contact, he increased the likelihood that they would approach human habitation looking for food, possibly resulting in a confrontation in which animal control would have to kill them. Ironically, if there were potential poachers, Treadwell's contact with the bears would have removed their fear of human contact, meaning they would not flee the hunters.

Herzog also narrates, and offers his own interpretations of the events. In his narration, he depicts Treadwell as a disturbed man who may have had a death wish toward the end of his life, but does not condemn him for this.

The film refers to an audio recording of the fatal attack captured by Treadwell's video camera, and although Herzog is shown listening to it on earphones clearly disturbed, it is not played in the film. In fact, Herzog advises Palovak (the owner of the tape) to destroy it immediately rather than listen to it. He later repudiated his own advice, saying it was “Stupid...silly advice born out of the immediate shock of hearing—I mean, it’s the most terrifying thing I’ve ever heard in my life. Being shocked like that, I told her, ‘You should never listen to it, and you should rather destroy it. It should not be sitting on your shelf in your living room all the time.’ [But] she slept over it and decided to do something much wiser. She did not destroy it but separated herself from the tape, and she put it in a bank vault.” [4]

Palovak later receives Treadwell's wristwatch from the coroner, who found it on Treadwell's arm, one of the few remaining pieces of his body. This same watch was spoken of earlier in the film by Willy Fulton, the pilot who discovered the bodies of Treadwell and his girlfriend. During the movie, he recalls seeing the lone arm with the wristwatch and not being able to keep the image out of his mind.
Exhibition

Grizzly Man premiered at the 2005 Sundance Film Festival and its limited US theater release began on August 12, 2005.[5] It was later released on DVD in the United States on December 26, 2005. [6] The Discovery Channel aired Grizzly Man on television on February 3, 2006; its three-hour presentation of the film included a 30-minute companion special that delved deeper into Treadwell's relationship with the bears and addressed controversies surrounding the film. The DVD release of the film is missing an interview with Treadwell by David Letterman that was shown in the original theatrical release, where Letterman jokes that Treadwell will eventually be eaten by a bear. However, the versions televised on the Discovery Channel and Animal Planet both retain this scene.
Critical reception

Upon its North American theatrical release, Grizzly Man received almost universal acclaim amongst critics. As of March 3, 2012 the film has a score of 93% on Rotten Tomatoes.[7]

David Denby of The New Yorker said:

"Narrating in his extraordinary German-accented English, Herzog is fair-minded and properly respectful of Treadwell’s manic self-invention. He even praises Treadwell as a good filmmaker: as Treadwell stands talking in the foreground of the frame, the bears play behind him or scoop up salmon in sparkling water; in other shots, a couple of foxes leap across the grass in the middle of a Treadwell monologue. The footage is full of stunning incidental beauties."[8]

Prolific web reviewer James Berardinelli called the film one of the ten best of 2005, and wrote:

"Grizzly Man addresses some esoteric themes. Is there a line between man and nature? Did Treadwell see himself as more bear than man? Were the liberties he took by initiating such close contact with the bears 'disrespectful' (as one Native American puts it) to the natural boundaries between a predator and its potential prey? Certainly, Treadwell found a clarity in the wilderness with his beloved bears that he could not achieve in human society. And he died the way he wanted to (or, as one person states, 'he got what he deserved'); unfortunately, he took someone else with him. Grizzly Man is compelling material from start to finish."[9]

Film critic Roger Ebert, a longtime supporter of Werner Herzog's work, awarded the film four stars.

"'I will protect these bears with my last breath', Treadwell says. After he and Amie become the first and only people to be killed by bears in the park, the bear that is guilty is shot dead. Treadwell's watch, still ticking, is found on his severed arm. I have a certain admiration for his courage, recklessness, idealism, whatever you want to call it, but here is a man who managed to get himself and his girlfriend eaten, and you know what? He deserves Werner Herzog."[10]

Web reviewer Ross Miller called the film,

"an engaging, honest, and powerful example of documentary cinema that doesn’t speak for the footage but rather allows the footage to speak for itself."

[citation needed]

Grizzly Man was placed at 94 on Slant Magazine's best films of the 2000s.[11]

rubato wrote:So if Hatch did it and died you'd be ok with that? You would say that was worth a life?

yrs,
rubato