Plan B Forum

-"BB"-

Kind of odd since two of the three sadly took their own lives and the other lost his to recklessness. As for the three sisters, I wish them no ill, just anonymity.

Ledger was an accidental overdose, not a suicide.

That, I believe, was the official cause listed on the death certificate, but I think most coroner's will rule a death accidental unless there is clear proof that it was intentional suicide. I a case I am currently on working on, my client's mother overdosed and the cause was ruled "accidental", although given the sheer magnitude of the number of drugs in her system, it's pretty hard to contemplate how this was not intentional. But it appears to be the default ruling absent compelling evidence to the contrary (and that's fine, given how it can influence insurance payments, etc).

I don't know the entire story on Heath Ledger, but I have heard accounts of his depression and how it could have been intentional; I guess no one will know for certain.

His cause of death was acute drug intoxication from mixing low doses of several different medications.

Statement from his family:

In a statement released through Ledger's publicist, Ledger's father, Kim, said Wednesday: "While no medications were taken in excess, we learned today the combination of doctor-prescribed drugs proved lethal for our boy. Heath's accidental death serves as a caution to the hidden dangers of combining prescription medication, even at low dosage."

This is actually a not uncommon cause of overdose death in today's pill-pushing medical environment.

As I said, I do not know the details, nor have I seen the quantities taken (I'm not sure if this was ever made public).

However, as for the "pill pushing medical environment", most of the time I think it is th eother way around--people go to the doctor to get the pills they want, and many will prescribe them when requested. I have a couple of friends who are family practitioners, and they say people coming in and demanding opiates, tranquilizers, etc. is pretty common. I think it is more the fault of the demanders than the suppliers.

More the fault of "ask your doctor" medical ads.

More the fault of the demanders than the suppliers? When the suppliers have medical degrees and ethical obligations stemming from the Hippocratic oath?

I find that a disturbing conclusion. The medical profession should be front and center in the war on prescription drug abuse. There have been numerous cases of pill-pushing, drug-dealing doctors. Far too many doctors from GPs to surgeons are guilty of overprescribing. I believe the medical community acknowledges some fault in where we are at as a nation. I certainly don't hold them blameless or attribute more guilt to lay people with physical pain or other issues seeking responsible care from licensed physicians.

And whent he MD's suddenly say no, then the guy on the corner comes in to play.

BoSoxGal wrote:More the fault of the demanders than the suppliers? When the suppliers have medical degrees and ethical obligations stemming from the Hippocratic oath?

The birth control pill; the morning-after pill; the little yellow pill ('Mother's little helper'); the little blue "quicker-dicker-upper" pill; pills to control sniffles and sneezes and all kinds of wheezes; pills to make you shit; pills to keep you from shitting (or pissing or puking); pills for your dog; pills for your cat; and all kinds of (non-medical) 'supplements'¹ so that you won't get fat.....

Yeah; it's the demanders, all right.  And if there's a sufficient demand, even if it's for something that is no better than sugar pills or snake oil, someone will create a supply.
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¹ — You know, the ones with the disclaimers that read something like "This information has not been evaluated or approved by the FDA and is not necessarily based on scientific evidence from any source. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA). These products are intended to support general well being and are not intended to treat, diagnose, mitigate, prevent, or cure any condition or disease. If conditions persist, please seek advice from your medical doctor."

-"BB"-

¹ — You know, the ones with the disclaimers that read something like "

I call Fake.
The font you used was a too large to be representative of any actual disclaimers.

Back in '93 my substance addled, wife and child abusing, chronically unemployed, brother mercifully ventured onto the train tracks as the Paoli local barrelled down upon him. There he was... and over there... and over there... (To this day I still feel sorry for the poor train engineer who had no choice. She had to take medical leave due to PTSD.)

Whereas I am sure it was a suicide the coroner ruled "A/S" and that's what the death certificate indicates. An accident my ass. I wish the coroner would have been more decisive.

Because a ruling of suicide carries with it a social stigma and can affect things such as life insurance payouts, my understanding is many coroners avoid using it as the cause of death unless it is almost a certainty (hence all those who die while cleaning their guns, e.g.).

The makers of OxyContin in the US, Purdue Pharma, settled criminal and civil charges from the DOJ by paying $600 million in a settlement in the early 2000s. They're currently being sued in a class action and by the city of Everett, Washington for the same reasons - that they PUSHED the use of the drug within the medical community while being entirely dishonest about the addictive potential, which was many times more serious than what they claimed in their literature and in promoting the drug through Pharma reps. They specifically PUSHED this highly addictive, destructive drug as safe to use for even mild pain, and long-term - directly contradicting the way opiate based drugs had been handled in the medical world for decades prior.

Despite the successful lawsuit by the DOJ, it took several more years for the medical community to acknowledge the dangers of prescribing and many physicians still are. Numerous physicians have been disciplined or lost their medical licenses for overprescribing or even being involved in essentially trafficking these opiate drugs. Last year the first American physician was criminally prosecuted for killing patients by overprescribing opiates.

But yes, the poor Pharma folks and doctors are innocent bystanders. It's all the fault of the loser addicts.