Horror vs Thriller/Suspense movies

[Big RR]

The debate about Diehard and Christmas movies brought up a pet peeve of mine, labeling suspense movies as horror movies. Any lists of the best horror movies of all time include movies like Psycho and Silence of the Lambs. Both are excellent movies IMHO, but I don't see them as horror; for me, a horror movie must have a supernatural component, or a science fiction tie in (including some movies set in the future). So ghost movies, alien invasions, mad scientist creating a monster, etc. are properly termed horror, while crazy maniac killer movies are suspense or thriller movies. Sure, they can have horror elements and many of the film techniques are similar, but I see them as distinct genres.

Of course this can lead to some close calls--is Halloween a horror movie (I think so because of the apparent superhuman powers of Michael Meyers--how many times can a real person be shot and survive?), What about A Clockwork Orange (I think so, mainly because of the science fiction tie ins). For me, the biggest problems are those ghost stories that eventually prove to be someone purposely scamming people (like House on Haunted Hill) or the product of a diseased/drugged mind; personally, I would look closely at how much of the film is devoted to the "supernatural", but minds may differ.

So I open the question; do you see distinctions between the genres?

[BoSoxGal]

I think you just have to admit that you have a singular, personal definition of what makes a horror film which is not shared by most - in particular the notion that horror must include some element of science fiction or supernatural.

The Descent was one of the best horror movies I ever saw, without any science fiction (everything in the film is biologically possible) or supernatural.
https://youtu.be/CSYg7Z1KS_I?si=bqagGG-fiOFFriiu

Another very good horror film is Sleeping with the Enemy, consisting of manifestations of fears hundreds of millions of women live with daily - nothing scifi, nothing supernatural. https://youtu.be/FcQqsrf2gik?si=IZ6y-0L-BvV9QRP9

Yes, genres overlap. Some would call SWTE a drama, thriller, suspense - but horror also fits. I don't know how anyone could say The Descent is not a horror film.

Fight me.

[Bicycle Bill]

Yes, genres overlap. Some would call SWTE a drama, thriller, suspense - but horror also fits. I don't know how anyone could say The Descent is not a horror film.

Fight me.

So that when someone refuses to come around to your point of view or starts to get the best of you, you can then scream, "well then, fuck off!" and mute them?
Thank you, but no.

-"BB"-

[MajGenl.Meade]

Since watching "Yentl", I'm prepared to apply the horror label to anything I think is horrible. "Like Water for Chocolate", "The Unbearable Lightness of Being", "There's Something About Mary" . . . horrors, every one

[Big RR]

I think you just have to admit that you have a singular, personal definition of what makes a horror film which is not shared by most - in particular the notion that horror must include some element of science fiction or supernatural.

Well, I will admit that my definition is not shared by many; I'm not sure what most people think about it (or even if they do).

FWIW, I think the reason for genres is letting people know what to expect--the whole point of having different categories is to aid in this. I see no problem in not calling some movies, even excellent movies, thrillers or suspense films rather than horror; it's not demeaning the film in any way or saying that it is not scary or haunting, it's just letting the viewer know what to expect. If I call a film like Nightmare on Elm Street a horror film people would likely expect something very different than if I call it a suspense film--at least I think they would. And some might chose to see a thriller named that rather than a horror film, or vice versa.

The reason I raised this is to understand how others who disagree with my definition distinguish among the genres (or maybe they don't think the distinction is necessary).

Re the films you mentioned, I haven't seen The Descent, but I did see Sleeping with the Enemy and disagree with you, Even thought it deals with fears and might have moments that could be called real horror, calling it a Thriller/Suspense film doesn't change that. It merely tells the viewer what to expect.

Again, I am more than willing to entertain the definitions others use to distinguish the genres, but I cannot understand why someone might be offended or find it demeaning that a particular film falls within one or the other. I think my proposed distinction makes sense, but please propose a different one if you have one.

As for overlap, sure all genres overlap, but we need to look at the main theme. So e.g., King Kong might be classed as horror (if you buy he is supernaturally big), while Beathy and the Beast could be a romance (despite the witchcraft that created the beast). I can think of a number of movies that are truly horrifying (like The Last House On the Left or Psycho) that I would not class as horror, and others less horrifying (like It Follows) that I would.

[MajGenl.Meade]

Speaking of singular, personal definitions:

Sleeping with the Enemy is a 1991 American psychological thriller film

Sleeping with the Enemy
R
1991 ‧ Thriller/Drama ‧ 1h 39m

Drama·Suspense·Eerie·Intense

Sleeping with the Enemy is a thriller made in 1991

Sleeping with the Enemy ... In this romantic thriller,