What a load of crap

[liberty]

My steppe ancestors were no more murderous than any other people. They did the same thing all peoples of that time did, they were just more effective. When to two groups came into conflict one group, most of the time, defeated the other group and when they did they would kill the surviving men and take the women. They would then use the women to make more warriors thereby making their people more powerful.

In my opinion, the Yamnaya had an advantage that others did not have. They had for a long time suffered from the plague and had developed a limited immunity. When they moved among other peoples they spread the disease making their enemies easier to defeat. They were no better or worse than any other people.



https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg ... cient-dna/

Story of most murderous people of all time revealed in ancient DNA
Starting 5000 years ago, the Yamnaya embarked on a violent conquest of Europe. Now genetic analysis tells their tale for the first time
323
Humans 27 March 2019

Simon Pemberton
By Colin Barras
THE iconic sarsen stones at Stonehenge were erected some 4500 years ago. Although the monument’s original purpose is still disputed, we now know that within a few centuries it became a memorial to a vanished people. By then, almost every Briton, from the south coast of England to the north-east tip of Scotland, had been wiped out by incomers. It isn’t clear exactly why they disappeared so rapidly. But a picture of the people who replaced them is emerging.
The migrants’ ultimate source was a group of livestock herders called the Yamnaya who occupied the Eurasian steppe north of the Black Sea and the Caucasus mountains. Britain wasn’t their only destination. Between 5000 and 4000 years ago, the Yamnaya and their descendants colonised swathes of Europe, leaving a genetic legacy that persists to this day. Their arrival coincided with profound social and cultural changes. Burial practices shifted dramatically, a warrior class appeared, and there seems to have been a sharp upsurge in lethal violence. “I’ve become increasingly convinced there must have been a kind of genocide,” says Kristian Kristiansen at the University of Gothenburg, Sweden. As he and others piece together the story, one question resounds: were the Yamnaya the most murderous people in history?

Before about 5000 years ago, Neolithic Europe was inhabited by people much like those who raised Stonehenge. They were farmers with an urge to work together and build large stone structures. “It looks like these people were quite communal,” says Kristiansen.

[MajGenl.Meade]

(Yeah. I know)

[liberty]

In the beginning we were not much different than the animals around us. Considered the African lion and I don’t think that the Eurasian lion was much different. When the dominate male lion grows old and can no longer defend his pride he is attacked by an invading male lion and is either killed or driven out. After the old lion is vanished the new pride lion kills the cubs of the old lion and impregnate the old lion’s mates to produce his own off-spring. Is that all that much different from what the Yamnaya did? The people of the past were different they acted in a more natural way than people of today.

The people of this country today have moved so far from the natural way that I don’t think we could defend ourselves from a dominate people like the Russians.

[Burning Petard]

Interesting that Liberty chooses to compare particular human behavior with particular cats, not primates.

snailgate.

[BoSoxGal]

Actually, liberty, when lions get old or otherwise less desirable, it’s often the pride of lionesses who kill them. Then they invite a new lion into the pride to service them.

[liberty]

Interesting that Liberty chooses to compare particular human behavior with particular cats, not primates.

snailgate.

I know more about feline and canines than I do primates. And besides, wolves and lions make a better analogy for humans than chimps. For the most part the great apes are too passive to be compared to humans. Well, maybe they could be compared to liberals.

[liberty]

Actually, liberty, when lions get old or otherwise less desirable, it’s often the pride of lionesses who kill them. Then they invite a new lion into the pride to service them.

That doesn’t match what I remember. I will have research that and get back with you.

[RayThom]

... That doesn’t match what I remember. I will have research that and get back with you.

lib, nothing known by anyone who possesses half a brain cell matches what you remember.

[liberty]

... That doesn’t match what I remember. I will have research that and get back with you.

lib, nothing known by anyone who possesses half a brain cell matches what you remember.

Don’t be too sure. “The enemy of victory is over confidence”.

[BoSoxGal]

It isn’t always what happens, but it does happen. Also often lionesses band together to fight off invading lions who attempt to kill their cubs.

Women aren’t totally helpless, whether four or two-footed.

[MajGenl.Meade]

Don’t be too sure. “The enemy of victory is over confidence”.

I suppose that might be similar in meaning to Churchill's famous declaration about the Heinkel He 111: "The enemy of . . . ah. . . victory is . . . ah . . . over London".

Or "overconfidence". Or "The enemy of victory is over, Confidence".

The lion sleeps to night!

[liberty]

It isn’t always what happens, but it does happen. Also often lionesses band together to fight off invading lions who attempt to kill their cubs.

Women aren’t totally helpless, whether four or two-footed.

It appears that we are both right. Lionesses do kill male lions but it is not a common happening. However, at US zoo recently a lioness killed the father of her cubs a young healthy lion. The killing puzzled lion experts, but I think she lost respect for him when he acted submissive towards her and that is the reason she killed him:

Why did this lioness kill the father of her cubs?
By Ritu Prasad BBC News
23 October 2018

A lioness at a US zoo has killed the father of her three cubs in their pen - an incident experts say is shocking and unprecedented.
The pair had lived in the same enclosure at Indianapolis Zoo for eight years.
According to the zoo, there had never been any unusual aggression between the pair before the attack last week.

The BBC asked lion researchers for their theories on what could have sparked the attack.
What happened?

Zuri, 12, attacked Nyack, 10, and staff could not separate the pair. Nyack died of suffocation, while Zuri was uninjured.

The zoo said it is conducting a "thorough review".
A personality clash?

Prof Craig Packer, director of the University of Minnesota's Lion Research Center, told the BBC this sort of attack is "unprecedented".

"We've seen examples of males killing females, and groups of females chasing away males, but a single female killing a male? Never heard of it."

He suspects the individual lions' personalities played a role in the killing.
Image copyright Reuters Image caption The zoo called 10-year-old Nyack a "magnificent" lion
In the wild, male lions "totally dominate" lionesses. Nyack had been hand-reared, which possibly made him more vulnerable, Prof Packer said. In contrast, Zuri was more dominant than a typical female.
Zuri was only 25lbs (11kg) lighter than her male counterpart, weighing 325lbs. Male lions typically weigh 330lbs-573lbs and females 265-397lbs, according to San Diego Zoo.

"If it was a result of discordant personalities, maybe that's a risk factor that should be considered in other captive situations," he said.

He said extra mystery came from the fact that Zuri attacked Nyack twice: the first time he ran off and returned behaving very submissively, only for her to attack him again.
"Until we see a number of cases, there's no way we can say what caused this to happen," he said.

How unusual is this behaviour for lions?
Paul Funston, Southern Africa Regional Director for Panthera, a global wild cat conservation organisation, also agreed that this incident is surprising.
In the wild, groups of lionesses do attack lions, typically in defence of their cubs or territory, and such incidents have been filmed at safari parks. However Mr Funston said he has never seen an instance that has ended in a death.

Media captionMoment lionesses attack lion at West Midland Safari Park
Wild male lions will also typically chase off any male cubs when they grow up to ensure they are alone with the pride lionesses. Sometimes the lions will kill cubs - usually when they take over new territory from another pride - to stake their claim on the females.
Male lions have also been known to get aggressive with females and can kill lionesses who refuse to mate.

One possibility, Mr Funston said, is that Zuri - who is described by the zoo as "an attentive and protective mother" - became fearful of Nyack, which led to the fight.
Zuri's natural instincts could have taken over at that point, he explained, and so she ended up killing him.

"Even if animals are calm or seem to be calm, it doesn't mean that there aren't underlying tensions," Mr Funston said.

Image copyright Courtesy Bruce Patterson, Field Museum Image caption Lionesses have been known to attack male lions who upset them .

Bruce Patterson, a researcher at the Field Museum in Chicago, said he knows cases of wild lionesses that have attacked - and injured - male lions who upset them. "[But] unlike the zoo case, no one went for the throat!" he said

Mr Funston, who has studied lions for 25 years, acknowledges this is "an unusual" and "rare" incident - but that does not mean it is is necessarily strange.
"We see a typical model and we tend to think we know it all. But this is a highly socially complex species."

"That's one thing I love about lions," Mr Funston added. "You don't quite know exactly what's going to happen in a particular scenario, and that makes them really interesting animals to observe and want to protect and conserve."

[Burning Petard]

"We see a typical model and we tend to think we know it all. But this is a highly socially complex species."

Surely Homo sapiens is at least as complex. If only Mr. Liberty would take this into account

snailgate

[RayThom]

The male couldn't hide his lion eyes... obviously.

[Lord Jim]

You should have more pride than to stoop to a joke like that Ray...

[Joe Guy]

Keep focused. The hair on the back of a lion's head is the mane thing.

[Long Run]

The male couldn't hide his lion eyes... obviously.

Well, it's not like he is a cheetah.

[ex-khobar Andy]

The male couldn't hide his lion eyes... obviously.

If you're going to make a statement like that, Ray, you have to back it up. Please provide some lynx.

[Scooter]

Anyone actually believe that the village idiot paid for a subscription to New Scientist that would have allowed him to read the article his is denouncing as "crap"?

[liberty]

“SFB” what a fool or liar