MDMA for PTSD

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Rick
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MDMA for PTSD

Post by Rick »

This is actually not a very new story so some may have heard of it before.

However I thought it had a new twist.

Miles was the reason I post it...

http://www.military.com/news/article/st ... html?wh=wh
July 16, 2010
Military.com|by Bryant Jordan
The drug Ecstasy shows positive results in the majority of patients when used to treat post-traumatic stress disorder, according to a report coming out Monday in the Journal of Psychopharmacology.

The study, which focuses on 20 patients for whom previous drug and psychotherapy treatments were unsuccessful, is the first of its kind and a stepping stone for a follow-up that will focus entirely on U.S. military veterans, said Rick Doblin, who founded the Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies – a group that analyzes the use of psychedelic drugs in mental health treatment.

“We want most of the veterans [in the next study] to come from Iraq and Afghanistan,” Doblin told Military.com in an exclusive interview July 15. “But we want some Vietnam veterans as well because we want to see if we can help people who have had these [PTSD] patterns for decades.”

The current study group was mostly female victims of child sexual abuse and rape who suffered from PTSD for an average of about 19 years, said Dr. Michael Mithoefer, a South Carolina psychiatrist who oversaw the testing.

When the association got initial approval for its study from the Food and Drug Administration in 2001, the U.S. was not engaged in Afghanistan and Iraq, so the application specifically asked to test victims of crime. The same application went to the Drug Enforcement Agency, which only approved it in 2004.

The study was completed in late 2008 and Military.com first reported on the positive findings in March 2009. The study’s publication in the British Journal of Psychopharmacology marks the end of nearly 10 years of paperwork and bureaucratic delays, as well as the research itself. The study will be available for free download starting Monday at http://jop.sagepub.com/pap.dtl.

In the study, 12 of the 20 registered patients were treated with a combination of MDMA and psychotherapy; the other eight were given a placebo and psychotherapy.

According to Mithoefer, 10 of the patients in the MDMA trial group saw clinically and statistically significant improvements in their PTSD, compared to just two of the eight people in the control group.

Those in the trial group who responded well to the MDMA treatments “no longer met the diagnostic criteria for PTSD,” according to Mithoefer. This included three patients who reported prior to the treatments that they were unable to work. But after the treatments, they returned to the job.

The study also found no evidence patents who took the Ecstasy experienced any ill effects from the drug, Mithoefer said.

While the current study focused on women who were not exposed to combat, Mithoefer said the largest symptom groups [of PTSD] are the same regardless of the cause.

“But you can have differences,” he said.

“As far as we know, the present research suggests the same basic approach works for people with any kind of PTSD, but there are some obvious important differences,” he explained. “It is always individualized, so working with veterans is going to have some different qualities than, say, working with people with childhood sexual abuse. … The veterans experience does have some particular aspects to it that are different from other trauma and that has to be taken into account.”

Doblin established the Psychedelic Studies Association in the mid-1980s, just as MDMA was being criminalized in the United States and the pressure was on nationally and internationally to halt research into the use of psychedelics for medical purposes. Once possession or use of MDMA became a criminal violation, Doblin realized the only way to work with it would be to go through the FDA.

Although the DEA remains a tough sell in terms of supporting the use of an illegal drug as part of a therapy regimen, Doblin has the approvals from the FDA and has the follow-on project approved by an independent institutional review board – a requirement when doing a human research study.

Meanwhile, MAPS already has been getting queries from veterans interested in taking part.

For Doblin, working to help combat veterans brings him along an unorthodox path back to how he got involved in studying psychedelics for medical and mental health uses.

Coming of age in the 1960s, he was not a pacifist but he opposed the Vietnam War and said he was prepared to go to jail rather than serve in it or flee to Canada. At 18, he didn’t even bother to register and kept waiting to be arrested; the reality was, he said, that tens of thousands of men didn’t bother to register and the government never came after them.

He began to wonder how he could contribute to creating an alternative to war, he said, and began studying about how people were motivated to fight and how others were used – “scapegoated” – to legitimatize war.

“When I first tried LSD, it was very powerful,” he recalled. It gave him a sense of the connectedness of everything, he said, and he came to believe that “if people understood how connected they are, that they’re part of the human family, and that goes deeper than country, race, religion, gender and class – if they had a sense of that, it would be harder to kill.”

Now Doblin is frustrated by federal agencies (such as the DEA) that delay testing drugs that could help veterans dealing with the psychological wounds of combat.

“They’re putting the drug war over the health of the veterans,” he said. Officials argue that you don’t give drugs to people who have a high incidence of drug abuse, he said, but the reason they abuse drugs is because of the PTSD, and if you can treat that they have less reason for doing drugs at all.

“And it’s not about giving it to them for the rest of their lives,” he said, “but two or three times in a controlled setting with a therapist present.”
"That's the profound power of MDMA when used in a therapeutic setting," he added.
Sometimes it seems as though one has to cross the line just to figger out where it is

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loCAtek
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by loCAtek »

I'm skeptical. I've tried X, granted in non-therapeutic settings, but I didn't find it life-changing.

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Gob
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Gob »

I didn't find it life changing either Lo.

But as you say, we were not using it as an adjunct to therapy, and were probably nowhere near on the pure form of the drug.

I do know that nights with a partner when both on good E, ( or X to you) can make for amazing interpersonal experiences.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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loCAtek
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by loCAtek »

Interesting...

That's what many folks say, including my brother (he's a big fan of X). Once, when I told him I'd taken my hit and went for a walk in the woods alone, his first response was to exclaim,
"You took it alone!?"

I didn't think/know it was supposed to be some kind of social drug.
It's what you make of it, I suppose.

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Gob
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Gob »

It's always been a social drug, from it's first clinical use in couples therapy, to the mass raves of the late 80's early 90's, it's been the love drug.
Ecstasy has an interesting history. Most people associate the drug with the rave scene, yet, in the US, where the drug enjoyed legal status for several years before being criminalised in the mid-80s, it was used in counselling sessions by psychotherapists and by spiritual practitioners who claimed it heightened the experience of meditation.

Today the drug, despite its reputation amongst users as promoting feelings of love and oneness, is the subject of much heated, often ill-informed debate about its harmfulness. This is fuelled every so often when someone dies from allegedly taking ecstasy.

Fortunately, in the last few years, scientists in the US have been channelling their research efforts into the short and long term health effects of ecstasy. Their results tell a different story about the drug - it's not as bad for us as we've been led to believe. However, there are risks associated with its use. Worse, these are aggravated by prohibition.

http://www.abc.net.au/quantum/poison/ec ... cstasy.htm
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

Jarlaxle
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Jarlaxle »

loCAtek wrote:Interesting...

That's what many folks say, including my brother (he's a big fan of X). Once, when I told him I'd taken my hit and went for a walk in the woods alone, his first response was to exclaim,
"You took it alone!?"

I didn't think/know it was supposed to be some kind of social drug.
It's what you make of it, I suppose.
I wonder if he was worried you might have a bad reaction to your first use of it...?

(Not that this will surprise most people here, I've never used it.)
Treat Gaza like Carthage.

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Rick
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Rick »

Me either...
Sometimes it seems as though one has to cross the line just to figger out where it is

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Gob
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Gob »

You can't get decent pills for love nor money these days...
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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loCAtek
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by loCAtek »

Jarlaxle wrote:
I wonder if he was worried you might have a bad reaction to your first use of it...?

(Not that this will surprise most people here, I've never used it.)
Nope, wasn't my first use. Juss not a socializer, prior. The drug didn't make me so.
Juss made me drugged at the time...

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Gob
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Gob »

In what way?
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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loCAtek
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by loCAtek »

I got high LOL.


BTW I'd taken it at a club before too, maybe it was inferior as you say, but I was just stimulated to be able to stay awake all night.

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Gob
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Gob »

Can you describe the experience, and E high is different to an amphetamine/ketamine/LSD/cocaine etc high.

What is sold as E these days is normally some amphetamine derivative.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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loCAtek
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by loCAtek »

Hmmm, this was along time ago...

The club night was a trip with friends, up to the city to go a rave. We bought some E (we thought) as soon as we got there. I felt 'high'; very awake and couldn't sit still for hours. If I wasn't dancing I was walking around looking at the light show, watching the trails. In the city, the raves are pretty much open secrets held in old warehouses so, in my wandering, I started wondering what was outside. Well, that's when I discovered the crowd control security all around the building. Being very friendly that night, I walked right up to the nearest guy and asked him what were they doing? He forthrightly answered me that they were to keep guests from walking away and getting into trouble LOL. Back in the warehouse, where I had thought everything was really cool because of my buzz; I got a clue about what this place was really like when I overheard a couple grumbling about leaving. They were clear-headed because they had declined any drugs, and they had come just to see what the fuss was all about.

Quite plainly the man announced his verdict, "This party sucks!"

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Gob
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Gob »

Sounds about right, you probably had some weak or adulterated E. If you didn't feel the need to dance all nigh in the centre of the floor, to be in with people, to chat about anything and everything, to hug and to hold, it was probably an E + amphetamine mix.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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dales
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by dales »

MDMA should be used if it works to aid the theraputic process.

End of story!

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
rubato

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Gob
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Re: MDMA for PTSD

Post by Gob »

Agreed.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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