And so it begins...

[liberty]

Older a hater, what load of bullshit. Anyone that thinks older is a hater hasn’t been paying attention. He is one of the most decent guys on this board.

[Scooter]

No one called oldr a hater; oldr felt that hatred was being directed at him. Before presuming to lecture anyone else about paying attention, you might try reading what has been posted before responding to it.

[liberty]

For the record let me say I know that is not Christian, but I can’t help myself, I hate bullies and thugs. I don’t care if they are right wing, left wing or no wing and I don’t care if their victims are right wing, left wing, gay, straight, Islamic or whatever. Anyone that puts their hands on someone else deserves to get shot.

And if I am sitting in the jury I am going to have sympathy for the person that was attacked not for the thug that took the bullet.

[BoSoxGal]

No, in fact, most assaults can be successfully thwarted by bystanders or police without resorting to extreme deadly force.

And no, assault is not automatically punishable by death even at the felony level, not especially sans due process under presumption of innocence.

Please, let's stop toying with fascist statements.

Words matter, and in times like these we ought not be promoting violence of any kind. Violence of any kind should always be considered highly regrettable by civilized people.

[liberty]

Sorry I can’t agree with you; a bully deserves what he gets. As Reacher said, you reap what you sow. And that is not fascist; fascist is the belief one has the right to rule other people. All one has to do to stay healthy is leave others people alone. If for example a woman kills an attempted rapist, I don’t have a problem with it.

Also, gun shots are not always fatal.

[MajGenl.Meade]

So it begins.....

Liberal lefties rioting in the streets to protest a democratic election

A petition flying around seeking to persuade the Electoral College to void the result and install the loser

I voted (spit) for her but the election is done. Give over, lefties and see what happens. Maybe it's worth a riot in future but all I see now is a bunch of screaming losers pissed off because they expected to win.

Other than the polite non-rioting people here, natch.

[Guinevere]

You're welcome to sit on your hands and focus your efforts on making another place better, but I live here in America, and I'm not gonna let her get driven into the crapper by a lying narcissist. There is much work to do, and if it starts with protests (protests are not riots - you might want to learn something about the first amendment) that's perfectly fine with me.

[Guinevere]

And bullfuckingshit wes and oldr, you've already proved that you don't give a crap with your votes.

Such hatred toward me.
I wonder why?
because of my throw away vote?
Because I don't align to your beliefs?
Because I made a joke that you took the worng way?
I have no animosity toward you.
May you have peace of heart and mind regardless of what you think of me.

Interesting interpretation. I don't hate, that's not who I am. But I have no problem pointing out hypocrisy. You can't care about the rights of the LBGQT community, or about women, and vote for Trump at the same time. Actions do indeed speak louder than words..

Calling any vote a throwaway vote shows an utter lack of understanding of the importance of voting, and dishonors the memory of everyone who has fought for the right to vote, especially those who have fought for the right to vote for those who weren't white male property owners. It's also condescending in the extreme.

You voted for Trump, you own him.

[Joe Guy]

The media portrayed Trump supporters as dumbass redneck racists that hang out at Walmart parking lots. In interviews that I saw on the news shows they always chose people who weren't good at expressing themselves. The Hillary supporters I saw interviewed were always thoughtful and of course, representing many races and the youth of today.

I believe the typical Trump supporters were not people that are normally involved or interested in politics until it's time to elect a president. They saw in Trump someone who was promising to shake up things in Washington and looked like he could get things done. They believed a vote for Hillary would only continue things as usual until something better comes along.

It's not right to assume that everyone who voted for Trump did so because they are racist misogynistic gun toters. The majority of them were people who were fed up with nothing getting accomplished by our elected representatives. To them a vote for Trump was worth the risk.

A person can support Trump and not be against women and gay rights. I know that because I know some of them. Whether or not you think they made a stupid choice doesn't matter to them.

We can complain about Trump now but it would be much more productive to find a candidate for the next election that isn't hated by half of the country. Is that possible?

[BoSoxGal]

Please try to understand that to a great many of us, it is NEVER worth the risk to elect an open bigot to the highest office in the land, where he is now ensconcing in the most influential positions of power in the White House an avowed KKK-sympathizer, race-baiter, misogynist. A bigot who has a running mate who would criminalize gay people and destroy women's rights to control their own bodies.

Why is it that WE are supposed to just accept that (allegedly) many of the people who voted Trump don't agree with his core beliefs, while THEY aren't apparently willing to accept or try to understand our belief that basic human rights should always trump "I'm pissed off at D.C."?!

Not to mention that honestly, if these people had been doing anything like due diligence in educating themselves about their candidate, they should have been able to figure out that what is now happening is exactly what would happen - that Trump would draw heavily on right-wing Republican establishment types to fill his administration, the very people who have obstructed getting work done in D.C. for the past 8 years, thus totally undermining what they SAY they voted for him to achieve.

Why is it that it's so difficult to understand why many of us thus DON'T BELIEVE the Trump voters who say, "oh NOT ME! I'm not racist!"

[Joe Guy]

Why is it that WE are supposed to just accept that (allegedly) many of the people who voted Trump don't agree with his core beliefs, while THEY aren't apparently willing to accept or try to understand our belief that basic human rights should always trump "I'm pissed off at D.C."?!

You don't have to accept it but I believe it's true. I also believe that the majority of voters don't give a lot of thought to the voting process. They just vote or not vote depending on whether or not it's convenient because they don't really think their vote matters.

How else can you explain Donald Trump?

[Big RR]

BSG--it never helps to tar all people with the same brush. Maybe I'm wrong, but I do not think a majority of Americans (or even a significant minority) are KKK supporters/race baiters or misogynists, not do I think there are many who would criminalize gay behavior. and while I do think there are some who reject the right to choose, I think it is a distinct minority.

Which leads us to why so many voted for Trump; I do think for many it was the pissed off at Washington team, and while I agree Trump will do little to appease them, if there's one thing this election shows, it is that they are not going to go away. Face it Trump is nothing special--he's an arrogant jerk who can't control his own behavior and constantly sticks his foot in his mouth--and he wasn't surrounded by electoral geniuses (nor did he listen to the ones who may have been part of team Trump). But with all these deficits, he won the election, and I think his victory shows that we have to reach out to these people, not distance ourselves from them. The working class and labor votes were solidly democratic for decades, and they have to be courted again.

So believe their motives or don't believe them, but try and reach out for the common ground we do have to reach some sort of accord. Either that or we'll be facing more of the same in the future.

It would be great to take all the blue states and form our own country, but that's not going to happen. So like it or not, we'll have to deal with these people for years to come.

[Bicycle Bill]

The media portrayed Trump supporters as dumbass redneck racists that hang out at Walmart parking lots. In interviews that I saw on the news shows they always chose people who weren't good at expressing themselves. The Hillary supporters I saw interviewed were always thoughtful and of course, representing many races and the youth of today.

I believe the typical Trump supporters were not people that are normally involved or interested in politics until it's time to elect a president. They saw in Trump someone who was promising to shake up things in Washington and looked like he could get things done. They believed a vote for Hillary would only continue things as usual until something better comes along.

It's not right to assume that everyone who voted for Trump did so because they are racist misogynistic gun toters. The majority of them were people who were fed up with nothing getting accomplished by our elected representatives. To them a vote for Trump was worth the risk.

A person can support Trump and not be against women and gay rights. I know that because I know some of them. Whether or not you think they made a stupid choice doesn't matter to them.

OK, so they're not all racist misogynistic anti-gay gun-loving yokels.  But by your own admission they don't pay attention to politics; they are easily swayed by rhetoric, not reason, and are willing to vote for whichever talking head it was that said the things they wanted to hear — just like they used to believe that Santa Claus would bring them a new bike or a pony — regardless of whether it could ever happen or not.

We can complain about Trump now but it would be much more productive to find a candidate for the next election that isn't hated by half of the country. Is that possible?

The way things are now, you could nominate Jesus Christ Almighty for president of the US and half the country would still hate Him.  Which half would depend on whether He had a 'D' or an 'R' after His name on the ballot.

-"BB"-

[BoSoxGal]

Actually the Bigot-in-Chief's voter base is going to be the minority of the population in 30-40 years, so I don't think appeasement is the answer.

I think fighting like hell, being mad as hell, speaking up EVERY time someone engages in racist, misogynist, xenophobic, homophobic, transphobic, etc. speech or actions is the only appropriate response of a concerned citizen going forward.

I don't want to understand people who can choose to put their economic self-interests ahead of the basic human rights/civil rights of their fellow citizens. It's unacceptable to me and (thank goodness) to the majority of Americans.

When Trump's SS starts dragging dissidents away to disappear them, I'll be among the first to go. A fate I'll be proud as hell to have achieved, if it comes to that.

I'm sure I seem melodramatic to you. I hope someday you'll all be able to tease me and say what I drama queen I was about the election of Trump. I would never be happier to have been proven wrong.

But as I've said before - I'm descended from Nazis and Nazi sympathizers, and I feel it is my sacred obligation to sound the alarm loudly and ceaselessly when fascism rears its ugly head - and it just got invited into the White House in the form of Chump and Bannon, et al.

[oldr_n_wsr]

I said this months before the election to watch out for the blue collar shrinking middle class voter (BCSMCV). The one that you call names and claim s ignorant that if only he/she would see the light they could never vote for Trump. Those people who see every special interest get boo kooo play onmedia and it's usually to the percieved detriment of the BCSMCV. Before the election, if someone asked who he/she was voting for, they would not repond or walk away quickly becuase they were either called names for voting for trump or made to feel less than by those "enlightened elites".
And then he/she quietly went into the booth and pulled the Trump lever and probably said nothing of Hillary in an exit poll.
Calling the average plumber/construction worker/alligator hunter/truck driver/etc names only makes them more determined and probably less vocal.

You think if Hillary won there would be these kinds of protests all over the place? Maybe in a few spots but I would guess far less than what we are seeing now against Trump.

Try protesting things that might get some positive attention that you can really make a difference for. Trump is the president, protest what he does as president, unless he does soething you might agree with.

Business as usual (sometimes worse) in DC caused Trump. The Dems putting up the flawed candidate in Hillary caused this. The Repubs anointing Jeb before anything even happened and never having a viable candidate against trump caused this. Trumpforced his way tot he repub nomination and DC business as usual kdid not know what to do as Trump was not business as usual.
People were tired of business as usual and this is the result. Any other analysis IMO over analyzes the reason for the Trump win.

[Big RR]

Appeasement? By no means? But we do have common ground with some of those marginally in that camp and I think they can be reached unless we drive them away. I understand your position, but politics is the art of the possible, and we must reach out to reach accords, or there will be more of these idiots, only maybe the next one will be a lot more adept at getting his/her way. this is our country, and we must continue to fight to get it back; and in that fight we need all people of good will. Fascism appeals more to the marginalized, which makes it even more important not to marginalize large groups of people. Calling them names and pointing fingers of blame solves nothing, and just pushes more into the other side for good.

[MajGenl.Meade]

You're welcome to sit on your hands and focus your efforts on making another place better, but I live here in America, and I'm not gonna let her get driven into the crapper by a lying narcissist. There is much work to do, and if it starts with protests (protests are not riots - you might want to learn something about the first amendment) that's perfectly fine with me.

ROTFL - protests are not riots. Of course they are not. Riots are riots and people and police are being attacked by anti-democratic factions protesting the result of a democratic election. It's the left feeding the anti-police killers a hefty dose of support.

You're not going to let "her" be driven into the crapper..... what the heck does that mean? She's been cast onto the rubbish heap of history by a democratic election that you all thought (I did too) was a shoo-in for the lady liar.

I deserve better insults. I am a US citizen, resident in the USA, owning property in the USA and paying taxes in the USA. My temporary sojourn in SA is what it is. I am horrified that Trump has been elected but I'll tell you what - people like me are getting sick of the unending demands for entitlements by the undeserving left. I just wasn't angry enough to vote for the awful as opposed to the not quite so awful. But I'm beginning to get that way as I see what "democracy" means to the hands-out rabble

[Guinevere]

"Her" meaning my country, meaning Lady Liberty, not HRC.

No one is asking for handouts. But we want to make damn sure immigrants like you can own property, become citizens, vote, and not live in fear because of the color of their skin, the country of their origin, or the religion they practice.

I am not advocating and have not advocated turning over the election results, ignoring the Electoral College. The Constitution means too much to me for that; that path leads to anarchy. But as I said before I will fight with every fiber of my being to protect that Constitution and the liberties it guarantees.

[Jarlaxle]

Bullshit.

[Econoline]

No one is asking for handouts. But we want to make damn sure immigrants like you can own property, become citizens, vote, and not live in fear because of the color of their skin, the country of their origin, or the religion they practice.

Not just immigrants like Meade, either: also immigrants who are not white northern-European Christians, immigrants who are penniless refugees, immigrants who never lived in their "native" country long enough to learn the language and the culture there, and immigrants who don't have a fast-track to citizenship because they came from Cuba or married a U.S. citizen. (Maybe even--dare I say it?--immigrants who are tired, poor, yearning to breathe free, wretched refuse, homeless, or tempest-tost? )

The way things are now, you could nominate Jesus Christ Almighty for president of the US and half the country would still hate Him. Which half would depend on whether He had a 'D' or an 'R' after His name on the ballot.

Amen.