. . since the Farsi Island incident, in which Iranian military temporarily delayed some US craft trying to find Bahrain. Obviously there are still some reasonable questions (even if I don't buy them) about the actions of the Iranians under international law. But we still do not know how they ended up in Farsi Island waters.
Last I heard a couple of weeks ago the report was with the Chief of Naval Operations for his review. The longer he delays releasing the report, the more I will believe it to be a story of ineptitude all down the line.
I know sailors get lost, and one bit of lumpy seawater looks much like another. But I would like to know what happened.
It's almost three months . . .
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ex-khobar Andy
- Posts: 5805
- Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2015 4:16 am
- Location: Louisville KY as of July 2018
Re: It's almost three months . . .
they hacked the navigation system and the sailors, unknowingly, drove right to them.
that seems to be the obvious explanation.
scary.
someone should glance at the compass occasionally, eh?
that seems to be the obvious explanation.
scary.
someone should glance at the compass occasionally, eh?
It's almost three months . . .
Hmmm... I think there's more to this than meets the eye.
I'm almost positive that it was due to sunspots. (The one circled below.) I could be wrong, however.
I'm almost positive that it was due to sunspots. (The one circled below.) I could be wrong, however.
“In a world whose absurdity appears to be so impenetrable, we simply must reach a greater degree of understanding among us, a greater sincerity.”
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Bicycle Bill
- Posts: 9796
- Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:10 pm
- Location: Living in a suburb of Berkeley on the Prairie along with my Yellow Rose of Texas
Re: It's almost three months . . .
You, sir, have been watching too many James Bond movies.... in this case, "Tomorrow Never Dies".wesw wrote:they hacked the navigation system and the sailors, unknowingly, drove right to them.
-"BB"-
Yes, I suppose I could agree with you ... but then we'd both be wrong, wouldn't we?
Re: It's almost three months . . .
What do you do with a drunken sailor
What do you do with a drunken sailor
What do you do with a drunken sailor
adrift In the Gulf of Araby.
yrs,
rubato
What do you do with a drunken sailor
What do you do with a drunken sailor
adrift In the Gulf of Araby.
yrs,
rubato
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datsunaholic
- Posts: 2673
- Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:53 am
- Location: The Wet Coast
Re: It's almost three months . . .
I think it's more a case of PPP (Piss Poor Planning).
The stories I've read unfortunately are all colored with bias, but some of the "facts" that came out earlier, some of which may be disputed are as such:
1) Of the 3 RCBs in Kuwait, only ONE was operational, and they cannibalized one of the broken to fix the other. Meaning they likely had no spare parts and a boat already with issues.
2) There were 10 crew, 5 per boat, which is actually small for that type of boat.
3) They set out late due to comm systems problems.
4) They were supposed to rendezvous with USCGC Monotony to refuel, midway through the trip. The Navy RCB has a nominal 240 nmi range at 20 kts. That's fairly close to the distance from Kuwait to Bahrain, but worse if...
5) The boats took a course EAST of Farsi Island according to some reports. That itself makes absolutely no sense. Farsi Island is smack dab in the middle of the Persian Gulf. Kuwait and Bahrain are both on the WEST side of the gulf. Common sense would be to hug the WEST side of the gulf, which is a more or less friendly Saudi Arabia, not go down the East side between Iranian controlled Farsi Island and the Iranian Mainland.
6) One of the boats suffered another mechanical casualty, which has been disputed, but has also been widely reported.
So, the boats were late for their planned refueling stop and had stopped to attempt (successfully) to repair the engine (if they were successful, I would think it was probably a clogged fuel filter, which would allow it to run at reduced speed. Fuel in the Middle East is crap, BTW). They then got swarmed by Iranian patrol boats and per ROE, they couldn't take offensive action against the Iranians. Hence the "surrender".
My thought is, operating with a relatively small crew the Engineer was also the Navigator. That's what I did when I was in NCW (Naval Coastal Warfare, 2 steps predecessor to the Coastal Riverine Force these boats are part of). When the engineering casualty happened, likely the engineers of BOTH boats were working the problem, and no one else was paying attention to the charts. They got too close to Farsi Island and didn't notice because they'd lost situational awareness in focusing on one problem.
Or, the OIC made the dumb move going east of Farsi island, then when they needed to rendezvous with the Monomoy they bee-lined it, going right through Iranian territorial water, which would fit the "Navigation Error" sometimes reported as the cause.
The PPP part comes in doing the transit with sketchy equipment, having a planned route anywhere NEAR Farsi island (rather than 30 miles WEST of it, hugging the Saudi coast), with a refuelling stop near the island to boot.
The stories I've read unfortunately are all colored with bias, but some of the "facts" that came out earlier, some of which may be disputed are as such:
1) Of the 3 RCBs in Kuwait, only ONE was operational, and they cannibalized one of the broken to fix the other. Meaning they likely had no spare parts and a boat already with issues.
2) There were 10 crew, 5 per boat, which is actually small for that type of boat.
3) They set out late due to comm systems problems.
4) They were supposed to rendezvous with USCGC Monotony to refuel, midway through the trip. The Navy RCB has a nominal 240 nmi range at 20 kts. That's fairly close to the distance from Kuwait to Bahrain, but worse if...
5) The boats took a course EAST of Farsi Island according to some reports. That itself makes absolutely no sense. Farsi Island is smack dab in the middle of the Persian Gulf. Kuwait and Bahrain are both on the WEST side of the gulf. Common sense would be to hug the WEST side of the gulf, which is a more or less friendly Saudi Arabia, not go down the East side between Iranian controlled Farsi Island and the Iranian Mainland.
6) One of the boats suffered another mechanical casualty, which has been disputed, but has also been widely reported.
So, the boats were late for their planned refueling stop and had stopped to attempt (successfully) to repair the engine (if they were successful, I would think it was probably a clogged fuel filter, which would allow it to run at reduced speed. Fuel in the Middle East is crap, BTW). They then got swarmed by Iranian patrol boats and per ROE, they couldn't take offensive action against the Iranians. Hence the "surrender".
My thought is, operating with a relatively small crew the Engineer was also the Navigator. That's what I did when I was in NCW (Naval Coastal Warfare, 2 steps predecessor to the Coastal Riverine Force these boats are part of). When the engineering casualty happened, likely the engineers of BOTH boats were working the problem, and no one else was paying attention to the charts. They got too close to Farsi Island and didn't notice because they'd lost situational awareness in focusing on one problem.
Or, the OIC made the dumb move going east of Farsi island, then when they needed to rendezvous with the Monomoy they bee-lined it, going right through Iranian territorial water, which would fit the "Navigation Error" sometimes reported as the cause.
The PPP part comes in doing the transit with sketchy equipment, having a planned route anywhere NEAR Farsi island (rather than 30 miles WEST of it, hugging the Saudi coast), with a refuelling stop near the island to boot.
Death is Nature's way of telling you to slow down.
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ex-khobar Andy
- Posts: 5805
- Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2015 4:16 am
- Location: Louisville KY as of July 2018
Re: It's almost three months . . .
I love the idea of USCGC Monotony - I suspect autocorrect had a hand in that. Monomoy of course. (Interestingly my iPad suggests Monopoly.)
And yes, if the plan was to hook up with the CG east of Farsi Island, whoever made that plan . . .
Plenty of places to refuel on the way. I'd choose Jubail. Big enough, deep water channels, navigation a doddle. And same distance from Kuwait as Farsi Island.
Do you mean that of five sailors on the ship, only one was capable of rudimentary navigation? Wow.
And yes, if the plan was to hook up with the CG east of Farsi Island, whoever made that plan . . .
Plenty of places to refuel on the way. I'd choose Jubail. Big enough, deep water channels, navigation a doddle. And same distance from Kuwait as Farsi Island.
Do you mean that of five sailors on the ship, only one was capable of rudimentary navigation? Wow.