Its eventful, even without the GOP horrorshow in the WH

[rubato]

http://thehill.com/latino/336656-puerto ... -statehood

Puerto Rico goes to the polls for statehood
By Rafael Bernal - 06/07/17 06:00 AM EDT

Puerto Rico goes to the polls for statehood


Puerto Rico’s government is banking on a push for statehood to solve the structural issues that led to its financial crisis.

Puerto Ricans will vote Sunday to decide the territory’s status.

If statehood wins, as expected, the island will enact what’s known as the Tennessee Plan, an avenue to accession by which U.S. territories send a congressional delegation to demand to be seated in Washington.

Puerto Rico will send two senators and five representatives, chosen by Gov. Ricardo Rosselló (D), later this year, once the plan is put into action.

Statehood remains a long shot as many Republicans are wary of adding a 51st state that could add two Democratic senators and seven Democratic electors to the Electoral College.

Others, noting the examples of Alaska and Hawaii, both added to the union in 1959, say it can be difficult to predict how territories will vote as states.

“Those are the same people that 60 years ago said that Hawaii was going to be a super Republican state and Alaska was going to be super Democratic, and that’s why we brought them in together,” said José Fuentes Agostini, the head of Puerto Rican Republicans in the states.

The Puerto Rican Republican Party is adamantly pro-statehood. And the national Republican Party has supported statehood since the 1940s, most clearly in its 2016 platform.

“We support the right of the United States citizens of Puerto Rico to be admitted to the Union as a fully sovereign state,” the platform stated. “Once the 2012 local vote for statehood is ratified, Congress should approve an enabling act with terms for Puerto Rico’s future admission as the 51st state of the Union.”

President Trump, who angered Puerto Ricans by decrying a potential “bailout” of their financial system on the campaign trail and as president, also indicated openness to the idea.

As a candidate, he said, “The will of the Puerto Rican people in any status referendum should be considered as Congress follows through on any desired change in status for Puerto Rico, including statehood.”

Puerto Rican voters in the states have predominantly voted for Democrats, translating to broad party support for statehood. Many also argue that Puerto Rico’s status as a territory is intrinsically linked to its economic challenges. ,,,"

Personally I am in favor of "statehood or get out".


yrs,
rubato

[Lord Jim]

As a candidate, he said, “The will of the Puerto Rican people in any status referendum should be considered as Congress follows through on any desired change in status for Puerto Rico, including statehood.”

That's way too coherent, thoughtful, and well constructed a statement for Trump himself to have ever come up with on his own ...

It must have been written by somebody else working on the campaign...

I doubt he even knows what the phrase "status referendum" means...

[ex-khobar Andy]

or this



or this

[Lord Jim]

The top one, definitely...

[Joe Guy]

[BoSoxGal]

When I was @ 10 years old I toured the UN in NYC and the session we sat in on briefly was a discussion of Puerto Rico's independence movement.

I think it would be cool if it became a state - just a bonus that it would no doubt be solid blue.

[Big RR]

As I recall, in 2012 more than 60% of the voters voted for statehood, but nothing progressed. Congress sidestepped the deal by noting that several hundred thousand voters only voted on the first ballot question (to end the commonwealth status) and did not vote on what should replace it (statehood or independence), saying another plebiscite was needed. Given that the votes for independence in PR have been historically small, this was just a weasel way to get out of making a 51st state, which would cost a lot more in revenue than it would generate in taxes and would likely be democratic (as stated in the OP). don't count on anything changing.

FWIW, I'd be happy to change my state into a commonwealth--yes, you have no representation in Congress (like DC) or vote for who is in in the executive mansion, but you pay little to no federal taxes (unless you are making a lot of money) and get many federal benefits (including US citizenship). Pretty good deal IMHO.

[Bicycle Bill]

FWIW, I'd be happy to change my state into a commonwealth--yes, you have no representation in Congress (like DC) or vote for who is in in the executive mansion, but you pay little to no federal taxes (unless you are making a lot of money) and get many federal benefits (including US citizenship). Pretty good deal IMHO.

What about states like Kentucky, Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, and Virginia that are a commonwealth, at least in name?  Seems to me they have representation in Congress and do get to vote for the POTUS, and I'm pretty sure my cousin who lives in Louisville does have to file a 1040 every spring.

-"BB"-

[Big RR]

I ma not certain if "commonwealth" has a legal definition, but regardless of what those states call themselves they are still states. PR has been (at least colloquially) termed a commonwealth since the passage of its constitution in the 1950s, but that, too, is likely not the legal term for what they are, which is a "free state" that has significant ties to the US and is subject to many of its laws (and all residents are US citizens); indeed, because of their Constitution, I believe they are the only incorporated territory of the US (but I am unsure if this is the case). most US territories are ruled as possessions with some right to local self government, but Puerto Rico's status permits much more self governance than those. It's not all that bad a deal, given the local tax structure (and the fact that residents do not pay US income tax on income earned there), and the federal benefits received.

[BoSoxGal]

FWIW, I'd be happy to change my state into a commonwealth--yes, you have no representation in Congress (like DC) or vote for who is in in the executive mansion, but you pay little to no federal taxes (unless you are making a lot of money) and get many federal benefits (including US citizenship). Pretty good deal IMHO.

I don't recall being relieved of the burden to pay federal taxes while living in D.C.?

I wouldn't want to remove myself from the burden of taxation because that hurts my fellow citizens. We should all be willing to pay in our fair share in return for the benefits of citizenship.

[ex-khobar Andy]

PER BB:

I'm pretty sure my cousin who lives in Louisville does have to file a 1040 every spring.

Yes, when I lived-in the Commonwealth of KY I filed my 1040. And we Louisville residents also had to pay city taxes like NYC. I'd love to get all that back if I was wrong to file.

As a non-citizen (green card holder) several of my acquaintances believed that I was exempt from federal tax. These were educated people and of course I put them right. But I wonder how common that misconception is.

[Big RR]

FWIW, I'd be happy to change my state into a commonwealth--yes, you have no representation in Congress (like DC) or vote for who is in in the executive mansion, but you pay little to no federal taxes (unless you are making a lot of money) and get many federal benefits (including US citizenship). Pretty good deal IMHO.

I don't recall being relieved of the burden to pay federal taxes while living in D.C.?

I wouldn't want to remove myself from the burden of taxation because that hurts my fellow citizens. We should all be willing to pay in our fair share in return for the benefits of citizenship.

So far as I know, Puerto Rico is unique in its federal taxation structure. Most US territories pay either federal tax directly, or are taxed at the federal rates by their local government which passes it through to the US federal government.

As for your last point, I kind of think of PR's status as being like an adult living in his/her parents' house rent free. It's a nice deal, but when will you grow up and assume responsibility for your own expenses?

[rubato]

So if I moved to PR could I quit paying Federal Income taxes? Not that I would.


yrs,
rubato

[Sue U]

So if I moved to PR could I quit paying Federal Income taxes? Not that I would.


yrs,
rubato

Apparently. I know a couple of attorneys who relocated to PR for the tax advantages.

[dales]

Plenty of rum for all!

[Guinevere]

So if I moved to PR could I quit paying Federal Income taxes? Not that I would.


yrs,
rubato

Apparently. I know a couple of attorneys who relocated to PR for the tax advantages.

It's the First Circuit (where I am already admitted). I'm going later this month. If I love it, it may go on my list for retirement/pre-retirement.

[rubato]

I did a quick check and homes are cheap compared to here and look quite nice on Zillow. Acc. to wiki. non-US based income is not taxed but would that apply to investment income from US companies?: Schwab, Fidelity, Voya, Merrill &c. Can I just move those accounts to PR offices of the same companies?

I'm guessing that pension and SS income would be taxed. This is an exercise since I don't like tropical climates or places with an excess of biting stinging insects.

yrs,
rubato

[dales]

I don't like tropical climates or places with an excess of biting stinging insects.

yrs,
rubato

I take it you've given the bee colonies the old heave ho?

[Big RR]

I did a quick check and homes are cheap compared to here and look quite nice on Zillow. Acc. to wiki. non-US based income is not taxed but would that apply to investment income from US companies?: Schwab, Fidelity, Voya, Merrill &c. Can I just move those accounts to PR offices of the same companies?

I'm guessing that pension and SS income would be taxed. This is an exercise since I don't like tropical climates or places with an excess of biting stinging insects.

yrs,
rubato

One of my wife's relatives (who was born in PR) lives there enough months per year to establish residency, which exempts his social security from federal taxation; not sure about pensions.

One thing you do have to watch out for is that the PR income tax is steeply progressive and salaries down there are much lower than here; someone earning what might be seen as a modest salary here might be subject to more taxation under the PR tax system (especially with all the fiscal problems).

And Guin, if you lived there you might not be able to get moved into the local federal district court (and I'm not sure whether the appellate courts hold sessions in PR) on a pro hac basis and would have to join the local bar (as many states require), which would mean that you'd need to learn Spanish and PR's mash up of common and civil law legal system. That could be tough, even tougher than getting admitted in Louisiana.

[Scooter]

So far as I know, Puerto Rico is unique in its federal taxation structure. Most US territories pay either federal tax directly, or are taxed at the federal rates by their local government which passes it through to the US federal government.

You are correct that PR's tax structure is unique, but that is because most other territories have much broader exemptions from individual federal income tax. The exception is American Samoa, where individuals are treated pretty much like U.S. residents for federal income tax. As for the others:

USVI has an income tax system that “mirrors” the U.S. Code. In 1921, Congress enacted a statute that made the Code part of the internal law of USVI. Thus, the income tax laws of the United States are generally adopted by USVI, incorporated into the USVI tax code, and where appropriate, the term “Virgin Islands” is substituted for “United States.” This is commonly referred to as a “mirror system” of taxation...

Under the mirror Code, USVI individuals are taxable on their worldwide income. A USVI resident must pay tax on his or her worldwide income and file a tax return with the USVI government as a bona fide USVI resident for the entire taxable year. A foreign tax credit is allowed for income taxes paid to the United States, foreign countries, and other possessions of the United States....

The Tax Reform Act of 1986 (the “1986 Act”) made significant modifications to the mirror system for individuals
and provided that if an individual is a U.S. citizen or alien residing in the United States or USVI, only one tax is computed under the Code. If an individual is a bona fide resident of USVI, such tax is payable to USVI and no U.S. tax is imposed.

Under the Organic Act of 1950, Guam employs a mirror system of taxation. The rules for coordination of U.S. and Guam income taxes are found in section 935. This section was repealed by the 1986 Act, however, the 1986 Act changes apply only if there is an implementation agreement in effect between Guam and the United States. The United States and
Guam executed a tax implementation agreement in 1989 that was supposed to enter into force on January, 1 1991. However, such agreement was amended in December of 1990 and the effective date was postponed indefinitely. Thus, without an implementation agreement, pre-1986 law is still in effect and section 935 is still applicable to Guamanian residents.

Under section 935, an individual resident of the United States or Guam is required to file only one tax return with respect to their income tax liability. In general, U.S. residents file only with the United States, Guamamian residents file only with Guam, and those individuals subject to Guamanian or U.S. income tax who are not residents of either Guam or the United States generally file with the United States. Bona fide residence is determined based on the entire taxable year, as opposed to the close of the taxable year, and joint filers file based on the spouse who has the greater adjusted gross income for the taxable year. In addition, with respect to taxation of U.S. and Guamanian citizens and resident individuals, the United States is treated as part of Guam for purposes of Guamanian taxation and Guam is treated as part of the United States for purposes of U.S. taxation. The United States generally covers over to the Guamanian Treasury certain taxes collected from individuals on Guamanian source income and withholding tax on U.S. Federal personnel employed or stationed in Guam. Similarly, Guam covers over to the U.S. Treasury certain taxes collected from individuals on U.S. source income.

CNMI’s tax system consists of the same tax laws that apply to Guam. Thus, the filing rules for CNMI are the same as for Guam, including the single filing rule under section 935. Like other U.S. possessions, bona fide residency is determined based on a two-part test that requires an individual to be present in the U.S. possession for at least 183 days in the taxable year, while precluding such individual from having a tax home outside CNMI or having a closer connection to the United States or a foreign country. The major difference between the tax structure of CNMI and Guam is that CNMI taxpayers may claim a nonrefundable credit against their CNMI tax liability with respect to CNMI source income. Rebate rates can range from 50 to 90 percent.