Hit dis hand - c'mon, hit dis hand!

[MajGenl.Meade]

And he doesn't need to hear it from me, (obviously he won't listen to me)....or from Strop, or from Joe, or from CP, or from Sean or from Meade....(Though Meade keeps changing jerseys; it's difficult to tell which side he's on... )

Might I suggest that if he "doesn't need to hear it from me", the first sensible step is to stop banging on about it?

I ain't on any "side" except that of Rodney Dangerfield who said "Can't we all just take my wife and get along?"

Let me try to explain it again. It's one thing to respond to rubato (or me or anyone) to say "That's not right". That's fair game and I don't think it's right for anyone to complain if that happens in "their" thread.

The main problem (as I see it and as I think TPFK sees it but I don't speak for her), is the continual shit-piling that goes on afterward even when he's saying nothing in response.

Perhaps it's considered that I was part of the trouble in the Bette thread by saying his post was loathesome - altho' I gave the reason - it was indeed a thoroughly dishonest representation of everything that others had (helpfully I thought) posted.

I'm not saying someone shouldn't be called to task when particularly offensive - but it's so much better when one does it with simple statements of fact. "You're a poo-face" isn't a fact - it's pathetic playground behaviour.

Don't you think it possible that there's a perceived dissonance between your demands that rubato be called to task for an unpleasant post and your incredulous response when anyone else dare opine that yours may be even more unpleasant?

There is no "moral equivalence" issue here. Other than in some mutual pissing-contest threads, rubato is most often quite content to put in his one offensive remark and then let others rant and rave in post after post about how evil he is.

To show what a sport I am - here I'm standing on the edge of a cliff and all you have to do is..... Or we could discuss this without histrionics, rancour and abuse

Meade

PS this thread was created solely to provide people with the orgasms that are not permitted at Le Chat House

[Sue U]

What he said.

[Lord Jim]

Like I said in the other thread, I really don't see much point in continuing this discussion, but to draw an analogy:

If you've got a bratty kid running around knocking over flowerpots, breaking dishes, scribbling on paintings, pulling people's hair and setting the cat's tail on fire no one is ever going to convince me that the best way to deal with that behavior is to ignore it and hope it will stop. Period. There's no point in anyone even trying to convince me of that. I am completely and totally unopen to such an argument; it's an absolute nonstarter.

On top of that, in this case we know for a fact that this approach does not work and has never worked.

And we also know what has made at least some improvement in the past; and that is the course of action that CP and I have been recommending...

But there doesn't appear to be much inclination among many here to do the one and only thing that has ever worked, and I accept that. (I find it unfortunate, but I accept it.)

But what I really have very little patience for is people who decide to criticize me, or anyone else who calls this guy on his crap, while never calling him on the actual crap...Or folks who, (bizarrely in my view) have somehow managed work out that there's some sort of "equivalence" between the two...

It seems to me that if you're unwilling to focus criticism on the person who alone is the cause of the problem, the very least you could do is also with hold your criticism of those who don't buy into your "ignore him and hope he stops" approach. (Which, as I and others have pointed out, has never, ever, ever succeeded.)

I'm sure that criticism is well intended, (it comes usually from folks who I like and respect) but I think they have a huge blind spot on this. And speaking for myself, this sort of criticism, well intentioned though it may be, will have absolutely zero impact on me other than that I find it irritating, entirely misplaced, and somewhat disheartening.

I'm a pretty reasonable and undogmatic person; there aren't a whole lot of things where I'm not willing to at least consider other points of view...

But this is one of them.

I've already considered those points of view; and I've rejected them because they don't correspond to the proven and observable reality, so I am no longer the slightest bit open to considering them again. Condemnation directed at those who confront this crap slinger, coming from folks who refuse to condemn the crap slinger has has zero credibility as far as I'm concerned, and consequently I assign it absolutely no validity.

If you honestly believe, (despite the evidence) that ignoring this guy's crap throwing is the best approach, fine. But as I said, it seems to me the least you can do in that case is not jump in with criticism of those who have rejected that course.

You're not going to persuade anyone by doing that; it's just irritating and exasperating. Every time I see it, it just makes me roll my eyes and shake my head.

I would really prefer to bring an end to this discussion, it's not going to go anywhere productive. If we're going to have any discussion about this at all, it ought to be focused on more people signing on to call rube on his crap, since that is the one and only thing that has ever been effective, but there doesn't appear to be much stomach for that. And since we're not having that discussion we might as well not have any discussion about this at all.

[rubato]

I appreciate the effort, Meade, but I don't believe that they are capable of honest self-evaluation or reform. The facts have been pointed out to them periodically by others too.

Like many delusional people they have arrived at a conclusion which suits them emotionally and no application of facts will ever sway them from it. I actually find it very reassuring that such emotionally and intellectually stunted people are on the opposite side on so many issues. In this case they themselves produce, in great quantities, the proof of their own behavior and simply ignore it.

Some people like the experience of, and need, hatred. And they like sharing it with others.

Thanks, anyhow.

yrs,
rubato

[Joe Guy]

Psssssst!!! rubato!

Meade wasn't defending you, you dumbshit!

[Lord Jim]

This is a classic example of how posts like the OP provide rube with cover for his behavior and support for his delusions about how he behaves here and what a victim he is. (Even though that wasn't the intention of the post; when you're dealing with someone as unscrupulous as rube, he'll seize on anything.)

A very unfortunate post. All it will accomplish is to encourage rube to continue his bad behavior. Posts like Meade's in the OP amount to a form of enabling.

It's the exact opposite of what's really needed. I can't imagine anything he could have posted that would have been less helpful.

[Lord Jim]

If any more proof was needed that rube finds this kind of stuff validating, check out his latest post in @W's thread...

He's trying to derail it again with yet another political polemic in order to make it about him...I guess after the last couple of posts he was worried that the discussion might get on topic again, and stop being about him...

It will be interesting to see if any of the folks who seem to find the time to criticize those who confront rube but never the time to criticize him, actually for once, finally call him on it...

I won't hold my breath...

[Daisy]

So ignore him or put him on ignore if you can't bring yourselves to physically do it for yourself.

It's not hard, but the constant bickering between you lot is getting on my last bloody nerve and it is putting people off coming here if it's ALL Rubato ALL THE FUCKING TIME.

[Lord Jim]

Those key strokes could have been better used chastising rube for trying to derail @W's thread again.

Now, just like Meade, you'll probably get a thank you from him for trying to defend him from "the haters"...

[Lord Jim]

BTW, I don't know what threads you've been reading, but if you look around, this board is a long way from "All Rubato All The Time"....

However if you're concerned about this, I suggest you take it up with him....

ETA:

So ignore him or put him on ignore

I had him on ignore for nearly two years. (I only commented on anything he posted when it was quoted by somebody else.)

During that time, two things happened:

He got even worse, (in part probably because he missed my attention) and some people actually began to buy into his surreal malarkey about being some kind of innocent victim who never starts a fight or hurls an unprovoked insult...

It was that second thing that convinced me to take rube off of ignore. In retrospect I view my decision to put him on ignore as a mistake since the only things that happened as a result were negative. (Of course I had no way of knowing that those would be the results when I did it.)

The one and only way to get any real positive results is to follow the course CP and I have recommended. That's what we ought to be talking about.

[Daisy]

I find many of the things that Rubato posts utterly reprehensible, occasionally I find myself agreeing with him. But when he posts a deliberately inflammatory post I do like I do with dickheads in real life. I ignore it... Starving them/him of the reaction they crave.

Can we try it as an experiment for say a month, it might ramp his twattish posts up for a while but I honestly believe that it will be better for this board if more people used the ignore feature.

[Scooter]

But there doesn't appear to be much inclination among many here to do the one and only thing that has ever worked, and I accept that. (I find it unfortunate, but I accept it.)

If I have not called him on his crap sufficiently frequently enough to satisfy you (and I admit having done so only rarely, and by no means recently), there are two reasons:

(1) I skip by most of his "contributions" so fleetingly that his assholery barely even registers. I am not suggesting that you are obligated in anyway to do the same, but only explaining why his antics rarely make it on my radar.

(2) I expended far too much energy trying to hold another poster to account for her vile behaviour, and for the most part got shit on for it by the holier-than-thou set until she went too far for even her staunchest defenders to stomach, which occupied well over a year of my posting life on Plan B. I'm simply not prepared to take up the flag on another battlefield and poison my experience here to that extent again. However I reserve the right to change my mind at any time.

That being said, rubato is an asshole, has always been an asshole, and always will be an asshole, and he deserves however much abuse other posters feel compelled to heap on him, and if there are whiners that have a problem with that, then that's too fucking bad. You can't lecture people about ignoring him out of one side of your mouth and then out of the other side complain that you are unable to ignore their response.

[Crackpot]

You're forgetting our mutual current pet project Scooter.

[Lord Jim]

You can't lecture people about ignoring him out of one side of your mouth and then out of the other side complain that you are unable to ignore their response.

That's an excellent point.

[Scooter]

You're forgetting our mutual current pet project Scooter.

That's a bug on a windshield; for me responding to that is more about my own amusement.

[Daisy]

For the most part I ignore all of the cockwaving, every so often it gets to a point where I just can't pretend it isn't happening. I am tempted to join Hen and SMF on a break from here ....

[Crackpot]

The question is why do you always complain at someone other than the source of the problem?

[Daisy]

I have pulled rubato on more than one occasion, but it's easier plaiting fog than getting him to change his stance. I thought I might appeal to the sensibilities of others just to ignore him when he's being a douchebag.

[Joe Guy]

Everyone agrees that rubato is a douchebag. The only disagreement is on how people should respond to him.

He obviously enjoys being a douchebag or he would not continue to post his douchebaggerisms. He likes his douchebaggidity status.

In the end only the douchebag really has to live with himself.

He has found his lot in life.

[rubato]

Oh no! You dislike me! What will I do? What will I do?


Of course none of them can respond on-point to anything. And they have to make shit up and pretend I said it so they can pretend to respond. So there's that.


And this is the same group whose prior achievements are mobbing and ganging up on helpless people like Quad and Locatek who actually wanted your approval, so there's that too. I know what your approval is worth.


yrs,
rubato