The girls are back!

[Jarlaxle]

Re "concealing from whiners".
There is no need to assume any violation of local ordinances to explain that some neighbours are assholes. A more rational explanation (not that one is required) is that stupid liberal anti-science neighbours (you identified them LJ) will give him all sorts of grief if they SEE a hive. Otherwise they see bees but there's no one to complain to about bees. You can only complain if you know some guy a few doors away is actually housing them. Then you can phone his house and harass him etc. etc. for no valid reason.

They probably refuse to inoculate against real threats but burden their children with thousands of epinephrine sticks and wail every time a wasp annoys their health drink sucking moments and call the critters "bees", abusing a wonderful creature that is of key importance to humans in their smug yet total scientific ignorance.

You CLEARLY are not allergic to bee venom. Some people are...my mother is, a dude I work with is (as is his wife), I might be. A sting nearly killed the dude I work for...he got TWO epis and was still in the hospital for 3 days. I'd rather live next to a METH LAB that someone releasing swarms of bees!

[Joe Guy]

City of Santa Cruz Municipal Code:

24.12.650 BEES (APIARIES).

In an R-1 District*, there may be kept on any lot no more than two hives of bees.

1. No hive shall be kept or maintained closer than twenty feet from all property lines.

2. An administrative use permit shall be required.

(Ord. 85-05 § 1 (part), 1985).

source

*R-1 District = Single-Family Residence District

Post by rubato from 6/14/2011 -

I live in Santa Cruz. The 'clothing optional' capital of the world.

[Lord Jim]

I find it interesting that with the way he has described this whole process from day one in lavish detail, he has never posted so much as one word about the process he went through to obtain a permit...

On the other hand, he did find it necessary to mention that he had to conceal the hive from "the whiners"...

I don't believe for one moment that rube followed the legally required procedure. The reason he wouldn't is because if he had, his request for a permit might have been denied, and rube has far too high a sense of arrogance and personal entitlement to allow that to happen. Rules are for "little people", not for him. He's perfectly happy to let government bureaucrats to dictate to others, but not to him.

Well, that and of course the fact that he's too cheap to pay the permit fee...

Though you'd think a fella like him would be over joyed to pay some additional money to his local government...

[Econoline]

Jarl - there's an enormous difference between maintaining and caring for a hive or two of (apparently quite contented) honeybees and "releasing swarms of bees". (Hey, good luck with your future food supply if you really do want to live in a world without honeybees. And I'm sure you'd never miss the flowers, but some of us would.)

rubato - keep up the good work. Obviously, there are a few "whiners" around here who'd be better off if only you'd concealed that hive just a little bit better...

[Lord Jim]

He's lucky he doesn't live next door to me....(of course not as lucky as I am...)

I'd have been one of the biggest whiners; I'd have whined all the way to the police precinct.

[rubato]

The house smelled like a mixture of propolis, wax and honey for a day until I took the extractor to the do-it-yourself carwash to clean it up. High pressure hot water and soap does the trick much faster than trying it at home. It gets an extra rinse at home because the carwash recycles water so its not quite hygenic for rinsing equipment used for food.

The Kehili* ginger started blooming last week so I cut a stalk and brought it in. Just one bloom scents the whole house.

yrs,
rubato

*Often called "Hawaiian Ginger" it is actually from Nepal.

[MajGenl.Meade]

You CLEARLY are not allergic to bee venom. Some people are...my mother is, a dude I work with is (as is his wife), I might be. A sting nearly killed the dude I work for...he got TWO epis and was still in the hospital for 3 days. I'd rather live next to a METH LAB that someone releasing swarms of bees!

I am not but my son (the deceased one - and that was leukemia) and my daughter both are. Each of them had epi pens. My daughter's is years out of date since she never remembers to get a new one. She's over 40 so it's up to her, not me, to organize her life. And as someone else pointed out, there are no "swarms". Besides which, you need your satire-meter renewed

[Sue U]

Well, that and of course the fact that he's too cheap to pay the permit fee...

Though you'd think a fella like him would be over joyed to pay some additional money to his local government...

There does not appear to be any fee associated with an administrative use permit under the Santa Cruz Municipal Code.

You CLEARLY are not allergic to bee venom. Some people are...my mother is, a dude I work with is (as is his wife), I might be. A sting nearly killed the dude I work for...he got TWO epis and was still in the hospital for 3 days. I'd rather live next to a METH LAB that someone releasing swarms of bees!

I am allergic to bee/wasp venom. It has been nearly 25 years since I was last stung by a bee, and that was only because I stepped directly on her while barefoot. You have to try really really hard to get stung by a honeybee. Wasps, however, can be aggressive and nasty. Even so, they're generally not interested in stinging anybody unless they are actively threatened.

[Joe Guy]

There are rules for them bee peoples in Santa Cruz.

[Lord Jim]

And as I said, if he lives in the county, bee keeping is not permitted at all unless his home is zoned "Residential Agriculture" and then a "Level 5" permit is required (which is the same permit you'd need for adding a structure to your property, which requires a hearing.)

http://www.sccoplanning.com/Portals/2/C ... eeping.pdf

[Daisy]

Jim, if anyone else on here was helping the planet along with a little beekeeping, would you be being such a pedant about permits?

[Lord Jim]

That would depend Daze...

Is this hypothetical poster also a big fan of local governments micro-managing the lives of residents when the rules they've promulgated apply to somebody else, as rube is?

[TPFKA@W]

My grandfather kept honey bees. The hives were a bit away from the house to be sure. We never got stung. They are fairly quiet until someone messes with them too much.
If I had a neighbor with bees I would demand some honey.

[Jarlaxle]

Jim, if anyone else on here was helping the planet along with a little beekeeping, would you be being such a pedant about permits?

It is not beekeeping Jim objects to...unless i miss my guess, it is HYPOCRISY!

[MajGenl.Meade]

However, LJ is complaining ad nauseam about a problem that he has invented... absent any evidence to the contrary. He assumes rubato has disobeyed the law solely because rubato has ignored LJ's demands that he prove his innocence. Can you imagine anyone refusing to prove their innocence to LJ? Or to you or to me? Da noive!

To say that a hive has been moved back, out of sight and away from the property lines, to avoid "whiners" does not indicate that the whiners have any legal ground for complaint - merely that they whine when they see something they don't understand and therefore fear. Rather like rubato and history. Setbacks are, after all, a legal requirement anyway. rubato may or may not have fulfilled his legal obligations but NONE of them is to answer to the likes of us merely to avoid the whine of "hypocrisy".

Speaking of which, those of us who uphold the law so rigorously, what speed do we drive in a 25mph zone? Or a 65mph for that matter? Thought so...

[Jarlaxle]

No, he is pointing out rube's brazen hypocrisy!

[PMS Princess]

IMHO codes/permits are put in place for safety of consumers and residents and should be enforced if you can show that it is affecting you, your family, property, etc. It is a shame when people use the court system to justify what they feel as right. I had a landlord that would call in anyone (2 block radius) that left their garbage cans out too long after pick-up even though she resided in a different city. I'm positive in those cases there were no personal/property damage from the 'said' garbage cans but the residents were still fined $150. You have to admire the energy and amount of time people put into using codes/policies to justify what they feel is right. Heck. I was in court because I mentioned a mattress tag being removed. No report, documentation, investigation or photos of the non-existent mattress. So it does happen.

[Lord Jim]

Geesus Meade, you really should have stopped with the bullseye, since it's about the only thing you got right in that post...

However, LJ is complaining ad nauseam about a problem that he has invented... absent any evidence

Bull-fucking-shit...

Now here's something completely "invented" without one shred of evidence to support it:

To say that a hive has been moved back, out of sight and away from the property lines, to avoid "whiners" does not indicate that the whiners have any legal ground for complaint - merely that they whine when they see something they don't understand and therefore fear.

So let's see...

I have a theory that says rube hid the hive from "the whiners" because he's a sneaky, arrogant, hypocritical misanthrope who couldn't be bothered to comply with legal requirements...

And you have a theory that says rube hid the hive out of some sort of desire to avoid making people "fearful"....

You've been reading this guy's stuff for years and you honestly believe your theory is solid and mine is "absent any evidence"?

And then there's this bizarre non-sequitur that I think you may have strangely mistaken for an "analogy":

Speaking of which, those of us who uphold the law so rigorously, what speed do we drive in a 25mph zone? Or a 65mph for that matter? Thought so...

If there is someone here who pontificates about the virtue of posted speed limits who then drives 90 miles an hour in a 65 mile per hour zone, then you have an analogy; otherwise not so much...


I guess I should re-post my reasoning for you, since apparently you missed it the first time:

I find it interesting that with the way he has described this whole process from day one in lavish detail, he has never posted so much as one word about the process he went through to obtain a permit...

On the other hand, he did find it necessary to mention that he had to conceal the hive from "the whiners"...

I don't believe for one moment that rube followed the legally required procedure. The reason he wouldn't is because if he had, his request for a permit might have been denied, and rube has far too high a sense of arrogance and personal entitlement to allow that to happen. Rules are for "little people", not for him. He's perfectly happy to let government bureaucrats to dictate to others, but not to him.

Well, that and of course the fact that he's too cheap to pay the permit fee...

Here's my reasoning again, since apparently you missed it the first time:

Though you'd think a fella like him would be over joyed to pay some additional money to his local government...

you're only speculating.

As are you....

The difference is that my speculation is based on his own words in the very first post he wrote about this several years ago when he talked about having to conceal the hive from "the whiners". If what he was doing was legally copacetic, why would he have to hide it? That makes no sense.

What does make sense, is that he would have to hide it in order to avoid having someone make a complaint, because he didn't have legal authorization.

So that's what my speculation is based on; a common sense deduction from his own words. I guess your speculation must be based on rube's well established record for integrity and practicing what he preaches...

And more re the hypocrisy:

I pointed this out one time, four months ago, and he didn't respond then. Since he's decided again to brag about being a scofflaw, it's perfectly legitimate to bring it up again. (When he first started talking about this, he mentioned how he had to hide the hive from "the whiners" so it's safe to assume he's ignoring the law.)

I don't see how it could be objectionable, in principle, for a democratically elected government, the expressed will of the population, to try to mitigate the negative impacts we have on each other by channeling our collective behavior.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=10919&p=138068&hili ... ed#p138068

Apparently this doesn't apply if the behavior is his...

I was prepared to drop this, (at least for now) but apparently you would prefer that this discussion go on ad nauseam. In that case, let me tell you that I'm perfectly happy to respond to anything else you have to say on the subject., and will go on (and on and on and on) discussing it with you as long as you would like.

[Gob]

Hi PMSP, nice to see you posting again!!

[BoSoxGal]

My grandfather kept honey bees. The hives were a bit away from the house to be sure. We never got stung. They are fairly quiet until someone messes with them too much.
If I had a neighbor with bees I would demand some honey.

Ditto this entire post (!), especially the last bit.

I'd happily be an accomplice to any alleged code violations for fresh honey!!

Grew up playing in yards with beehives, running around within feet of the hives and hardly saw the bees - they go to the blossoms then back to the hive, not much wandering. I never saw a swarm - not sure how common that would be from well managed hives?

eta: a lot of folks get stung, often kids running barefoot, by solitary wild honeybees which reside in ground hives. Most people stung by hive kept bees are the beekeepers, I'd wager.