British religion gets recognised at last

[Gob]

Druidry is to become the first pagan practice to be given official recognition as a religion.

The Charity Commission has accepted that druids' worship of natural spirits could be seen as religious activity.

The Druid Network's charitable status entitles it to tax breaks, but the organisation says it does not earn enough to benefit from this.

The commission says the network's work in promoting druidry as a religion is in the public interest.

The move comes thousands of years after the first druids worshipped in Britain.

Druidry was one the first known spiritual practices in Britain, and druids existed in Celtic societies elsewhere in Europe as well.

Phil Ryder, chairman of the trustees of the Druid Network told the BBC: "It's nice to have that official recognition. It's not why we applied originally.

"We applied because we were legally obliged to do so."

He said the organisation represented around 350 people who had paid £10 each for membership but referred to a BBC Inside Out investigation from 2003 which suggested that up to 10,000 people described themselves as druids.

He added: "You have to apply [for charitable status] if you're an organisation that is taking money off people because the Inland Revenue want to know what you're doing with it."

BBC religious affairs correspondent Robert Pigott says that with concern for the environment growing and the influence of mainstream faiths waning, druidry is flourishing more now than at any time since the arrival of Christianity.

Druidry's followers are not restricted to one god or creator, but worship the spirit they believe inhabits the earth and forces of nature such as thunder.

Druids also worship the spirits of places, such as mountains and rivers, with rituals focused particularly on the turning of the seasons.

After a four-year inquiry, the Charity Commission decided that druidry offered coherent practices for the worship of a supreme being, and provided a beneficial moral framework.

The decision will also mean that druidry will have the status of a genuine faith.

Referring to the tax breaks, Mr Ryder said: "For us that is a very small consideration because we don't really have that level of income to make that even an issue."

He said what was more important was that it would make administrative tasks a lot easier for the organisation.

"It does give recognition with local councils and people who provide premises and services to charities, who will only deal with registered charities," he said.

Senior druid King Arthur Pendragon, told the BBC News website the organisation had had to "jump through hoops" to meet the commission's requirements.

Although he runs his own druid order, he said the Druid Network's achievement was a celebration for all members of the faith.

He said: "We are looking at the indigenous religion of these isles - it's not a new religion but one of the oldest."

The 56-year-old added that people were becoming more interested in finding spirituality and the decision reflected this.

"I think people are looking to their roots and looking back at the secular world certain that things don't work.

"This decision shows how important our faith is. We are getting credence from a secular government about our belief structure - which not only shows it is valuable but also valued by us and others."

Mr Pendragon, of Stonehenge, said he would not be seeking charitable status for his own order - the Loyal Arthurian Warband - as it was a political wing and therefore had no need to be recognised as a charity.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11457795?print=true

[dales]

What are your plans, Gob?

[Andrew D]

Good for them.

But what's with this:

After a four-year inquiry, the Charity Commission decided that druidry offered coherent practices for the worship of a supreme being, and provided a beneficial moral framework.

Why does whether "worship[ing] a supreme being" matter at all? And if "Druidry's followers are not restricted to one god or creator," what "supreme being" is the Charity Commission even referring to?

[dales]

We have the Native American Church here in the US.

I believe they are tax exempt and use peyote in their religious services.

Are they montheistic?

I don't believe so.

[tyro]

Why does whether "worship[ing] a supreme being" matter at all? And if "Druidry's followers are not restricted to one god or creator," what "supreme being" is the Charity Commission even referring to?

Well, lets face it, if you have a “faith” then you believe in something that is worth your time to get to know and understand.

If you don’t think there is some cogent force out there that you would benefit from appeasing, then you don’t have the seeds for a religion.

Ironic I suppose, but a conviction that we are nothing more than a laboratory experiment that was put away onto a forgotten shelf, and that you worship Agar The Medium and Provider doesn’t give you a tax exempt status is some sort of rip in the fabric of common sense, well imagine how the druids feel.



Or maybe this tax exempt crappo has to go.

[loCAtek]

Good for them.

But what's with this:

After a four-year inquiry, the Charity Commission decided that druidry offered coherent practices for the worship of a supreme being, and provided a beneficial moral framework.

Why does whether "worship[ing] a supreme being" matter at all? And if "Druidry's followers are not restricted to one god or creator," what "supreme being" is the Charity Commission even referring to?

The Druid creed

The Druids believed in three circles or worlds of existence: the Circle of Infinity, which was traversed only by God; the Circle of Felicity, sometimes called Gwynvyd Bliss or Happiness, through which men had to travel after they had passed through their terrestrial lives; and the Circle of Abred, or Evil, through which humans pass in their varying states of existence.

...

Such was their awe for their Great Creator, that for many centuries the Druids refused to construct enclosed temples because they regarded it as an outrage, even sacrilege, to suggest that the Deity could be confined within any limits. Thus the vault of the sky and the depths of the forest were originally their only sanctuary, and here again is the allusion as to the dimensions of the spread of Masonry.

[Lord Jim]

What are your plans, Gob?

If they include painting yourself blue and dancing naked in the light of the full moon....

Please feel free not to post any photos or videos....

[Andrew D]

And the question being asked sails over loCAtek's head yet again ....

[loCAtek]

Hmmm, well rephrase it for me. As I understood it, the Charity Commission did not stipulate a specific supreme being, just that Druidism had one as part of it's religion; therefore I assumed you were asking what supreme being did Druids have?

[Andrew D]

Nothing in what I read in this thread gave any indication of what "supreme being" the druids have. What you quoted appears to be directly contrary to what appeared in the opening posting: "Druidry's followers are not restricted to one god or creator ...." That is irreconcilable with the assertion that the druids have a "Great Creator ... the Deity".

Perhaps that is just a matter of confusion about what, exactly, druids believe. And perhaps the druids themselves are confused about what, exactly, they believe. They'd hardly be alone.

But the important question remains: Why does it matter to the Charity Commission "that druidry offered coherent practices for the worship of a supreme being"?

What about religions that do not believe in a single supreme being? (Any supreme being is necessarily singular; if there is more than one, than no one of them can possibly be supreme.) Are they just to be left out?

[Gob]

Andrew, please cast your eye over this.

[Andrew D]

Thanks, Gob.

Paragraph 18 says:

The word religion in section 2(3)(a) includes:
1. a religion that involves belief in more than one god; and
2. a religion that does not involve a belief in a god.

And Paragraph 21 says:

To be a religion in charity law, the belief system must involve a belief in a god, a supreme being or divine or transcendental being or entity or spiritual principle which is the object or focus of the religion ("a supreme being or entity"). The belief system however must be more than a philosophy or way of life to constitute a religion.

(Footnote omitted.)

So I guess that the Charity Commission's decision "that druidry offered coherent practices for the worship of a supreme being" comports with the definition of "a supreme being or entity" as including a "spiritual principle which is the object or focus of the religion".

It would have been helpful if the article quoted in the opening posting had said that a "supreme being" can be a "spiritual principle" rather than, you know, a "being". (I think that most people would not, without further legal definition, consider the Golden Rule, although it is obviously a spiritual principle, to be a "being".)

Still, as I posted above, good for them (the druids).

(For those interested in comparative theology, there are many intriguing things in the opinion which Gob has generously found for us. I have as yet only skimmed them, but I hope to obtain a better understanding of the matters involved by a more thorough reading.)

So thank you, Gob, for directing my attention to something that makes the matter at least somewhat clear and that has the potential to expand the scope of my understanding.

[Gob]

Hey no worries, us Pagans are nice people, even if we do sacrifice the occasional virgin.

[dales]

We all have our shortcomings, Gob.

any unsued ones can be given free passage to San Francisco.

[rubato]

Still more made-up self-justifying bullshit to add to the pile.


yrs,
rubato

[Gob]

We all have our shortcomings, Gob.

Speak for yourself mate, I'm perfect.

[dales]

As are we all.