oregon allows 15 yr olds to get sex changes without consent

[Scooter]

Nah, just having fun watching the pout fests that you and lib are putting on for the rest of us tonight.

[wesw]

awww. aren t you just the most precious wittle fing....

[BoSoxGal]

wesw, there are many studies that establish that the vast majority of women choosing abortion don't regret the decision.

That being said, abortion is never an easy choice and I think the pro choice movement shouldn't focus on the lack of regret issue. I think most women have pain and regret over a terminated pregnancy even if they don't regret the choice to terminate. It's very complex.

We should work to end unwanted pregnancies. Period. In the alternative, we should establish policies that ensure an unplanned pregnancy isn't a door slamming in the face of the pregnant woman. In countries where reproduction is properly appreciated, women can support themselves, their children and get educated, etc. Democratic socialist countries, that is.

As to the OP; I assumed you knew that extensive mental health counseling is a mandatory requirement preceding any hormone therapy treatment for gender dysphoria. The protocol is well and long established; I'm sure you can Google it.


P.S. - You'll never get the best of Scooter; he's smarter and wittier than anybody else on the board (because Andrew D is no longer posting). Don't try; you look foolish.

[wesw]

that s the second time I ve been warned against looking foolish in the last two days....

don t worry about me kiddo, I don t mind.

besides I ve already gotten the better of him numerous times.....

I appreciate the kindness in your post tho....

you really think he is bright and witty? I ve seen neither from him. he sticks to syphilis and gonnorhea and mothers and tampons for his attempts at insult.
oh well, I guess he sticks to what he knows....

maybe he ll get to herpes and aids next....

amazing what some people like.....

I just like to watch the veins in his forehead pulse with rage... makes him look like a real dickhead.

eta- besides he challenged me. said that he would never ignore me.

we ll see......

[Scooter]

besides I ve already gotten the better of him numerous times.....

oh what the heck, we'll let him think so if it makes him happy, god knows he's got nothing else going for him

[wesw]

the funny part is that he isn t quite bright enough to even know it.

he must have had his head banged repeatedly...

...or maybe he has even had concussions.

headboard concussions.....

[Crackpot]

Just to be clear you have never gotten the better of Scooter. Few have. The only reason you think you're winning is because he moves his pieces off the black spaces on the board.

[Guinevere]

Abortion regret is not a thing. Repeat: Abortion regret is not a thing. A new study from Advancing New Standards in Reproductive Health shows that, contrary to anti-choice claims that women who get abortions regret the decision and spiral into depression because of it, abortion regret isn’t actually a real thing. This is from a study examining women who both got an abortion and those who wanted one and didn’t get it. Over 600 women who did get an abortion were asked, both immediately after the abortion and three years after the fact, how they feel about it. A full 95 percent reported that abortion was the right decision for them. Ninety-five percent.

These findings are not surprising to anyone who understands that women are people, but this study is nonetheless an important one. That’s because the entire 21st century anti-choice movement is based on the narrative that abortion must be banned or at least strongly restricted to protect women from themselves. Anti-choicers realized that the deep misogyny of their movement—particularly in painting the 1 in 3 women who get abortions as murderers and sluts—was hurting them. So they decided to rebrand themselves as chivalrous protectors of women , trying to protect them from “abortion regret”.

In other words, they utterly reject Dr. George Tiller’s motto “trust women”. If the modern anti-choice movement had a slogan, it would definitely be “women are not to be trusted”. Indeed, this new narrative about how they’re “protecting” women is just as misogynist as the sluts-and-murderers narrative. It rests on the assumption that women are basically children who are too stupid to make very basic decisions like when to have a baby.

Consider, for instance, this Think Progress interview with Dr. George Delgado, a sleazy character who claims he’s invented a way to reverse abortions. (He hasn’t.) His entire charade is about creating a scientific veneer for the “abortion regret” myth and his contempt for women is absolutely breathtaking. “Deep down in their hearts, they don’t want to have an abortion but they feel that it’s their only choice to resolve their situation,” he told Think Progress. “I think part of it is how we’re all hard-wired as human beings — we’re all hard-wired to protect our young and to nurture our young, and so when we go against that nature of how we’re hard-wired, then it’s very difficult for us.”

Don’t let the “us” language fool you. What he’s basically pushing here is a really ugly stereotype of women as basically walking wombs whose brains are there mostly to keep the womb running but have no higher functions than that. In the real world, women have a lot of needs and desires: Career ambitions, economic survival, educational goals, relationship issues, and yes, even the need to take care of born children. But Delgado reduces us to wombs with feet, so completely defined by this supposed instinct to bring every pregnancy to term that we don’t even care about feeding and housing our born children. (Research shows that the need to take care of actual living, breathing children is cited as a reason for 32 percent of abortions.) It’s interesting to me that the anti-choice idea of “nurturing” the young is strictly about what your body does without input from your conscious brain. The actual nurturing women do of actual children—the kind that requires thinking and making decisions—is ignored. That’s because this is a movement ideologically opposed to the idea that women are capable of rational thought, one that believes women are devoid of decision-making abilities.

This study is critical not just because it’s further evidence against this stereotype and for the pro-choice contention that women are capable of making their own decisions. It’s crucial because it’s more long-term than other studies disproving the claim of “abortion regret”. Most research has only focused on how women feel about their abortions in the immediate aftermath, such as a week later. This allowed anti-choicers to suggest that down the road, in a year or two or three, it will suddenly hit you that you are a failure as a womb-walker woman and that you’re going to plunge into depression and blah blah blah.

What researchers found instead is that abortion precedes an immediate and long-term plunge in feelings of anxiety and depression.

To be clear, both women who got and women who were denied abortions saw a drop in anxiety and depression. This isn’t surprising, as uncertainty is a big driver of anxiety. However, over both the short and long term, what is clear is that women denied abortions experience more anxiety and depression. Far from protecting women from mental health problems, then, anti-choicers are planning to stoke mental health problems in a not insignificant number of women.

Not, of course, that they care. Whether their misogyny is being framed as hostile sexism or benevolent sexism, it’s still misogyny and still rooted in the belief that women are supposed to be having babies all the time and if they aren’t doing that, they are broken and need to be controlled.

But the main takeaway is this: Abortion regret is not a thing. Whenever someone invokes it, they are lying and playing off deeply misogynist stereotypes of women being fickle, childlike, and incapable of handling even straightforward decisions. People who invoke “abortion regret” don’t care about women. They think women are too stupid to have freedom. That is not caring. That is hate.

[Guinevere]

You're correct, but 95% is hard to believe. Especially since 53% said it was a difficult decision.

I don't know, isn't there even more relief at getting past a difficult decision. I think so.

[rubato]

its open access pay to publish and accept 70% of what ever crap they receive. reviewed by 2.7 "experts" per study...since 2006

I didn t bother to check the credentials of the management or the foundation that set it up. I had seen enough to dismiss it as crap already

so shut your piehole cooter.

eta it was established as an alternative to "traditional journals" crap in other words. its all in the Wikipedia entry, genius

PLoS 1 is a respected scientific journal.


You are a pig-ignorant troll.


yrs,
rubato

[wesw]

well, it s hard to get past the flood of self posted hurrahs on gooogle, but there are plenty who would disagree with you.

[BoSoxGal]

But the main takeaway is this: Abortion regret is not a thing. Whenever someone invokes it, they are lying and playing off deeply misogynist stereotypes of women being fickle, childlike, and incapable of handling even straightforward decisions. People who invoke “abortion regret” don’t care about women. They think women are too stupid to have freedom. That is not caring. That is hate.

This is the kind of absolutist thinking from some folks in the pro-choice movement (no source, so we don't know who) that makes pro-choicers look foolish.

OF COURSE abortion regret is a thing!!!! IMHO, the only people who would believe differently are people who've never had one.

It is an entirely different thing to say "I don't regret my decision to have an abortion" v. "I don't regret my abortion".

There are numerous post-abortion support groups in existence, attended by thousands of women & men; abortion regret IS a thing. Sure, some of those groups are anti-choice based groups whose purpose is to spread propaganda and recruit more anti-choicers to protest at abortion clinics.

However, many are apolitical, with the sole purpose of providing support to people (women AND men) whose lives have been touched by abortion and who experience a myriad of emotions, including REGRET, for days, months and years afterward.

The shrill drumbeat of 'abortion regret IS NOT A THING' is just plain stupid, and damaging to the pro-choice movement.

[Beer Sponge]

wesw, I have yet to see you best Scooter on here. You engaged him in a battle of wits, yet you come off to me as lacking by half in that department. Scooter could be said to have a rapier wit, by comparison, you appear to have something more akin to a spoon.

[TPFKA@W]

You have definitely beaten Scooter in the making yourself look silly department.

[MajGenl.Meade]

wesw, word of advice. Scooter does have an incisive wit - kind of like those samurai swords that slice off your head but you don't know it until you try to nod. You will not only not beat him in a contest of wit, you'll not even come close. I might not either. The way to achieve victory over Scooter is to get him to ignore you and not by cheap insults (which, by the way, you should cease because it's rude). He's already told you that won't work.

You get ignored if you consistently and politely put forward a rational argument that homosexual acts are an offense against God but that repentance and confession are always available to all of us sinners. This should only be done in threads in which the subject is homosexuality. It should not be brought into every thread in which Scooter posts and you should not initiate it. Frankly, I think the opportunity for this strategy has passed but you never know.

[Joe Guy]

You're not truly appreciating the conversation between wesw and Scooter.

Wesw's goal is to push Scooter's buttons, which he does very well. He commands Scooter's attention and he gets it. Firmly grasping that attention, he then holds on to it and hurls crude barbs while thrusting forth innuendo and intentional juvenile remarks designed to engage Scooter at his most primal level using a humorous slant to achieve his objective.

Scooter reacts emotionally but quickly gathers his wits and responds with razor sharp precision by dissecting everything wesw writes, ultimately shredding those words into empty meaningless letters strewn about the cyber floor like a toppled house of joker cards in an empty and unsympathetic room .

Neither wesw nor Scooter are ultimately harmed by this. It feeds into their insatiable desire to impart their unique views of the world while entertaining the interest of its many wide ranging and diverse inhabitants.

That is the essence of the relationship between Scooter and wesw.

In the end, all is well here at Plan B.

[Guinevere]

How about this for a board mantra: I am not a fish, I do not snap at bait.

I know I'm no fish, I'm all lioness. I ROAR or PURR........ depending on how you pet me

[wesw]

well, I m willing to apologize and argue in a respectful way with scooter.

afterwords, if he continues to reply or speak to me in the voice of a snotty bully, I will probably continue to be an ass and have more to apologize for.

I am sorry for being an ass and possibly hurting your feelings and trying to make you angry.

wes

[wesw]

.....and just for the record. I am not aware of telling any purposeful lies here and I am not joe.

he did nail my M.O. tho......

[Scooter]

wes, I've said it before, I am all about clean slates, so absolutely let's start again.

One thing I will ask, if you think something I say is about you, or something you hold dear, just come right out and confront me about it, rather stew over it and assume that I know what the backhanded comments you make in return are referring to, because seriously easily half of the problems we have had have been about complete misunderstandings of something I have said. The other half - I enjoy being a biatch just for the fun of it. Try your best about the former, and you will see a lot less of the latter. Note that I didn't say none of the latter .