Uncle Ben's Rice...

[wesw]

....I m sorry, but the first amendment does not give you the right to shout "BOO!" at a person.

boo, is designed to frighten a person. it is an obvious infringement upon my personal safezone........

[wesw]

big rr, I ll read your whole post in a minute, but I caught the end of it already.

yeah, sometimes submission is best, for a while...

...but the ongoing point here, that resistance is futile, and that you can t win because you are too weak is just fallacy.

history is filled with examples of the underdog prevailing, I need not cite them for you, you are aware.

and this isn t Germany 1930.

we have a culture of this, if tyranny came to fore here, it would not be one man at the door with his pistol against 100 storm troopers, it would be neighborhoods uniting, the services and the police would not unite to battle the people here.

it would be a battle royal and the tyrant would not stand.

I ll cite a few for others...

... the 300 stood against the Persians

the afghans beat the russains

the Vietnamese beat us

we beat the british

dr king cashed that promissory note

Gandhi , as you mentioned

ISIS took Iraq and Syria blew up Beirut yesterday, took down a russain airliner last week

mandela, botha

eastern Europe , berlin

I don t remember how to spell the romanian rulers name, but he fell...., or rather almost fell, the rope caught his neck....

[Big RR]

wes--when you read my post I hope you'll see that I am not advocating submission but passive resistance--a policy of noncooperation and noncompliance. This is something quite different.

And yes, throughout history great armies have been beaten (or, like in Afghanistan and Vietnam, just figured it wasn't worth it), but modern warfare has upped the ante. The Afghans and NVA wouldn't have done much with just small arms--they had sophisticated artillery, some airpower, armor, and generally weapons needed for today's battlefields supplied by their allies.

[wesw]

RR, isis did pretty well for themselves by taking what they needed

if the tyrants can do it, we can do it. and who is to say that the army would not be with the people?

...I will read your post, but it deserves a good read and the rugrats are restless...

[oldr_n_wsr]

While having armed Jews in Germany pre-WWII would not have changed the overall outcome of their fate, I know I would rather have gone down fighting and I am sure a many thought that way also.

how do you explain the incredible income disparity in this country and the resulting lack of life, liberty and the pursuit if happiness that it creates?

How does someone making more money infringe on your life, liberty and pursuit of happiness?
It hasn't for me.
The government is more of an impediment to that than someone making much more money than me.

[Big RR]

RR, isis did pretty well for themselves by taking what they needed

if the tyrants can do it, we can do it. and who is to say that the army would not be with the people?

...I will read your post, but it deserves a good read and the rugrats are restless...

ISIS has allies with lots of money and oplenty of arms merchants ready to sell them what they need.

[Sue U]

sue, yoor dismissal of my views as delusional is the wrong path to take.

I take your views very seriously.

I am articulating what millions believe.

as are you.

we should not dismiss one another

You have a lot of gall, wesw. In this thread alone, you have accused me of wanting to disarm Americans in order to exterminate them; wanting to suppress free speech; being an enemy of the constitution and the republic; being an advocate for starvation and cannibalism; and demonizing and dividing people, before finally suggesting that I lack the courage to make my own country better and should move to Russia (or the Middle East or Africa or Central America) because of my views on how a society should conduct itself.

And you want me to treat you with respect? You want me to play nice?

You make claims of how you fear an imminent "race war" and "lawless anarchy" and "mobs run[ning] riot [to] burn and pillage." And when I point out there is absolutely no factual basis for this fear beyond your fevered imaginings, you claim I'm dismissing your views as delusional.

Your views are delusional, and when I challenge you to provide some actual basis for your claims, you run away or whine about how I'm mean and scary.

Here's the deal, wesw: I do not and will not give any credence to opinions that are simply pulled out of your ass (or the ass of some Fux Newz bloviator). I don't give a fuck how many millions of people believe 9/11 was an inside job or that Barack Obama is a seekrit gay communist Muslim or that Hillary Clinton killed Vince Foster or that Jade Helm is a government plot to impose martial law on Texas and send everyone to FEMA camps. I am not required to take idiocy seriously, and I will not do so. If you have something to say, at last have the courtesy of being prepared to support it.

I have been more than civil to you since your arrival here, which is a lot more than I can say for you. But maybe it's time I take the gloves off and stop holding back.

[Lord Jim]

In this thread alone, you have accused me of wanting to disarm Americans in order to exterminate them; wanting to suppress free speech; being an enemy of the constitution and the republic; being an advocate for starvation and cannibalism; and demonizing and dividing people, before finally suggesting that I lack the courage to make my own country better and should move to Russia

Yeah, but aside from that, he's been pretty polite...

[Sue U]

[wesw]

I never said imminent

you know what?

I m sure that you could damage my life greatly.

that s your choice.

you know where I stand

I ve made my points and I dare say that I have articulated things which many of you have learned from.

I know that I have learned a great deal here.

any way, I read the first lines and the last lines of your post.

it was enough.

I ll have any views that I want.

don t go after the first amendment until you get rid of the 2nd..., duh....

[oldr_n_wsr]

But maybe it's time I take the gloves off and stop holding back.

FYI
You and BigRR have been the most courteous and civil posters here. I appreciate that.

[Sue U]

you know what?

I m sure that you could damage my life greatly.

Yeah, I could have kept my mouth shut about that roast you were incinerating.

[Lord Jim]

Yeah, I could have kept my mouth shut about that roast you were incinerating.

At this point, you're probably wishing you had...

[MajGenl.Meade]

Me too!

[BoSoxGal]

oldr, it's not as simple as 'somebody making more money than me' infringes on my pursuit of happiness.

I'm talking about how our entire political system is now up for auction and the individual vote no longer means what it once did. When we have around 150 people providing the majority of the funding to the presidential candidates, we have a serious problem. That's just one example, but a much more important fact is the billions of corporate profits being shielded from proper taxation in offshore banks and tricky incorporation schemes, while millions of Americans struggle to find work or to put food on the table or keep a roof over their/their children's heads.

Any number of Republican presidents past would be shocked and dismayed by the current political climate in this country, and by the degree to which corporations and moneyed interests have come to own the makings of policy and law in this once-great nation.

We have far surpassed the Gilded Age in the degree to which a small percentage of the population holds the vast majority of the wealth (created by LABOR) and nobody disputes that the Gilded Age wasn't a good time for the average American citizen, we all learn that in school - I learned that, way back in the 70s and 80s before there even was such a thing as PC speak.

Most of you older folks (older than me is all that I mean) who tend to argue conservatively here regarding politics were nonetheless products of a time when the middle class was strong and thriving in this country - generally considered by most to be one of the best ages in American history.

Yet the middle class now is largely disappeared; 51% of Americans make less than $30k/yr., 40% make less than $20k/yr. With the cost of living and the cost of higher education, even those Americans lucky enough to be in the higher income brackets are struggling to keep up with costs and to educate their kids, just one or two paychecks from economic disaster.

The Millenials are not going to have better lives than their parents, which was the traditional measure of the American dream. Many of them are living back home with their parents, unable to find work and saddled by massive student loan debt, unable to buy homes, get married, have children, etc. The rates of death among middle-aged Americans are rising for the first time in several decades, and that rise is at odds with what is happening for similarly-aged folks in other developed nations with sound fiscal policies that put average citizens first, not corporations. Many, many Americans feel hopeless.

THAT is what I mean by the economic disparity infringing on the rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

[oldr_n_wsr]

I don't disagree with much of what you said. I also said:

The government is more of an impediment to that than someone making much more money than me.

I could go on and on but I believe that the super-rich buying politicians says more about the politicians (aka government) than the super-rich.

With corporate money overseas we have to look at why they put that money over seas. Taxes/regulations (aka government)? I'm sure they are not doing it just to keep the middle class in it's downward spiral.

Why do many IT companies find it better to import foriegn born IT workers? The gov could limit H1B visas which would force the companies to hire/keep Americans (USA-ians?). Google and and the like are not being altruistic when they side with the immigrants, they are a source of cheaper labor. Seal the borders, cut back on H1B and other work visas are things the government can do to better the Amercan workers plight. Again, if big money is buying the gov and keeping that from happening, who is really at fault?

With the cost of living and the cost of higher education,

And all we hear about is student loans and providing "free" college education. Anyone give a thought to reining in college costs? Why do they cost so much? They say they need to keep making things (dorms, rec centers, student unions, etc) new and fresh so they can attract students meanwhile they consistently have to turn applicants away.

The Millenials are not going to have better lives than their parents,

I'm a boomer and don't have a better life than my parents, but I do think that my daughter (a millenial) is on her way to a better life than me. Only time will tell. In four short years since graduating she has paid off her student loans AND just purchased a house all on her own. of course dad gets to fix it up for her, which I am more than happy to do

Yes, it is sad that money talks and bull$%it walks, but who does it reflect worse on? The payer (the rich and the corporations) or the payee (our elected leaders)?

[BoSoxGal]

Your daughter's experience isn't the norm by far, oldr - the statistics are out there. And didn't you provide for some of her education?

And where would she be if she lost her job tomorrow and couldn't find another?

Yes, college costs are a problem that should be addressed - but we should also invest in educating our young people like other successful developed nations do. And providing paid leave for new parents to incentivize reproduction amongst the educated population. And providing single payer healthcare. Etc.

I do think it says something about rich people who buy politicians and use their undue influence to better their own situation without regard to average citizens. Eye of the needle, camel, etc. Rich folks who disregard the plight of the poor and less fortunate truly disgust me, more than just about anything else.

eta: Corporate welfare far exceeds welfare provided to assist the poor.

[dales]

Tell me how it is not diseased for this culture to tolerate a mass shooting every day and 1500 gun homicides every month because of a belief in the fantasy that "guns make us safe." This country is sick. Ask anyone who's not from the U.S.

I personally knew someone from Denmark, we used to go to the shooting range together.

He was more than delighted to own personal firearms.

If you think this "country is sick" that is an opinion and NOT a fact.

But keep on yapping away, it weakens your case and does nothing to influence anyone here.

[Sue U]

So you're okay with a mass shooting every day and 1500 gun homicides a month? That's a perfectly fine price for America to pay so that you and your pal can be "delighted"? You think that's a healthy balance?

[wesw]

so you are ok with gangs running our inner cities and the cartels running our southern border? there s your mass shootings....

eta- oh the cartels and gangs are in small cities and towns too.

do you have a gun sue?