Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

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Lord Jim
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Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by Lord Jim »

Was shooting a rare gorilla the only option for Cincinnati Zoo?

(CNN)Zookeepers shot and killed a rare gorilla after a 3-year-old boy slipped into its enclosure at the Cincinnati Zoo, triggering an outcry over how the situation was handled.

Footage shot by a witness shows Harambe, the 17-year-old male gorilla, standing near the boy, who went under a rail, through wires and over a moat wall to get into the enclosure, according to the zoo. The footage later shows Harambe dragging the child through the water as the clamor of the crowd grows louder and increasingly panicked.

Zookeepers then shot the 450-pound western lowland gorilla with a rifle, rather than tranquilizing him.

"Tranquilizers do not take effect for several minutes, and the child was in imminent danger. On top of that, the impact from the dart could agitate the animal and cause the situation to get much worse," Thane Maynard, director of the Cincinnati Zoo & Botanical Garden, said in a statement released Sunday.

"We are heartbroken about losing Harambe, but a child's life was in danger and a quick decision had to be made."

The boy, who has not been identified, was taken to Children's Hospital and released later Saturday evening. The family is not granting interviews at this time, but released the following statement through a public relations firm:

"We are so thankful to the Lord that our child is safe. He is home and doing just fine. We extend our heartfelt thanks for the quick action by the Cincinnati Zoo staff. We know that this was a very difficult decision for them, and that they are grieving the loss of their gorilla. We hope that you will respect our privacy at this time."

However, the boy's brief encounter with the gorilla set off an uproar on the Internet. The zookeeper's decision to shoot Harambe has been called into question over whether death was the only option.


A vigil was held for Harambe outside the zoo Monday, and nine people showed up.

Questions over lethal shot

Western lowland gorillas are critically endangered in the wild, numbering fewer than 175,000, according to the zoo. An additional 765 gorillas dwell in zoos worldwide.

The family had been visiting the zoo on Saturday when the boy slipped away and entered the enclosure. Some are blaming the boy's mother for failing to look after her son.

Kimberley Ann Perkins O'Connor, who captured part of the incident on her phone, told CNN she overheard the boy joking to his mother about going into the water.

Others have even suggested the boy's parents should be held criminally responsible for the incident. An online petition seeking "Justice for Harambe" has earned more than 100,000 signatures. The petition states: "This beautiful gorilla lost his life because the boy's parents did not keep a closer watch on the child."

In response to questions on whether charges might be brought against the boy's parents, Lieutenant Stephen Saunders, the public information officer for Cincinnati Police says he is "not aware of any intention to charge the mother" or "the parents" at this time.

Saunders says county prosecutors will be involved in making a decision about possible charges.
Others said the zoo was too quick to take the decision to shoot Harambe. Ian Redmond, chairman of The Gorilla Organization, said zookeepers had other options besides a fatal shot.[I wonder if he would have felt that way if it had been his kid...]
"When gorilla or other apes have things they shouldn't have, keepers will negotiate with them, bring food, their favorite treats, pineapple or some kind of fruit that they don't know and negotiate with them," he told CNN.

"I don't know if that was tried or people thought there was too much danger but it does seem very unfortunate that a lethal shot was required," he said.

Animal expert Jeff Corwin told CNN that tranquilizers may have taken too long.

"It can take, in some situations, depending on what the medication is, it can take upward to 10 to 15 minutes. It may take multiple shots."


Many reiterated that a human life was at stake -- especially that of a child -- and that's more important than that of a gorilla.

Cellphone video filmed by a zoo-going member of the public, O'Connor, showed the terrifying events unfold as the child's mother could be heard saying, "Mommy's right here."

At first, it looked like Harambe was trying to help the boy, O'Connor told CNN. The gorilla stood him up and pulled up his pants.

However, as the crowd's clamors grew, Harambe tossed the boy into a corner of the moat before standing over him, O'Connor said.

The crowd's cries appeared to agitate Harambe anew, O'Connor said, and the video shows him grabbing the boy by the foot. He dragged him through the water and out of the moat atop the habitat,
O'Connor said.

Moments later, Harambe was shot and put down.

Although it was the first incident of its kind at Cincinnati Zoo's Gorilla World exhibit since it opened in 1978, similar dramatic cases have occurred -- but with very different outcomes.

In 1986, a five-year-old boy named Levan Merritt tumbled into the gorilla enclosure at Jersey Zoo in the UK. Video filmed by a bystander showed Levan lying on the ground, bleeding from the head and unconscious.
In the footage Jambo, a male gorilla, is seen approaching the boy and appears to check on him, extending a hand to stroke his back. When Merritt comes to, wailing, Jambo, seemingly startled by the cries, sets off in a different direction. Zookeepers immediately move in to save the boy.

A decade later, a three-year-old boy fell nearly 20 feet into the gorilla enclosure at the Brookfield Zoo in Chicago.
This time, a female gorilla named Binti Jua picked up the unconscious boy, while carrying her own infant on her back, and guarded him from other gorillas. In an incredible show of maternal care, Binti took him right to a door so that zookeepers could retrieve him.
http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/30/us/gorilla-shot-harambe/

While it seems to me there's plenty of blame to go around for this tragedy, (the parents should have kept a closer eye on the kid; but it should not have been possible for a small child to get through the exhibit barrier) I'm not going to second guess the shooting decision.

When you watch the video, there are parts where the animal is not acting in a threatening way, but others where the child clearly could be injured, and the zoo officials are the ones in the best position to know what this animal was capable of. With the life of a small child at risk, you have to be be safe rather than sorry.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by liberty »

A gorilla it dead and a child is alive and that is the way it should be; however, I am sure there are those out there who would prefer that the animal should live even if the child had to die. And the parents should not have to pay for the lose of the gorilla because we live in a society where parents are afraid that if they punish their children they will lose them. If children can’t be punished one has to expect unruly children. If this was my child he would have a butt he would not be able to sit on for awhile. When I was a child, I never disobeyed my mother because I knew there would be painful consequences if I did.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

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Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo

Post by RayThom »

From many witnesses accounts the boy appeared to be showing some intellectual development disabilities. So much so that the mother was merely humoring the boy when he threatened to jump into the pit to play with the 500 pound gorilla.

Had the mother been more involved this incident would not have happened. I'm betting Cincinnati CPS has been notified and, if found negligent, the parents should be held responsible for the necessary killing of Harambe.

Jack Hanna, Director Emeritus of the Columbus Zoo, called it a good shoot.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by Guinevere »

Bad decisionmaking all around. A sad day indeed.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by oldr_n_wsr »

I need a score card for the "blame game" on this one.
In the end, I expect the zoo to be out of some money along with not having the gorilla.

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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by liberty »

I hope that this brat as he grows up appreciates what was done for him and I also hope he is not treated as a hero. He is not a hero but a brat that should have obeyed his mother and still should be standing in the corner.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by Long Run »

Tragic, and I agree that it is impossible to second guess the zoo workers' on the spot/instant decision. But the exhibit design, parents, etc. are all fair targets for criticism.

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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

The way some people (not here) are carrying on, it's as if the Zoo Director woke up in the morning, loaded his rifle and pondered which animal it was he'd get to kill today.

There are so many experts all over the USA who know precisely how the gorilla would have acted - why, he'd have given the child a warm toddy, a nice towel and then boosted him up to the top of the moat wall. He only dragged the child through the moat, which is only water so that's all right. Absolutely never would that kind gorilla have dragged him feet first over concrete or a tree or something - no way!

But the zoo is in trouble all right. The child "climbed" over a three foot wall (I read today), then through some small shrubs and then toppled over the edge into the moat. A 3 foot wall? Really? I'm hoping that's wrong but.....
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo

Post by MGMcAnick »

RayThom wrote: if found negligent, the parents should be held responsible for the necessary killing of Harambe.
The father was not present at the zoo. He's only responsible because of not having used a condom.

A witness on this evening's news said that she tried to grab the boy as he went through (I think it was under, rather than over) the 3' barrier.

Those who think the mother was negligent have never tried to ride herd on a group of small children. I understand there were several in her care. Had it NOT been her own son who got away, there would really be hell to pay.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

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If you can't manage all your brood of kids in a public place that inherently poses dangers, you need to bring another adult - or not go! Yes, choosing to breed four 'mini-me's means SACRIFICE. You can't do everything people with one or two kids do, not responsibly - unless your sperm donor participates in parenting, or you bring a friend, sister, mother, etc. on public outings like the zoo!

While I totally understand that the zoo must think from a liability standpoint in today's climate and that tranquilizing would not immediately neutralize the threat to the child so they had to kill him, it's still beyond sad that a beautiful endangered creature going into the prime of its breeding life was destroyed due to the stupidity and negligence of cockroach humans.

eta: And despite having no children of my own, I HAVE run herd on a group of kids in a public place, multiple times - responsibly, with other adults present. I've done it with my stepkids & their friends, I've done it with nieces & nephews & their playdates, I've done it as a licensed daycare employee. It CAN be done, and IS done, by parents all the time! Stop making apologies or excuses for shitty distracted incompetent parents and/or childminders!
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

it's still beyond sad that a beautiful endangered creature going into the prime of its breeding life was destroyed due to the stupidity and negligence of cockroach humans.
While I have some sympathy (particularly with the first part), it's humans who put animals in zoos in the first place. Apparently there are many who think that shouldn't happen.

Of course, venal humans will probably kill them out in the wild unless they are protected - look at rhinos for example.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

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MajGenl.Meade wrote:Of course, venal humans will probably kill them out in the wild unless they are protected - look at rhinos for example.
And the tigers, and the elephants, and the whales, and the wolves, and the eagles, and the bison, and the dodo, and the passenger pigeon, and the ......  I could go on, but it's just too depressing.
And even when they *ARE* protected, it still sometimes isn't enough — remember Cecil the lion and the Great White Dentist from Minnesota?
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by Lord Jim »

If you can't manage all your brood of kids in a public place that inherently poses dangers, you need to bring another adult
From what I've seen of this, apparently it was a group of small children, (I haven't seen anything on exactly how many) and two adults... (not that that is any kind of an excuse; I too have been in that situation, and I know it's a cat herding task, but you have to provide full attention at all times.)

BSG:

I may be interpreting this incorrectly, (I certainly hope that I am) but the whole tone of your post suggests to me that if it were not for concern about "liability" you may believe that the appropriate course of action here would have been to use a tranquilizer dart and risk the life of the "cockroach human" child in order to save the "beautiful endangered creature". In other words, that it would have been morally acceptable to risk the life of the child in order to save the life of the gorilla.

I really hope I've got the wrong end of the stick on that... :?
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by Bicycle Bill »

Lord Jim (to BSG) wrote:I may be interpreting this wrong (I certainly hope that I am) but the whole tone of your post suggests to me that if it were not for concern about "liability" you may believe that the appropriate course of action here would have been to use a tranquilizer dart and risk the life of the "cockroach human" child in order to save "beautiful endangered creature". In other words, that it would have been morally acceptable to risk the life of the child in order to save the life of the gorilla.
Well, there aren't that many lowland gorillas left, but we seem to be up to our earlobes in kids ;) ; and as Bill Cosby once said (back when we still agreed that he was funny):
"I brought you into this world and I'll take you out.  And it don't make no difference to me 'cause I'll make another one looks just like you." :mrgreen:
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by Joe Guy »

They should have brought in an animal psychologist to observe and possibly communicate with the gorilla prior to making a decision on how to deal with the situation. The gorilla may have been upset at the parents for what happened and was trying to tell them they're lucky he wasn't a hungry lion. It's possible he was talking to the child, in his own compassionate gorilla way, to say, "Everything is going to be okay, little boy. You're safe with me."

The gorilla might have been thinking back to when he was a little guy and humans saved him from the wild and he wanted to return the favor to those who helped him. He may have learned when he was young to not be quick to judge anyone and act recklessly. Had he lived, he might have gone on to do great things.

But that wasn't meant to be. A human's first instinct is to kill at the first sign of potential danger to one of their own without considering the possible intent of other species. Human's are quick to assume.

Humans are cruel. I don't want to be one anymore...

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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by oldr_n_wsr »

Humans are cruel. I don't want to be one anymore...
I hear there is an opening at a zoo for a gorilla. :nana

That gorilla could have popped the kids head like a zit. While I am sad the gorilla had to die, the choice was correct IMHO.

I also heard that the family issued a statement thanking the zoo personel for saving the kid and that the public should not donate any money to them, to instead donate to the zoo.
it was a group of small children
Body harness with leashes. Of course someone would have something to say about that too.

This whole thing is a no win situation for all, especially the gorilla.
:(

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Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by RayThom »

They should have called in the Gorilla Whisperer. (1-800-HOO-HOOO)

I'm sure she would have arrived at the zoo by now.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

I'd rather rely on this lady. Amanda O'Donoughue (on Facebook) speaks of her experience working with mountain gorillas in her twenties and notes that zoo workers are careful never to enter the cage when the animal is there. She makes what appear to be sensible points.
I have watched this video over again, and with the silverback's posturing, and tight lips, it's pretty much the stuff of any keeper's nightmares, and I have had MANY while working with them. This job is not for the complacent. Gorillas are kind, curious, and sometimes silly, but they are also very large, very strong animals. I always brought my OCD to work with me. checking and rechecking locks to make sure the animals under my care and I remained separated before entering to clean.
I keep hearing that the Gorilla was trying to protect the boy. I do not find this to be true. Harambe reaches for the boys hands and arms, but only to position the child better for his own displaying purposes.

Males do very elaborate displays when highly agitated, slamming and dragging things about. Typically they would drag large branches, barrels and heavy weighted balls around to make as much noise as possible. Not in an effort to hurt anyone or anything (usually) but just to intimidate. It was clear to me that he was reacting to the screams coming from the gathering crowd.

Harambe was most likely not going to separate himself from that child without seriously hurting him first (again due to mere size and strength, not malicious intent) Why didn't they use treats? well, they attempted to call them off exhibit (which animals hate), the females in the group came in, but Harambe did not. What better treat for a captive animal than a real live kid!

They didn't use Tranquilizers for a few reasons, A. Harambe would've taken too long to become immobilized, and could have really injured the child in the process as the drugs used may not work quickly enough depending on the stress of the situation and the dose B. Harambe would've have drowned in the moat if immobilized in the water, and possibly fallen on the boy trapping him and drowning him as well.
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Re: Sad Day At The Cinci Zoo...

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I have confidence the zoo acted properly given the situation presented.

Would I be as sad as I am about Harambe's death if the kid cracked skull and died falling into the moat, or was accidentally killed by the gorilla upon first contact, thus negating necessity to destroy the gorilla?

No; there are 100,000 western lowland gorillas left on the planet, millions upon millions of Homo sapiens offspring with completely inept adult care taking. Gorillas take better care of their precious offspring!

eta: If that mothers cell phone was used at all while inside the zoo with four children, she should be prosecuted for felony child endangerment. There is no way she should have been doing ANYTHING but supervising kids in close proximity to zoo animals! $100 says she was texting, etc. :arg
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